Did Zaino Blow it??

Scottwax said:
They don't put a lot of thought into their ingredients? How do you know this?
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Whether you admit it or not many companies obviously just rebottle cheap stuff and many other companies produce large bats of cheap ingredients so detailers can get a cheap product so they can make money. There's only a few of us detailers who have switched to boutique brands, for the most part detailers use 5 gallon or 0ne gallon sized prolines. Most detailers are express detailers where quality is second to time and money. They have to detail 100 cars a day between 5 or so employess whereas some of us detailers get to thoroughly do one to three or 4 cars a day. Those companies are not evil or anything like that, but they are like Coscto, sell a lot for little profit as opposed for selling a little for high profit. maybe I'm the sucker for liking the "high" quality products. I just got tired of wiping that cheap stuff on my customers and said that I'm going to do some R&D and find products that I like better. I have spent 100's of dollars and it's been my experience that some of these boutique brands got something special going.



I can say that it has been my experience that the companies who don't concentrate on making cheap 5 gallon sizes tend to have a better product. Lets take AIO as an example, yes I know they make a big size but it's not cheap and not typical of a proline. But it's my opinion that it works better than any onestep that any proline puts out. Is the difference big? Not really, but I have a discriminating eye and I prefer the companies who obviously put more effort into their formulas. I like product lines that develop over time as opposed to product lines that are born overnight. Hey I rebottled this companies cheap stuff and I think I'll name it rated 10 detailing products and charge 4 times as much and get people who dont know any better to promote it by giving away free stuff, sounds like a plan? I'd be rich. Are you really saying there isn't a difference between cheap product lines and boutique? How can you justify the brands you always promote then, just like throwing your money away? It's cool Scott I'm not trying to argu but I'm not understanding your tone or your defense of product lines. First you jump down my stuff because ten sites say Optimum has silicone, then you say that silicone isn't a big deal with your BTW thingy. I didn't bring Optimum into this conversation and din't make any big deal about silicone until you got defensive. Maybe we should both take a chill pill, but especially you, lol.
 
"I have enough simple logic to figure out which people don't know what they're talking about. Congratulations! You made the list!"



What are you talking about?



I never expressed an opinion about a product or what it may or may not contain. Go back and read my comments.
 
markthom said:
"I have enough simple logic to figure out which people don't know what they're talking about. Congratulations! You made the list!"



What are you talking about?



I never expressed an opinion about a product or what it may or may not contain. Go back and read my comments.
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From what I can tell he's been banned and you wont get a response.
 
Well, i use Z8 on my rims, and i got 400, and some change, miles before i reapplied, it was still beading.



I also use Z8-or DP's SSS on my windshields, and the Z8 never wears off, it always beads, for eternity. It doesnt even start to show any signs of needing to be re applied either. Tight small beads at 8+ weeks with no sweat.



I also have used it on occasion on my hood after polishing for the night, just a squirt of Z8 and it was ok till next week.



Im not really sure why i use Z2pro actually, except that i have it lol.



Im in love with the stuff in case anyone couldnt tell :)
 
You apply Z8 on your rims with nothing else? Does it seem to prevent brake dust buildup in any way? My car model is notorious for excessive brake dust (and the notoriety is justified :( ) if it repels brake dust and lasts that long I will give it a shot. Right now I'm using a combo of pb's wheel sealant and michilens brake dust repellent, but both are running low.
 
Jeez, people get bent out of shape for products that do not make them any money. I could understand this whole thing going on if the people would be the manufacturers of the products discussed. I hope ZaneO did not get banned, because that would be pretty bad too.



Back to Z8. I ll try putting it on my windshield and see how long it lasts.



And regarding the silicones discussion, Some years back, about 7 to be exact, (before I heared about the good stuff) I was using Turtle wax on my uncles White Passat, and when the car went in for a repaint, the only thing I remember was that the guy who painted it complained about the yellowing and build up of the wax. I do not remember the paint having any imperfections after it was painted so I guess that did not matter.
 
Burlyq said:
Are you really saying there isn't a difference between cheap product lines and boutique? How can you justify the brands you always promote then, just like throwing your money away? It's cool Scott I'm not trying to argu but I'm not understanding your tone or your defense of product lines.
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You did not mention the cheap bulk lines, "Let's agree that some car care product companies". I was just pointing out that most companies do put some thought into what they use, at the bare minimum at least enough to make sure they don't harm anyone's paint. Your blanket statement about oils and solvents is pretty unfair since their are quality oils (like in Souveran) that add depth and glow, and even paint has solvent carriers.





First you jump down my stuff because ten sites say Optimum has silicone
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And I apologized. I was unaware other sites where not using Optimum's product description copy.



then you say that silicone isn't a big deal with your BTW thingy. I didn't bring Optimum into this conversation and din't make any big deal about silicone until you got defensive. Maybe we should both take a chill pill, but especially you, lol.
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You seem to make a huge deal about not using products with silicone, fine. No one will make you but don't make blanket statements that infer all silicones are bad and you can never properly repaint a car that has had products with silicone applied because it simply isn't true. Any decent shop is going to prep the car properly. They have to prep Zaino'd cars to because obviously, paint won't adhere to it either.



What I don't understand is why when talking about Zaino you seem to put other products down. Not by name, just in general with comments about oils, solvents and silicones. Zaino can stand on its own merits, other products need not be mentioned at all. I don't think anyone here doubts Zaino is a high quality product. Is it my favorite? No but it has more to do with having to buy and add a catalyst than anything else. I prefer to grab and go and I think other product lines, at least in appearance, are equal to or better than Zaino. When it comes to durability, nothing else matches Zaino that I have tried. If you stuck to saying Zaino outlasts anything else you've used and looks better, than that is IMO the best way to compare and constrast other products and Zaino.



The reason I brought OCW into the discussion is that it is also a spray product that has excellent protection. You mention how well Z8, which is meant as a QD protects, while OCW is meant as a stand alone LSP but with the same ease of use. I think it is a direction that other manufacturers will be mimicking. I know of one other product that is working on a spray version of their sealant to further improve ease of use. My point is that products like Z8 and OCW will spur other companies along those lines too and that is good for us, either as detailing professionals or detailing enthusiasts.



I hope this clears the air and you understand where I am coming from. BTW, that sample of Glare you sent me-applied in March on a single stage black Lexus LX470-still beads and has noticable slickness!
 
StoicDude said:
Jeez, people get bent out of shape for products that do not make them any money. I could understand this whole thing going on if the people would be the manufacturers of the products discussed. I hope ZaneO did not get banned, because that would be pretty bad too.
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Personal attacks are not tollerated... please read the rules if you need clairification. Zane is taking a few days off.
 
Part of this discussion is about 'polymers' and 'silicone' in the ingredients of a wax/sealant.



From my understanding the two expressions can be interchanged as the most common 'polymer' used is 'silicone' polymers.



Its true that some silicones cause mischief in certain applications, but most used in waxes/sealants are safe and beneficial.



The websites containing the OCW description are probably correct, as is the OCW site.
 
Burlyq said:
Did those boys over at Zaino out think themselves?? I had this lady, a referel yeah, waste my time and wanted an express detail. She wouldn't budge and didn't want to go along with the program so instead of wasting the trip I did an express detail. No clay, just wash and drumroll Z-8. The car was squeeky clean after the wash. Anyhow, that was about three weeks ago and I sw the car again today, she works with the people who refered her to me and who I see all the time. To make a long story short, the surface of the car was still butta smooth and glossy, not deep and wet as Pro but still very nice. So anyhow, do you think Zaino is blowing it making a product that works so good with good results and durabilty, when their traditional polishes are what made them famous? Z8 is the fastfood of detailing products, it's umm so good and fast but in the long run does your car need some more nutrition, or can we live on Z8 alone as a lsp? :hm
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Well, I wouldn't think Zaino would have blown it if it means people end up using Z-8 on their cars more. That stuff is $20 for 16 ounces. And I suspect it wouldn't spread nearly as thinly as their polishes, being that it's a QD, and that you apply it with a towel, not an applicator. So if you use 1-2 ounces of Z-8 on a car instead of 1/2 an ounce of Z2, then that would spell "cha-ching" for Zaino. :)



As an aside, you already seem to be saying it doesn't look as good as Z2 Pro, and 3 weeks hardly sets any durability records. So it sounds like even from your original post that it's not going to be replacing any full details for most people.



Why does this question feel like a set-up? Like you aren't actually looking for any kind of answer to it?
 
WOW!!!!!



Optimum Spray Wax is an excellent quik wax from my short testing of this product.



Z8, IMO, is the optimum Z polish topper on the market. Z8 produces the best of both worlds when used along with Z2-PRO. Zaino's famous clarity, crispness and gloss with the depth and wetness of the finest carnuabas. All in a easy and economical package that also extends the life of the underlying Z2-PRO.



Z8 as an LSP is not recommend by Sal and was tested for such function during development.

It is also nice to know that Z8 may work in a bind from the statements of several members as a temporal LSP. :xyxthumbs





The silicone argument is very mute. Many products contain this wonderful gloss enhancing product and cause nil effects on automotive paints.



Just my 2 cents. :)
 
Aurora40 said:
Why does this question feel like a set-up? Like you aren't actually looking for any kind of answer to it?
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If you know and love Burly (as we do here), you will know he loves to just stir the pot. ;) :bigups
 
Pontman43 said:
WOW, 5 pages in 2 days! Thats a lot of responses on a simple subject. :D
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The word "Zaino" attracts the harsh critics and hardcore devotees like no other single word in the detailing industry :grinno:
 
Shiny Lil Detlr said:
The word "Zaino" attracts the harsh critics and hardcore devotees like no other single word in the detailing industry :grinno:
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I'd say "NXT" is a very close 2nd!



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Edwin-so you'd recommend Z8 as an LSP only as a temporary fix? Seems like if you finished all the polishing step and just had maybe 10-15 minutes of daylight left, you can go with Z8 and then apply a more permanent LSP a week or two down the road.



That might be a good solution for our shorter days as winter approaches....
 
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