Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

That`s cool. That`s alot more vehicles than I thought. I was just thinking hypothetically. Not questioning your methods. Since none of us really understand what`s going on at this nano level.
 
glfnaz said:
Actually I had lunch with Budget Man recently and we talked about some of this. Most all trucks in the fleet he lets the coatings run their entire course. That`s all part of his evaluations of each coating. In addition a lot of these vans go home with the technicians starting about April, then never come back much as the techs take them home. He gets to evaluate most all of them when they come back inside the shop when pool season ends. Then he`ll do a wash on them and evaluate gloss / beading/ dirt sheading, etc.
It`s a real world clinical evaluation of various coatings. And the weirdest thing about it, Budget Man isn`t a tech in the shop assigned to maintain these vans. He`s an inside office operations manager. He plays with these coatings and toppers just for fun in his own free time.
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DBAILEY said:
That`s cool. That`s alot more vehicles than I thought. I was just thinking hypothetically. Not questioning your methods. Since none of us really understand what`s going on at this nano level.
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Yep...pretty much once an entire vehicle is coated, it gets around 15-20K miles with absolutely NO attention until the next fall, aside from what Mother Nature brings down upon it. Winter is slow in the pool biz in Ohio...summer, crazy time, I ain`t washing no vehicles!

Occasionally I`ll do some side-by-side on a hood here and there and there are some vehicles here with close to 200k HARD miles...those are cannon-fodder for whatever we can think of.

All in good fun...or the name of science. One of the two...I forget...
 
Well, finished up with the Nanolex Si3D so it *may* be it until Spring shows up for real...

Nanolex Si3D: https://www.autopia.org/forums/detailing-product-reviews/189100-nanolex-si3d-coating.html

So now that all I’ve got left on the shelf is Gyeon Pure (which I likely won’t be using until Spring comes here in Cleveland), I’ll have to satisfy my coating curiosities by watching the below vehicles, which I will likely see 5 days a week going forward. Some are lightly maintained, some probably not at all, some a bit more but all the work vehicles are a ‘fire and forget’ proposition and then I’ll check ‘em out probably 20k miles from now. Even though it’s not yet truly Spring, the pool biz in NE Ohio is starting to ramp up, most technicians come back in a week so won’t be able to pull and more vehicles aside for the foreseeable future. The Nanolex van will probably hit the street next Monday, the Gyeon Syncro van was let out about 750 miles or so and the Kamikaze van probably first week of April. Should be an interesting season to watch…

Aside from the Gyeon Pure, don’t really have anything else in mind that interests me, coating-wise. Would like to try Optimum Gloss Coat and Cquartz UK at some point but that’s just a passing interest; have heard UK is ‘sticky’ so curious about that and Opti just never got a real interest in but would like to try at some point just to experience them. Tired of vans, tired of Ford Race Red paint, tired of washing pads/towels at 10pm, tired of laying awake plotting my next adventure. Maybe `really` done with trying stuff just for the entertainment involved? We`ll see...

*If I run across a self-healing coating that is available to consumers, all bets are off...just no way I could pass up THAT opportunity if it`s a reputable product with a solid reputation.
Van 1: Kamikaze Miyabi x 2, ISM x 1, Infinity Wax x 1, Overcoat applied 02/08/2017.

Van 3: Feynlab Ceramic + TopCoat applied 02/02/2018

Van 9: Cquartz & Gyeon Cure applied 01/2017; wash, decon, CanCoat + IGL Premier refresh 10/2017.

Van 10: Gloss Shop Ceramic V1 applied 03/2017

Van 11: 22ple HPC + VS1 Final Coat applied March 2017; refresh 01/207 w/ 22ple glass coat clay, 22ple Finitura & 22ple VS1 Final Coat

Van 12: Gyeon One + Gyeon Cure applied to hood 02/12/2018; Gyeon One removed and Nanolex Si3D + SiFinish applied 03/08/2018 to body, McKees V2 to roof.

Van 13: Gyeon Syncro applied 01/26/2018

Van 15: Gtechniq CSL + C2v3 applied 02/2017; wash, decon, CanCoat + Kamikaze Overcoat refresh 10/2017.

Van 17: Gyeon Prime + CanCoat + IGL Premier applied 11/2017; hood buffed clean, HydroSilex Recharge, Kamikaze OVercoat & 22ple VS1 Final Coat applied in 1/3 sections, 02/03/2018

Van 18 Hood: IGL Quartz + Premier (passenger side) and 22ple HPC + Finitura + VS1 Final Coat (driver side) applied 12/2017

Ranger 6: Gyeon Mohs + Cure applied 02/2017; wash, decon Gyeon CanCoat refresh 10/2017.

Ranger 7: Gloss Shop Ceramic Coating V2 applied 10/2017.

Ranger 9: Pearl Nano applied 03/2017.

Black Honda CR-V: 22ple HPC + VS1 applied April 2017.

White 2017 Ford F150: Gyeon Mohs + Gyeon Booster applied 11/2017.

Crystal Red 2017 Ford Explorer: 22ple HPC + Finitura applied 11/2017.

Black Ford Focus: Gyeon Prime + Cure applied April 2017; CanCoat refresh 11/2017.

Black Ford Focus: Kamikaze Miyabi + ISM + Overcoat applied 10/2017.

Mint Green Toyota Camry: Gyeon Prime + Cure applied April 2017.

Aegean Blue 2016 Honda Civic: Kamikaze Miyabi + ISM + Infinity Wax + Overcoat applied 10/2016.

Black 2017 Honda Accord: Kamikaze Miyabi + ISM + Infinity Wax + Overcoat applied 9/2017

Lunar Silver 2018 Honda HR-V; Gyeon Primer + Gyeon One + Gyeon CanCoat, applied 02/09/2018
 
I feel sorry for our AG brethren that can only discuss coatings sold by AG. Coatings are the cutting edge of detailing and the more information the better. They (AG) just released a new Blackfire coating, the only information so far is that it is good for two years. Wasn’t Black Label coating good for 3 years or something? Consumers are getting more educated and coatings are getting more diverse. If they want my money they are going to have to promise something better than is already on the market (or make it dirt cheap).
 
rlmccarty2000 said:
I feel sorry for our AG brethren that can only discuss coatings sold by AG. Coatings are the cutting edge of detailing and the more information the better. They (AG) just released a new Blackfire coating, the only information so far is that it is good for two years. Wasn’t Black Label coating good for 3 years or something? Consumers are getting more educated and coatings are getting more diverse. If they want my money they are going to have to promise something better than is already on the market (or make it dirt cheap).
Click to expand...

It really seems as if there is something new coming out weekly...the next *greatest thing*; aside from the Gyeon SEMA releases a while back, nothing seems to catch my interest lately; CarPro GLISS was interesting for a bit but having used (and liked) Gyeon Booster, it wasn`t enough to make me try it. And the initial performance of Gyeon Syncro seems to indicate that it will be a more economical choice than Mohs + Booster. I wandered by the truck I did with Syncro yesterday, tossed some water on the hood and it rolled off quite nicely. When I got up close and blew a bit on a single bead (yea, it looked kinda dumb to onlookers but not the first time they`ve seen me do that) the bead slid across the quicker and with less resistance than *anything* I`ve used previously...it was quite impressive. How that translates into long term self cleaning, we`ll have to wait and see. Hood hadn`t been cleaned since application about 750 winter miles ago either. Surface was still slick as the day I applied it as well.

I`m wondering how long it`s gonna be until a self-healing coating becomes consumer available? Aside from that, I just don`t know where coatings can go from here, already ridiculous (to me) claims of 10h, 7 years, so on and so forth...

Dunno...I`ll always be on the lookout for something new in this space but as of now, I think I may be set in my ways, so to speak.
 
BudgetPlan1 said:
I`m wondering how long it`s gonna be until a self-healing coating becomes consumer available? Aside from that, I just don`t know where coatings can go from here, already ridiculous (to me) claims of 10h, 7 years, so on and so forth...

Dunno...I`ll always be on the lookout for something new in this space but as of now, I think I may be set in my ways, so to speak.
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Dr Beasley`s Nano Resin Pro - available for both pro and enthusiasts. Elastomeric and self healing. 9 year guarantee for approved detailers.

I`m waiting to see some vids and reviews - the price however......... :o
 
mg031 said:
Dr Beasley`s Nano Resin Pro - available for both pro and enthusiasts. Elastomeric and self healing. 9 year guarantee for approved detailers.

I`m waiting to see some vids and reviews - the price however......... :o
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Interesting but at $500 for a consumer to purchase...uh, no. At $250 I`d be tempted if there was some *substantial* evidence of performance behind it but even I can`t justify $500. I`d guess that for certified installers, price is significantly lower.
 
Speaking of Dr. Beasley`s...

BudgetPlan: Didn`t I see you post somewhere a while back you had purchased a bottle of the regular Nano Resin?

I find the price interesting, but the lack of reviews make it too much of a wild card.
 
I’m thinking, if as good as advertised.. I can use it on a dark / black car that I would love to get again when I get a new ride this time next year lol.

I saw that they will be demoing the coating at Detail Fest this year.
 
Ok... I have also sampled just about all of the coatings on the list. Except Miyabi.. I live in Wisconsin, there is a ```` ton of salt every winter. Not one coating has given me good results on my side panels through a whole winter. Same goes for my hood. I`m utterly shocked at how much coatings go for, I`m guilty of charging stupid money for them too. It`s very disappointing to see the coatings disintegrate after a month or 2 of winter.
 
Desertnate said:
Speaking of Dr. Beasley`s...

BudgetPlan: Didn`t I see you post somewhere a while back you had purchased a bottle of the regular Nano Resin?

I find the price interesting, but the lack of reviews make it too much of a wild card.
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I did, but never got around to using it so I shipped it off to a forum user; USPS said it got there but it was never rec`d by user I sent it to. Tried to follow up with USPS and they basically said "We show it as being delivered, nothing more we can do".

Easy come, easy go!
 
Billy Baldone said:
Ok... I have also sampled just about all of the coatings on the list. Except Miyabi.. I live in Wisconsin, there is a ```` ton of salt every winter. Not one coating has given me good results on my side panels through a whole winter. Same goes for my hood. I`m utterly shocked at how much coatings go for, I`m guilty of charging stupid money for them too. It`s very disappointing to see the coatings disintegrate after a month or 2 of winter.
Click to expand...

My first coating, WG Uber Ceramic didn`t make it thru winter on sides of vehicle; Iron remover, tar remover, what the heck...it`s toast so I`m gonna clay it; nothing brought it back. About 350 miles a week, 5 days a week on 4 of the worst freeways in Cleveland...Dead.

On my wifes winter/daily driver, Kamikaze combo applied 10/2016...still performing excellent on all areas of car but she only drives about 6500 miles a year, likely 75% local, 25% freeway. Car does sit outside under variety of trees for 8 months of the year, fall really drops crap all over it and yet it perseveres. For some reason, this car always looks clean...I`m thinking its the way air flows over the panels that doesn`t leave many `dead spots` so the underlying coating has a chance to shed water on nearly every surface. 2016 Honda Civic Coupe.

My 2017 Accord Coupe, applied Kamikaze combo to last August, about 12k miles since then, horrible, horrible winter commute this year. Feb 19th was kinda a nice day here so i was able to wash/decon. Upon initial wash, typical lack of obvious hydrophobic behavior on sides of car. Between Foam, Whips Wax Road Salt remover, Gyeon Tar on sides of car and a few pressure rinses/foam cycles/bucket washes, coating returned to original hydrophobic behavior. All other steps *besides* Gyeon Tar got me to about 50% or so of original performance, Gyeon Tar took it the final 50%. Guess sometimes it takes a bit more to remove the accumulated road, salt, brine and chemical de-icers they slather all over the roads up here.
 
Hey Budget---does Claying the vehicle remove any of the coatings that you can tell, Im using the Kamikaze combo on my truck!!

Also does it hurt or have you tried after washing then applying a coat of Overcoat, to go back over it with Cancoat for an additional layer?
 
booyah said:
Hey Budget---does Claying the vehicle remove any of the coatings that you can tell, Im using the Kamikaze combo on my truck!!

Also does it hurt or have you tried after washing then applying a coat of Overcoat, to go back over it with Cancoat for an additional layer?
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Claying a coating is generally not very well received although I think it`s more due to the chance of possibly inducing some marring to the surface as opposed to harming the coating in any way. That said, 22ple came out after SEMA 2017 with supposedly glass coat safe clay, description below:

22ple Ultra Soft Glass Coat Clay will help you remove lightly embedded contamination from the paint with ease! This truly unique clay is specially formulated without abrasives, allowing it to not only work well on bare paint but to work on a glass coated surface without leaving micro scratches. The incredibly malleable bar is easily shaped and with some clay lube, it will glide across the surface readily. It works great with virtually all clay lubes, so keep using your favorite one. You will notice right away this bar has the rare balance of great cleaning power but very gentle on your paint so you don`t introduce marring. 22ple recommends storing this bar in a cool area in between uses. If it is stored near heat, it will become a little tacky but you can easily fix it by placing it back in a cool area. The bar will regain its original feel and work great for you! This is a really remarkable type of clay that will impress anyone who loves car care. So take your paint to the next level with a deep cleaning from the 22ple Ultra Soft Glass Coat Clay!
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I did use it on a fleet vehicle I coated with 22ple HPC last fall (lotsa lube) and it didn`t appear to mar the surface or be detrimental to the coating in any way.

As for Kamikaze in particular, I`ll usually get to spring and do the `ol decon wash, including applications of Gyeon Iron, Gyeon Tar which pretty much rejuvenates the coatings hydrophobic properties. I kinda did a test run of this about a month ago on my heavily used and abused Kamikaze coated car and the Gyeon Tar really helped rejuvenate the sides of the car where, at first blush, the coating had lost all it`s beneficial properties.

I would hesitate to clay a *my* coated car, instead trying to decon using chemical means and see what that brings. It certainly seemed the best approach for me when I gave it a run through last month.

As for CanCoat over Kamikaze, I`ve moved to more of a minimalist approach with regards to SiO2 products on my own personal cars. I`ve gotten into a groove with maintenance and prefer not to introduce anything outside of the product `family` to the surface, aside from Foam and Wash. I mucked about with things like Gyeon Bathe+, Gyeon WetCoat but there was never really any benefit in my eyes.

I tend to like to keep our personal cars `pure` with respect enhancers/boosters...Foam with Gyeon Foam, wash with Gyeon Bathe, dry with Kami Overcoat...and that`s about it as far as paint maintenance goes. It works well for us so I`m reluctant to add anything to a successful regiment cuz, well, sometimes things don`t go as planned and I`m not sure of the benefit of `stacking` a bunch of coating/SiO2 products. Sometimes more isn`t better after a certain point.

When our Corvette was coated with Wolfgang Uber before I moved completely to Kamikaze, I was maintaining it with Overcoat and it was doing OK. Introduced TAC Moonlight into the routine for a week or two and it did not play nice, resulting in having to remove the coatings and start over...was just never right afterwards. On some of our fleete vehicles, I`ll give anything a try...personal cars, not so much; took a long time, no small amount of $$ to get to a place of contentment, don`t wanna much that up.
 
Great thanks for all the info--I respect all you say very much when it comes to this stuff lol-----I will try the 22ple clay for sure, after all that hard work I put into my truck I do not want harm the coating in any way! So the Gyeon Iron, Gyeon Tar does not harm the coating in any way, thats great to know, I may have to get those as well for after winter clean up!!
 
If I can clay conventional LSPs without compromising them, I`d expect to be able to clay a coating. I`ve done it to coated wheels with no evidence of compromising.

BudgetPlan1- I`m sure glad that *my* area of NE Ohio doesn`t use whatever roadsalt/etc. you`re dealing with! I`m just washing it right off with shampoo mix, easy as can be, usually just rinses off with warm water through the pressure washer. Oh man would I go nuts if I had to really work at it (any harder than I do when I wash ;) ).
 
Accumulator said:
If I can clay conventional LSPs without compromising them, I`d expect to be able to clay a coating. I`ve done it to coated wheels with no evidence of compromising.

BudgetPlan1- I`m sure glad that *my* area of NE Ohio doesn`t use whatever roadsalt/etc. you`re dealing with! I`m just washing it right off with shampoo mix, easy as can be, usually just rinses off with warm water through the pressure washer. Oh man would I go nuts if I had to really work at it (any harder than I do when I wash ;) ).
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70 miles a day...Lake County, I90 to I271 to I480 to I77 and then home again. 480 and 90 in Lake County always swimming in whatever nasty liquid de-icer comes outta the back of those trucks...sprays all over the windshield too. Nasty, vile stuff.

Then when I get to work often park in a warehouse filled wirh a couple of tons liquid chlorine, granular chlorine, hydrochloric acid and other assorted pool chemicals. It`s quite the toxic environment.
 
Budget plan, this is off topic but was wondering if you could recommend a pool liner (brand, thickness etc.) I will be replacing it sometime in April or May. I have a 24 ft round above ground. Thanks
 
Fishroes said:
Budget plan, this is off topic but was wondering if you could recommend a pool liner (brand, thickness etc.) I will be replacing it sometime in April or May. I have a 24 ft round above ground. Thanks
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No worries, although likely not much help...we don`t really deal with above ground, and we sub out our inground liner installs. Our ingrounds usually go with GLI but not sure if they do retail or above grounds.

Back when we were younger (late 1990`s) a friend`s 24ft above ground needed a new liner so he ordered one from one the online places like InTheSwim, Doheneys Water Warehouse, poolsupplies.com and we put it in. Not too bad, took some time and patience...much like detailing, the key is the prep; floor, bottom cove if you have it, consistency and condition of walls and skimmer/return openings, etc. The liner we did long ago is still doing ok...faded, if course, but structurally sound.

Our ingrounds are generally 28mil but I think above grounds are lighter, more in the 18 to 22 mil range. For the most part, heavier/thicker is better as long as the surrounding pool structure can take the added weight...those liners can be heavy...generally a 16x32 is a 2 man task to lift and something to consider while wrestling liner into position.

When installing, the more people you have around the perimeter of the pool, the better...easier to shift the liner as necessary.

The link below has some info that provides a bit of a foundation and things to consider

https://www.swimuniversity.com/all-about-replacing-above-ground-pool-liners/

Maybe take the same approach I do with solar covers...not the thinnest, not the thickest but rather something in the middle. I once got a 16mil solar cover cuz it was the thickest they made, must be more durable, no? Well, it was but it was so heavy my wife couldn`t comfortably roll it up on the cover reel. Oops...now go with 12mil max, often 8 mil as I kinda consider solar covers to be disposable, 2 to 3 year items despite mfg claims of longevity. Kinda like coatings.

Join troublefreepool.com forums, encyclopedic pool information there, good bunch of folks who have seen and done it all, pro and amateur.

Feel free to PM with any pool questions if necessary...in addition to being a coating junkie, I`m a a bit of a pool geek too; the mechanics of the equipment and the chemistry of the water fascinates me. So much so that when my corporate IT job got offshored in 2010 after 25 years, I decided I wanted to be a Pool Boy instead of going back to the corporate life, found the best pool company in the area and kept sending them letters until they finally agreed to talk to/interview me. Musta said something right cuz they hired me to drive around cleaning pools for 5 months outta the year. 48 year old pool boy starting at the bottom of the ladder.

Have never since regretted that decision...money ain`t everything; happiness and a genuine interest in your work makes up for a lot. And I don`t have to dress up or shave everyday either.

Now what was this thread about again?

Edit: If you happen to have a Doughboy above ground, your decision may be simpler as I think all their stuff is kinda proprietary.

Also, try to plan the install for a sunny day; if it`s cold and cloudy the liner isn`t very pliable, making it tougher to handle/stretch into position. Cold vinyl ain`t much fun and this is the kinda jib that can really tax your fingers from gripping/pulling the liner. Back when we did our own inground installs, often we`d unpack the liner, unfold it inside the pool and let it warm up in the sun for an hour or 2 to `soften up`.

And once you have it in to your satisfaction , begin filling immediately; liners in empty pools can shrink if left unfilled. Not overnite or in a day or two when new but no reason to risk it.
 
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