Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

[estcstm3]

very cool discussion all around. Love the mid life career change. Something i have been thinking about alot. Why Kamazaize Miyabi, ISM and then overcoat? Why not just one of them? You clearly like to detail your car alot, why not just the overcoat if thats where the pop is coming from? Just trying to understand coatings and the need for different "layers" still coming from the wax/sealant era. I have a truck that gets driveway parked here in florida so humid, hot and rainy. Would like to offer up better protection. Thanks!

 

[BudgetPlan1]

Why Kamazaize Miyabi, ISM and then overcoat? Why not just one of them?

It`s claimed greater longevity using the combo of Miyabi as base, ISM on top. Miyabi a harder coating with sharp type of gloss that turns softer and deeper with ISM on top. Overcoat just used to maintain entertaining water behavior, keep the gloss up (I guess) and because it makes drying so much quicker/easier.

So I guess the combo works for me because it looks good to me, seems to so far hold up well for my needs and location and, well, it`s just plain fun. Easy to use so not too much stress goes into application anymore. A few other intangibles go into it, but that`s pretty much the basics.

I like 22ple HPC too and will use that as well for much the same reasons as Kamikaze, but with our dark and metallic cars, Kamikaze lends a bit more depth and character to the finish, in my eyes. Probably imperceptible to others, maybe an illusion to me, but still `something`.

You clearly like to detail your car alot,

To be honest, I like clean cars but don`t really like cleaning cars, hence the search for something that would help remedy that. Then I kinda got hooked on coatings as entertainment, had an easily accessible selection of test vehicles that I could see/watch perform most every day and got a little carried away. Oops.

 

[GearHead_1]

To be honest, I like clean cars but don`t really like cleaning cars, hence the search for something that would help remedy that. Then I kinda got hooked on coatings as entertainment, had an easily accessible selection of test vehicles that I could see/watch perform most every day and got a little carried away. Oops.

I really like to detail my vehicles but I’ve gotten to the point that I don’t like to have to detail vehicles. I know that sounds odd and maybe what it means is that if I have to do it, they really need it and are too dirty. I like to have a vacant morning and walk outside and think, I’ll just freshin’ this up as opposed to that thing’s so dirty I won’t be seen in it. Winter automatically puts the vehicles in the latter position. Must be getting old.

 

[jrock645]

I really like to detail my vehicles but I’ve gotten to the point that I don’t like to have to detail vehicles. I know that sounds odd and maybe what it means is that if I have to do it, they really need it and are too dirty. I like to have a vacant morning and walk outside and think, I’ll just freshin’ this up as opposed to that thing’s so dirty I won’t be seen in it. Winter automatically puts the vehicles in the latter position. Must be getting old.

Its a time factor for me. My job now really sucks up free time in a lot of cases. I like to detail but don’t have as much time as I used to. The car being coated makes it a lot easier to keep up with.

 

[BudgetPlan1]

I really like to detail my vehicles but I’ve gotten to the point that I don’t like to have to detail vehicles. I know that sounds odd and maybe what it means is that if I have to do it, they really need it and are too dirty. I like to have a vacant morning and walk outside and think, I’ll just freshin’ this up as opposed to that thing’s so dirty I won’t be seen in it. Winter automatically puts the vehicles in the latter position. Must be getting old.

I hear ya on that. The whole coating thing began to get a little obsessive as opposed to enjoyable, a quest almost. It kinda came to light when I was doing the Nanoloex Si3SD which, although I had kinda read enough to determine that it was average at best with regards to performance, was mostly done because 1) I hadda order from UK ("I`m gonna try this no matter what, you can`t stop me") and 2) I was mostly interested in the quirky application process. Glad I got to experience it but it was a silly reason to do it, made no practical sense whatsoever.

Wanna kinda get back to doing vehicles that I enjoy doing, either for the sake of a really neat paint color or vehicles I can do over the course of a week or so, enjoying the process as much as the results. I like dark metallic reds and blues and black is always fun, especially when it`s totally beat up. I`ll still muck about with occasional new coatings that interest me (I see CarPro will soon be releasing a new version of Cquartz UK, will give that a go at some point) but I`m hoping the need to try as many coatings as I have just for the sake of trying them is a thing that is slowly subsiding.

I`ve done enough with 22ple and Kamikaze that applying them is now almost akin to using a wax or sealant as far as ease of application goes, may as well stick with what I know works and what I work with well. Have many people at work and in neighborhood who would like their cars done so that`ll hopefully be enough for me to stay in the game this Spring/Summer but won`t be providing totally no charge stuff anymore just for the opportunity to try a new product; they`ll have to pony up for the materials cost of the coating now `cuz me paying for everything just to get experience is, uh...fiscally irresponsible to myself. No regrets on what I`ve done so far, well worth the cost of admission for the knowledge gained but I hope I`ll be getting back to doing it for fun as opposed to doing it just to check another product off the list.

Then again, I`ve said that before...

 

[Ancient_1]

I am now doing a little testing of my own mostly of the 2nd coat and use two different for the 1st coat. On the car there are seven different combinations and some with different times between coats. I just finished it up two weeks ago and did the 1st wash Sunday.

One thing that surprised me was after the final buff after application the slickest feeling was CSL and from what I have read that it would of been Gliss or Skin.

 

[BudgetPlan1]

very cool discussion all around. Love the mid life career change. Something i have been thinking about alot.

If you have the chance to do it, I highly recommend it. After 25 years in the IT/Technology arena, mostly in a large corporate environment, it was actually a welcome change when the axe fell. Originally starting at small legal publishing company in Cleveland, OH (1988) were were bought out a few times (West Publishing in mid 1990`s, then Thomson International in early 2000, then merge with Reuters in 2005 or so) until eventually they off-shored our little Cleveland office (150 employees) in 2010; was a relief actually as each corporate move/buyout/merge made things more ridiculous as far as procedure trumping results. Eventually getting things done was like trying to swim in a pool full of peanut butter. "The metrics say this software development should take 110 hrs" although reality was less than half of that....although pointless meetings usually filled the other `half`. Just got too boring.

Ironically, although the first 4 months or so at pool company was delightful, riding around in a van for 10-12hrs a day, cleaning high end pools at very nice homes, eventually I got sucked into office. Did get to be certified as a lifeguard at 48 years old and spend a winter at an indoor facility life-guarding, which was something I never thought I`d get a chance to do, so that was fun.

Obviously the money at a pool company not as good as corporate-land but I don`t need much. Better to be entertained at work than to merely endure it.

 

[BudgetPlan1]

I happened to walk by the identical vehicles I applied Kamikaze Miyabi/ISM and Syncro to this morning. Both were applied within a week or 2 of each other, both have been driving around in the rain (all day yesterday, for the most part) and both ended up sitting next to each other after they came back `home` last night.


The Kamikaze, while not having the radical bead behavior of Syncro, stayed cleaner overall. Notice the leading edge of the hood streaking on the Syncro vehicle, absent for the most part on the Kamikaze vehicle. Beads are still more entertaining to play with on Syncro though...

Kamikaze:

Syncro:

 

[BudgetPlan1]

Quick Update on the newest vehicles/products. Been a pretty crummy April, lotsa winter swill/salt/brine/etc.

Vehicles have been out and about in it to the tune of around 3500 miles each, no washing except for occasional rain showers (had some nice rain last week/weekend)

Newest products/applications: Gyeon Syncro, Kamikaze Miyabi/ISM/Infinity Wax/Overcoat, Nanolex Si3D/SiFinish and Feynlab Ceramic + Topcoat

Best beading:
1. Gyeon - still the most entertaining bead behavior I have seen - large beads that are fun to move around horizontal surfaces with air blast. Takes very little motivation to move them.
2. Feynalb - Not as fun as Gyeon, bit some fairly midsized beads that move around nicely given air/driving motivation
3. Kamikaze - Smallish beads, typical of Kamikaze, move around as well as Feynlab, just smaller beads
4. Nanolex - Nice beads, medium sized, about the same as Feynlab, take a bit more motivation to push around horizontal surfaces

Slickness:
1. Gyeon
2. Feynlab
3. Kamikaze
4. Nanolex

Gloss not really in any particular order because a few have a different type of gloss
Gyeon: Very glossy, kinda like Mohs on steroids. Decent depth, a `classy` look that does not necessarily have the `candy` look to it
Kamikaze: As is typical considering the combination of things/products, the deepest, most complex look. Again, very classy look, mixture of hard gloss, that is subdued a bit into a more wax-like, wet glow
Nanolex: Nice gloss, not as sharp or intense as the others but a very nice look...not very candy-ish...just plain shiny.
Feynlab: The most brilliant gloss of any coating I have used, nearly sealant like in it`s appearance. Could definitely pick it out with no problem when all vehicles next to each other. If you like a sharp, hard, retina-burning gloss, this is the product for you. It is particularly bright on the Ford Victory Red paint.

Self Cleaning:
1. Kamikaze
2. Gyeon - Maybe 10% less than Kamikaze but still quite exceptional
3. Feynalb - Maybe 15% less than Kamikaze, still quite a decent product in this respect, just a very small margin below Syncro, maybe not even 5%
4. Nanolex - About 25% below Kamikaze. Kinda in the range of most coatings I have tried

The Gyeon Syncro is definitely proving to be a very, very nice choice/product. It`s self cleaning, gloss and water behavior far exceed Mohs alone although I wonder if the Skin topcoat is a slight bit more prone to marring than Mohs alone or Mohs + Booster or CanCoat. I did 2 layers of Mohs, topped with Skin and then skipped the Cure application as i figr`d it might be less slick than Skin alone. Gyeon instructions mention Cure application as optional.

The Feynlab Ceramic + TopCoat (perhaps their version of Gyeon Skin/Booster or CarPro Gliss) is a very, very nice combo, especially if your looking for the most `brilliant` gloss you can find. Some researching it has found that some describe it as the closest coating you can get to the Zaino look. Whether that`s a good or bad thing is for you to decide. Aside from the chemical odor during application. When I used Ceramic last year by itself, it was not very good at self cleaning and water behavior but the Topcoat component fixes this issue...and then some. I would love to see it on a white or light silver vehicle.

The Nanloex is nice, but IMO nothing extraordinary. I`d lump it in with things like Cquartz TiO2, McKees V2, Gyeon Mohs on its own although it could move up from the middle of the pack if longevity proves impressive. Nanolex does have a Si3D Base product that is supposed to improve longevity/hardness and such but I didn`t drop the extra $100 for that.

Pricing (before any sales and discounts) is:

Kamikaze: $212.50
Miyabi (2 coats) $100 for 30ml bottle
ISM (1 coat) $70 (only use half of a $140 30ml bottle)
Infinity Wax (1 coat) $32.50 (use about 1/4 of a $130 jar)
Overcoat (1 coat) $10 (use just a few spritzes outta a $50 bottle)

Gyeon: $160

Feynlab: $121.40
Ceramic: $71.45 for 30ml bottle
TopCoat: $49.95 for 30ml bottle
I did snatch some of their Prime for $32.95 as well (clay lube and primer or something to that effect) so bump to $155 or so total if you wanna include that

Nanolex Si3D: $90
Nanolex Si3D (2 coats) set $85.51 (50ml Si3D and 200ml Panel Wipe)
Nanolex SiFinish: $5 (used 1 coat out of 200ml bottle @ $40)
Had to order Nanloex Si3D from the Ultimate Finish in the UK as US Nanloex distributor considers it pro-only (SiShield is consumer version)

All purely unscientific and totally objective...will watch going forward. Hopefully Spring is finally here in NE Ohio.

 

[Accumulator]

BudgetPlan1- Good info in that update! Really brings across what you`re experiencing with them.

Heh heh, I`d never paid much attention to this stuff, and/but the price tags did catch my eye.

 

[BudgetPlan1]

Have been noticing something interesting with the below van:

Van 15: Gtechniq CSL + C2v3 applied 02/2017; wash, decon, CanCoat + Kamikaze Overcoat refresh 10/2017.

I think CSL likes CanCoat, the thing is always looking very nice (relative to its use) with no washing maintenance whatsoever. Likely 10k miles since 10/2017.

Kinda a nice richness to the finish as opposed to the generally candy-ish look of CanCoat alone.

 

[yamabob]

BP- have ya done CanCoat over Mohs and if so can ya compare to Syncro. I`m going to throw this on a couple this weekend and just curios

 

[BudgetPlan1]

BP- have ya done CanCoat over Mohs and if so can ya compare to Syncro. I`m going to throw this on a couple this weekend and just curios

Over Mohs, CanCoat has a more candy-like appearance and decent water behavior, nicely slick to the touch as well. Syncro, however, has a more `brilliant` type of gloss, absolutely crazy water behavior and slickness. Unless your specifically looking for that `candy` gloss that CanCoat delivers, Syncro will outdo Mohs+CanCoat in most areas that folks consider important. Syncro is like Mohs + CanCoat on steroids minus the candy look. Syncro is kinda a classier gloss, less overt.

Edit: Caveat being we don`t yet know how long Syncro will maintain it`s beneficial properties.

 

[The Guz]

Edit: Caveat being we don`t yet know how long Syncro will maintain it`s beneficial properties.

Roughly 6 months here in Southern California with occasional rain (in January and February) and the slickness from Skin is still around. Same for the hydrophobic properties.

 

[rlmccarty2000]

I believe (no basis other than belief) that toppers like Gliss, Skin, TAC Topcoat 1.0 are more prone to marring. Yes they add shine/gloss but at what cost? If you are going for pure protection I am starting to believe you should skip the topper and just go with the harder coating. I’ve got TAC Topcoat 1.0 over CQUARTZ right now and the gloss is great, but I believe I am sacrificing the longetivity of the bottom coating. Maybe the topper can be repaired by using Essence Plus then reapplying the topper to regain the gloss, IDK. Spitballing.

 

[PoweredByJenga]

Lads,
What do you think/have experience with the new range of Gyeon kits like One, Pure and Prime. They all sit under the new Synchro kit but are more affordable? Personally i am looking to try out the new CQUK v3.0 but the above kits have also caught my eye.
Cheers

Sent from my MI MAX using Tapatalk

 

[BudgetPlan1]

Prime is no longer, replaced by Pure I believe. I liked Prime, about a year, >10k miles with decent maint.

Gyeon One I didn`t much care for the very sticky buff off but it was quite forgiving with respect to removing high spots for a bit longer time after application.

Never got around to trying Pure.

Lads,
What do you think/have experience with the new range of Gyeon kits like One, Pure and Prime. They all sit under the new Synchro kit but are more affordable? Personally i am looking to try out the new CQUK v3.0 but the above kits have also caught my eye.
Cheers

Sent from my MI MAX using Tapatalk

 

[BudgetPlan1]

I believe (no basis other than belief) that toppers like Gliss, Skin, TAC Topcoat 1.0 are more prone to marring.

Can`t really point to anything specific or definitive to support it, but I share this belief as well. Hard to explain, but just have a `feeling` that it might be the case.

 

[PoweredByJenga]

I`m with you guys on the top coats, i think that they are much softer then the hard base coats and the clear underneath. IMO they exist to protect the base coating as these suffer from few issues eg water spotting, average slickness and average gloss (this increases as you add top layers eg gliss is more glossy then cq and reload is more then gliss). This has been my exp with cq classic and cq toppers.

Sent from my MI MAX using Tapatalk

 

[rlmccarty2000]

I have been thinking about skipping the coating altogether and just applying the topper. I may not get the coatings protection (but we have found there is very little actual protection against marring and scratching), but I will get some protection and superior gloss and slickness at a reduced cost and less work time. I am using TAC Topcoat 1.0 right now and I really like it except you get way too much to use for one car. You could easily do 4 normal sized cars with a bottle for $129 before discounts. I believe CarPro says Gliss can be used as a stand-alone Coating as well. Gliss over Essence would be a great combo and with proper maintenance should last for around 12 months. Now we need someone to test my theory.