So I found out why car manufacturers intentionally put orange peel in their paint

A

Alexshimshimhae

New member
So I before I get into this, keep in mind that this is hear say (from wiki) and not necessary the G-ds honest truth.BUT



So we know that part of the reason that car manufacturers haphazardly spray paint leaving a orange peel look before spraying on their clears is because, well it costs more to get it done right which would make the car appearance look much better when maintained properly



NOW



The other reason is this. On average, a cars maintenance is dismal at best with swirls, RIDs, and all sorts of autopian atrocities left to fester on the car. With that said, part of the reason of the intentional orange peel of the base paint (or the layers under the smooth clear in the event i'm mislabeling coats) it to kind of hide or help mask the spotting of imperfections; think of it as camouflage.



Now, this doesn't mean that you wont see them, but that it simply makes it harder to spot at a distance.
 
I don't believe any auto maker intentionally creates orange peeling. To the contrary, very few give it any thought at all and have little interest in doing what it takes to ensure a top shelf paint job. IMHO the reason for that is because 99/100 customers have no clue what the paint flaws are and are even less willing to pay what it would cost for a perfect paint job.
 
In the case of automated/robotic paint systems used on high-end cars, I think the orangepeel is 100% unintentional. My D2-series Audis have it in odd places (pretty much the same on both cars) as if the system was simply out of whack.
 
Seeing wet sanding gets rid of some or most of the orange peel, it would be more in the clear coat, not the base[color coat].



Factory clear is thinner than a good repaint, so not a great idea to wet sand without a paint meter to check progress as you attempt this.



I doubt any orange peel is intentional, but have seen some pretty bad paint jobs on new vehicles I would never pay for in that shape.
 
I don't think orange peel is intentional either. Honestly, no one sees orange peel, no one cares about orange peel, and certainly no one would not purchase a vehicle simply because of orange peel. Of course, the exception to this is true Autopians, who make up about 0.005% of the automobile purchasing market. Bottom line is, it happens because of cost cutting and non-perfect painting techniques. Manufactures don't care simply because their techniques have increased efficiency, and no one is complaining.
 
i dont think orange peel is intentionally induced to cover up anything. it is usually just the way paint, clear dries. it is mostly, i think, because the paint(clear) is not atomized enough in the cheap spray guns the factory uses. the finer the product is applied the less chance of orange peel. the other part is the curing, drying, that is associated with painting a vehicle. the new water borne paints reduce orange peel greatly. i have seen a few painters lay down paint and it comes out almost orange peel free.
 
It's all about cost....but I will agree that orange peel helps hide defects...much like the spraying of that "cottage cheese" on some home ceilings. Ever seen a door ding or wave on a car panel that has been sanded and polished smooth as glass?



I also think the newer water based paints are worse than the older solvent based paints too.



In the body shop world, a skilled painter can dial in his gun/paint mixing to get very minimal orange peel.
 
You bring up a good point on new cars. Yes, I think it's abysmal that car manufacturers are doing this, BUT, it's also part of the manufacturing process: with equipment, human labor and/or programmed robotic arms, modern water-based VOC-compliant paints and clearcoats, and just plain cost-cutting measures all entering into the equation.

That's one of the complaints owners of American-made cars have when compared to their Foreign-built counterparts: Why doesn't my American car look as good as those foreign cars if they are supppose to have "better quality"? Nissan, however, is notorious for it's new-car orange peel. When my wife notices it on the dealer showroom floor, it's gotta be bad (or she's been paying attention to my bantering on car paint conditions).



Should you correct it yourself ??? Maybe after the warranty is up. Complain to the manufacturer and have a dealership fix it when it's new?? Look at how it prepped in the first place!!



That brings up another conundrum on vintage show cars, especially American muscle cars. To get a car concours-perfect, its paint must have that orange peel in it as it came from the factory to considered "correct" for that car. I've seem plenty of show cars that have been detailed to the n-th degree that look absolutely stunning. But the judges don't like it because it's not "factory original" in appearance. I, personally, love the stunning, drop-dead, absolutely georgous, head-turning, show car paints on restored cars only because I now know how much of a labor-of-love (and money) is involved to get a car to look like that. I guess it's the better-than-new mentality, but it's not concours-correct.
 
I would guess that manufacturers use a fast set catalyst in their paint so it dries quickly. With a slow catalyst the paint will self level much more, but also more likely to get dust and dirt stuck in the paint in the early stages. Having to nib out dirt would take much more time and efficiency from the manufacturer.
 
I actually have a buddy who told me that he likes the way orange peel looks when they car is washed and clean. Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder.
 
JohnKleven said:
I would guess that manufacturers use a fast set catalyst in their paint so it dries quickly. With a slow catalyst the paint will self level much more, but also more likely to get dust and dirt stuck in the paint in the early stages. Having to nib out dirt would take much more time and efficiency from the manufacturer.
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That would make sense to me. Time is a huge factor, and time is money.



A high end body/restoration shop can reduce down the paint just enough to flow more, yet not run...it's a fine line that's for sure. On top of the gun settings and mixing of the paint, you also have many human factors such how heavy each coat is and the amount of time between coats. I've watched many paints job go from amazing to a running mess in a matter of seconds. ;)
 
JaredPointer said:
I actually have a buddy who told me that he likes the way orange peel looks when they car is washed and clean. Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder.
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LOL, does he like fat girls too? :D
 
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Maybe they use some of this at the factory?
 
Orange peel is caused by many things, equipment with the improper setups, the lack of voc containing solvents(thinners and reducers) in the finishing process which limits the films ability to "flow" out and just who can supply the plant the cheapest. In my opinion orange peel is serious but I think the problem with plastic bumpers not matching the metal body is a bigger crime. I know the cause is different substrates (as per all the paint mfgs) but they are really ugly colors out there.
 
Ok...So...It is more about crappy VOC paint and the companies trying to squeeze every second out of the production line since time is money and nobody complains...Got it.



So...If that is the case, Why is it the same with the Mega-dollar exotic cars that are hand made with some of them, (Lamborghini Guillardo SV) coming with paintjobs taking 200+ hours to complete? What is their excuse? I get angry at the orangepeel on my Ford Escape. If I dropped 250K on a Lambo that had anything but GLASS as the finish of any surfaces I would sincerely be in prison for executing everyone in the dealership.
 
I agree with you MDBOHICA. Low voc paint is the goverements doing. Trying to reduce the amount of ozone depleting emmissions put out by the mfgs. and now in the refinishing process. Some of the higher end cars are sprayed by hand which could lead back to all of the above causes.
 
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