Street Dreams Detail - Porsche 997 Turbo Meteor Gray

B

Bluedog

New member
ok, i know i know, i was careless. i was careless because ive been using my newly learnt wet sanding technique to get rid of small scratches. i did really well on practically all of them... till this last one... which happens to be on my favortie part of the car: the hood.



yes i accidentally wet sanded past the clearcoat and just past the color base where now its just a white/grey primer left. its in a oval shape, about 1/4 inch by 1/8 inch. its located in front of the hood near my honda emblem in the middle. it scared the hell out of me and i regret having to even wake up today... i used touchup paint to try to fix it. i put a few VERY thin layers of touch up paint, spreading it in a way that it would be least noticeable. letting it dry under the not too hot sun for about 30 mins per coat till i finally was able to block out the horrible white oval with a minimal amount of coats of touch up paint.



i wet sanded EXTREMELY CAREFULLY and wiped and checked often. i did this till i was able to smoothen out the painted area and blended it in the rest of the paint as well as i can and still have it be thick enough to cover up the white oval.



so now im done, the surface is very smooth after 3m rubbing compund, SMR, PPCL, and scratch X. but there is definitley a noticeable touch painted area that can be seen from practically all angles.



im here desperately asking for help... is there any way i can really fix this? it seems like what i did was the best i can possibly think of and to my best of ability. yet my best can not cover up the very notiecable imperfection of my perfectly smooth hood.



i dont expect a perfect "do this and it will go away" answer, nor even a really practical one. just wondering if u guys know what i should do. i think i might have to take it to the shop and have the whole hood repainted. might as well shave my emblems off while im at it then. but that will be $300 or more plus time. plus my car is only a 99, 15k miles, in very good condition since im a detail freak like everyone else here.



sorry i dont have a digi cam nor film so i cant post pics of this. any kind of words of advice is greatly appreciated.:(
 
That is the only answer and don't, repeat, don't even listen to "blending" in the area.



With the high solid clears, a blend of the area will show up in a year or less.



Suggest that all, not just you, learn that these high solid clears are going to have some "orange peel", etc and the constant polishing, etc to increase the gloss level to "show car" smoothness is going to jump up and bite them unless the vehicle is kept in a garage most of the time.



.3 mil is maximum amount of clear that may be removed, anymore and the clear will fail.



The wrapper of cellophane on a pack of cigarettes when removed and the two sides held together will measure 1.4 to 1.7 mil, average being 1.5, the same as the average film thickness of an OEM clear.



Now hold that in your hand and consider just how thin .3 (3/10th) of a mil is.



Sorry, got to take it to the bodyshop, make sure that the shop is I-CAR silver or gold class and uses only top of the line materials such as DuPont, Grazurite, PPG, Sikkens, SpiesHecker or ICI refinish material.



Ketch



:up
 
Some good news , a good painter should be able to blend in some new base coat and clear , if they're good you should not be able to notice the spot.



You need a paint thickness gauge to do wet sanding like thet especially if you hane no experince in body work. If you remove more than 0.3 MIL of your clear coat it will fail , failure means repainting.
 
There are shops that will tell you they can blend in on a high solid clear.



Yes, it can be done, but you will see in a short time, at most in most cases a year, exactly where the blend line is.



I must have looked at 20 vehicles during my last trip where I was asked to diagnois what the problem was on vehicles.



In all the cases, the concern was the result of a shop attempting to blend on OEM high solid clears.





Ketch



:eek:
 
<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' >

<em class='bbc'>Originally posted by Ron Ketcham [/i]
<strong class='bbc'>
Suggest that all, not just you, learn that these high solid clears are going to have some "orange peel", etc and the constant polishing, etc to increase the gloss level to "show car" smoothness is going to jump up and bite them unless the vehicle is kept in a garage most of the time.

.3 mil is maximum amount of clear that may be removed, anymore and the clear will fail.

Ketch

:up [/b]</blockquote>
Ron, in your opinion(which I greatly respect), how often can someone:

1. Clay their car in a 10 year peiod, so that it will not jepeoradize the integrity of the clear?

2. Use an abrasive polish(ex 3M FI II) on their car over a 10 year period, so that it will not jepeoradize the integrity of the clear?

I intend to keep my car for a long time, so I don't want to ruin my clear after the fourth year of ownership.

I think some people on this board have a tendency to over do it with polishes and claying.

Ron, as always, thank you.:)
 
The clay may and usually does some marring, which then requires agressive polishing.



While the use of polishes do not remove noticable amounts of clear, over time, and done enough will remove some.



If done by hand, more glazing is taking place than polishing, if using a D/A, a bit is slowly removed over time, how much, tough to say, like what product and which foam pad used, even then, with out a ETG gauge, who knows.



Then the question is which clear, not what brand of car, from what country.



There is basically no difference between the clears used in Gemany as here or Asia.



The differences in clears are as spelled out on our site under the portion donated by PPG.



Is it a lK, a 2K or the new lK Plus clear.



Each reacts different as to how quickly film build may be removed.



Another issue is the age of clear. At two years the clear has compacted more, become more dense and therefore appears to be harder.



This means that after the 2nd year, you have to be more agressive to remove film build vs the first year or so.



So, as you can see, many factors, who is doing the work, what are tools, what are the products, etc.



Ketch



:up
 
<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' >

<em class='bbc'>Originally posted by Ron Ketcham [/i]
[B make sure that the shop is I-CAR silver or gold class and uses only top of the line materials such as DuPont, Grazurite, PPG, Sikkens, SpiesHecker or ICI refinish material.

Ketch

:up [/B]</blockquote>
thanks for all the replies so far... im planning to go repaint my hood after i do some price shopping.

Ron, what did u mean by I-CAR silver or gold? is this a way they classify how good the paint shop is? is this rating a national standard or somthing so every shop has one?
 
Ng Luder, I feel bad for you. Trust me, I've been there. That's how I learned to paint cars... fixing mistakes.

I need to CAUTION everyone. Wet sanding is safe when used as I have described in the past.

Stay away from edges! Check your work often! When the high spots are ALMOST GONE, stop sanding.

Use wet sanding to fix minor repairs, not to make your clear coat perfectly smooth. Unless you are a pro, wet sanding large areas of your car is VERY RISKY!

db

http://gotopia.net/ProductTests/3M%20Perfect-It.htm
 
I brought my sons Accord in today to an I-Car Gold Class shop. In fact the owner is supposed to be the trainer for the Broward County area. I am glad that I looked for this certification as recommended here. I brought it to another shop and they looked at it and said they could do it in 2 days. When I brought it to the I-Car shop, the guy said he had to remove the bumper and other trim parts to paint it right and he found other damage that the Allstate estimator missed. He also told me that he would never give a lifetime guarantee unless he could do it right. He said he would have Allstate come and do a reinspection and get approval for the additional labor or he wouldn't do the job. I could definitely tell the difference in professionalism. Thanks to whoever it was that mentioned it in a previous post!



H :up
 
We, at Automotive International have licensed our PrepExcellence course to I-CAR, we work with them through the automotive manufacturers, to provide technical support and advice regarding the care and corrections of 2K, 1K and 1K Plus clears, interiors, trim, wheels etc.



Think of that when you read fancy ads in magazines, hear someone tell you how to care for your vehicles paint and the like.



We are one of three car care manufacturers endorsed by I-CAR and 8 of the largest vehicle manufacturers in the world.



Technical expertise, regarding the constant changes,how to intelligently deal with them, the technology of modern vehicles is our expertise, not mass marketing of boutique products.



We develope, not only engineering approved products, but the actually processes required to correct those conditions that may be corrected, short of refinishing the vehicle.



Ketch

:bounce
 
i looked at the site and didnt really find a conveniently located I-CAR place. but from what i read it seems its more important to go to an I-CAR certified place when u have an accident. but for me, i just need to repaint the hood, a fairly straight foward job. not to mention i dont have that much money. is going to an I-CAR place really that important for such a simple job? my dealer here sends all their cars that needs body work of any kind to this one shop but they arent I-car certified, yet the dealer works with them. i can personally get hooked up for a $120 job at a friends place but not too certain of perfect color match with the rest of the body of course. i plan to probably spend arond $300 for repainting the hood and shaving off the emblem holes. would an I-Car place charge around that much for painting my hood? if its way more to say around $400, i think ill rather go get it done at a reputable shop that isnt I-Car certified.

heres pics to give u an idea how my hood is like(all BEFORE the mistake):
URjs2s3SG7zs95PKFsKES9biIVpDPEg00180.jpg

7Hr-HV21F7+5vQYG-Q1bhf6DjkIkehZ+0180.jpg

IIOa9OqhkfWJtNhxRzAO7thudjTtMlzD0180.jpg
 
What are your expectations?



Is the savings of $100 going to affect you in a year or two?



Is quality an issue with you?



Can you live with a less than 100% color match?



Who will pay if the refinish fails in 6 months to a year?



Just some questions to consider.



Ketch

:eek:
 
well quality is definitley an issue for me. i probably cant live with a less than 95% perfect match. as for longlivity, i gota check on guarantees...



well, can anyone give me a rough estimate on how much it might cost to just repaint my hood if there are no dents or anything on it at all if i go to a I-Car certified place? anyone with experience on this like bigboyhf?
 
ok i found a very close place thats I-Car certified. but i have a small question to ask... the place i found does work directly for a nearby toyota dealer. i think the dealer actually owns that shop since their number calls the dealer directly. My honda dealer takes all their body work to their preferred body shop but that shop is not I-Car certified. BUt they do all of that honda dealers work. so the toyota one i beleive can do a better job since they have I-Car, but then the honda one probably has more experience with OEM paint matching since they work directly for a honda dealer.



so should i go to the toyota shop thats I-Car certified or to the shop that isnt but does all of the Honda work for a honda dealer?



any input is appreciated:)
 
then IMHO go to the I-CAR...from what ive seen of people posting resulta they were happy with and not happy with....theses shops know there stuff dood....the place that does all the honda work...could be good.....but since you and i know your a perfectionist about your paint(as we all are0 then why take a chance that 6 mths from now....bamm!!it doesnt match anymore....
 
Not that I have an incredible amount of experience, but when my wife and I were in a wreck last month, we took her Camry to a local I-CAR specialist (CarStar) here in Kansas City, which was also recommended by our Insurance Company.



Well.... the car was totalled even though the damage didn't appear to be that bad.... but I must admit that the few days we worked with the I-CAR people was very, very impressive.



I think that they would be paint experts across the board and have worked on Hondas before so they know that paint.



On another note.... I feel your pain. I bit off more than I could chew and wet sanded to the primer as well on her Camry before it was wrecked. The decision to repaint or not was obviously taken out of my hands after the wreck!



Good luck... I'd hate to see that beautiful Prelude marred! Love that color!







:D
 
Ng Luder, I hope I am not to late to the thread........



Personally, I would recommend an I-Car shop. However, I noticed you live in LA, where are you located? If you are in the Pasadena area, there is a shop called Marco's Auto Body you should check out. They do amazing work and are extremely professional and do lots of work on BMW's and Honda's.....and no, I have absolutely no affiliation with them.



.....One final piece of advice, if you plan on keeping the car for awhile, please don't skimp on a couple hundred dollars. Please trust me on that because I recently made that mistake and now I have to live with it for at least another couple years with a less than perfect paint job! ....as hard as it may be patience wise, you would be better off waiting and saving up your money to get it done right.



Good luck..
 
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