Onr

[jeteast99]

I use ONR for all my washes and haven't had any complaints until yesterday. i was washing a Red Ram Truck and halfway thru the customer comes out and tells me he does not like the job i was doing. He was extremely irritated and began to "teach" me how to wash. He said i need a pressure washer or at least a bucket and a hose. I told him about ONR and it's benefits but he would not have it and did not let me finish the job. Anyone else have a problem with a customer like this and if so how did you confront it? Like i said normally people love it since it is fast and hardly uses any water but his guy did not want it.

 

[imported_cj99si]

I hate it.......but everyone else seems to love it. You can do a much better job with a hose on the cracks,door jambs, molding(dirt builds up behind it ),engine, rims, wheel wells, everything....... But maybe I'm seeing dirty cars than most of you



And im not convinced it doesnt cause more swirls than a normal wash.

 

[SuperBee364]

Count me in as one of those ONR doubters...



I received a gallon of ONR this last week. Now, mind you, I had just done a complete polish/LSP the previous week, so my paint was as perfect as it's going to get. I had done a complete post-detail paint inspection, and had every little scratch, blemish, etc. in my paint committed to memory.



So I get my gallon of ONR. My car hadn't been washed in five days. No precipitation, but most of that time was spent in a parking lot. The car had quite a bit of dust on it. I mixed the solution exactly as stated on the instructions to two gallons of distilled water. I then washed my car.



Afterwards, I proceeded with a Brinkmann and then a halogen inspection of my paint. Either I missed some marring during my post-detail inspection (which is possible, albeit unlikely), or the ONR had created some new marring. And this was just with a layer of dust. And yes, I very carefully followed the instructions on the bottle. I also used a total of four microfiber towels to do the wash, using both sides of each towel. So pretty much each car panel saw a brand new towel surface.



I've been very hesitant to make this post; guess that's why I waited three days to make it and only after an ONR complaint surfaced. I just don't want to get an ONR war thread started. Many swear by it, some swear at it. I'm still undecided, because it is possible that the marring was missed by me after my last detail.



Until someone does a long term, thorough, honest *evaluation of this stuff, the ONR is being relegated to door jambs and clay lube duty.



*Meaning starting with a completely corrected, mar free finish, and using ONR as the only washing method for a couple months, then taking new pictures of the previously mar-free finish and comparing them.

 

[PhaRO]

Scott posted some pictures here http://autopia.org/forum/930155-post46.html that showed a finish after months of ONR only use. I've been using ONR on just about every car for the last 6 or 7 months and part of the time before that. I've not had anyone question it. One lady admitted she was a little concerned but afterwards her concerns vanished and she now uses ONR herself. If a customer felt strongly enough against my using it, I'd do a conventional wash (I have a little bottle of soap somewhere in my truck if it hasn't evaporated). The subject of marring comes up a lot in the ONR threads. I would think if the wash induced marring where evident after only one washing then those that use it weekly year round would be horrified by the condition of the vehicle they clean.

 

[RTexasF]

I use ONR for all my washes and haven't had any complaints until yesterday. i was washing a Red Ram Truck and halfway thru the customer comes out and tells me he does not like the job i was doing. He was extremely irritated and began to "teach" me how to wash. He said i need a pressure washer or at least a bucket and a hose. I told him about ONR and it's benefits but he would not have it and did not let me finish the job. Anyone else have a problem with a customer like this and if so how did you confront it? Like i said normally people love it since it is fast and hardly uses any water but his guy did not want it.

I'd bet that he was in a mood before you ever got there and you caught the brunt of it. He may be a jerk but I would offer to do it his way at no charge to try and get him back on my side. If he remains a twit then no loss but at least you tried to do the right thing to make him happy.

 

[SuperBee364]

Scott posted some pictures here http://autopia.org/forum/930155-post46.html that showed a finish after months of ONR only use. I've been using ONR on just about every car for the last 6 or 7 months and part of the time before that. I've not had anyone question it. One lady admitted she was a little concerned but afterwards her concerns vanished and she now uses ONR herself. If a customer felt strongly enough against my using it, I'd do a conventional wash (I have a little bottle of soap somewhere in my truck if it hasn't evaporated). The subject of marring comes up a lot in the ONR threads. I would think if the wash induced marring where evident after only one washing then those that use it weekly year round would be horrified by the condition of the vehicle they clean.

Yeah, I saw those pictures, PhaRO, that was a thread I started before I ordered the ONR. I'm glad that you guys are having such great luck with the stuff. And I'm still not sure if the marring was there before I washed or not.



I dunno what to think of this stuff.

 

[SpoiledMan]

Nothing but ONR since delivery. It's about 4 months old now.



On a Honda yet.

 

[imported_cj99si]

I think it has a lot to do with climates. Also our personal cars don't get as dirty as customer cars.

 

[SpoiledMan]

For reference, that's *not* my car. More background on it. It sits outside under a tree daily and overnight. It's ONR'd every other week.

 

[SuperBee364]

Wow, very impressive, SpoiledMan....and you're just using the ONR as stated on the label?



I'm thinking I might make up a spray bottle of ONR at QD strength and spray it on each panel before washing.

 

[SpoiledMan]

Yep. Used per the directions. I buy the stuff by the case and I'm due to get working on getting another case. IMO Optimum hit the nail on the head with this product.

 

[mikebai1990]

SuperBee364, sorry to hear of your problems. Maybe you can try mixing a stronger solution than the one recommended. This might and probably will help give you more lubrication. I use ONR on a Mazda minivan, and it doesn't seem to instill any more marring than a conventional wash. I sure you're already doing this, but it's probably worth repeating: Rinse often, keep your solution bucket clean, and use many high quality MF or WW towels.



jeteast99, that customer seems pretty obnoxious... When you say he didn't like the job you were doing, did he think that you will making scratches in the paint? Or did he think that the car wasn't clean enough with an ONR wash? There are various pictures you can show him (Scottwax has a few) to prove that ONR washes don't marr if done correctly.



Also, since he is a customer after all, tell him that you will do a conventional wash for him if he really prefers it. However, remind him that a large percentage of your cars and that of some other professional detailers are washed using ONR and waterless washes. Tell him that you feel this is the most environmentally friendly, effective, and efficient method of washing a car.

 

[SpoiledMan]

Wow, very impressive, SpoiledMan....and you're just using the ONR as stated on the label?



I'm thinking I might make up a spray bottle of ONR at QD strength and spray it on each panel before washing.

SuperBee, you might also want to give the grout sponge a shot. Oh yeah, I do all my ONR washes using the single bucket method and the grout sponge.

 

[PTRon]

He (the customer) was just showing his ignorance. Was it just a "wash" or were you going to do more? Was he an existing customer? You do need 2 buckets for ONR (imho). One for ONR and one with clean water (even if it's just to keep the customers happy - image is everything). Were you also irritated or did you handle him with poise and grace (yeah, yeah, I know, sometimes it's really hard to keep your cool when someone's verbally assaulting you)? You can't make all the people happy all the time - but you can try.

 

[jeteast99]

Well this guy is a manager of a local company and he wanted a detailer to come by each week to wash his truck and a few other people's cars.



His main concern was that i was going to cause scratches and swirls to his brand new truck. I believe he thought i was just using plain old water but i showed him the bottle and calmly explained to him that i use this for all my washes and used in the correct method it will not produce scrathces or swirls. But he didn't believe in the product. But i did do the other employees cars and have been doing them weekly/bi-weekly

 

[brwill2005]

I use ONR everyday with out problems. I usually pre-rinse with a PW though. I would not want a person like that as my customer. I prefer for my customer's to have confidence in my knowledge and ability as a professional detailer. Most likely he would have complained about the finished product anyways.

 

[mikebai1990]

Maybe you can choose a car without swirls, show him in the sun, and then do an ONR wash on it to prove that it doesn't instill marring/scratching any more than a conventional car wash. Of course, it may not be worth your time to educate a customer who is unwilling to learn new things.

 

[BlackElantraGT]

If I was paying someone good money to detail my car, I personally would not want that first detail to be with an ONR wash. It's not because I'm afraid it would create more swirls than a conventional wash, but from using ONR firsthand, I know there are lots of areas that are not getting cleaned because of the lack of water pressure. I wouldn't mind it on a maintenance wash, but the first wash in my opinion needs to be thoroughly done. I'm paying for a "detail" after all.



It's like going to get a pedicure, and instead of soaking your feet for awhile, she just gives it a wipedown and proceeds to cut your nails and buff it to a shine. Sure, it looks nice and she did it quicker than normal, but you didn't get a full foot spa treatment.



Superbee, I noticed you said you purchased a gallon of ONR. I don't know if you realize this, but the instructions for the gallon size are really meant for the small bottle. A capful of the gallon size is not the same as a capful of the smaller bottle. So it could be possible that your solution was not diluted properly.

 

[imported_ajbarnes]

I've been using QEW and for the past year, ONR, and I completely believe in it and know that it works when used properly. The problem is trying to relay this information to customer's. It's all about image and perception. If someone sees you washing a car with what *looks* like plain ol' water, obviously a negative reaction is going to happen. People are used to seeing lots of bubbles when it comes to cleaning cars. This has always been my problem with using no rinse - bad perception from the customer and other's that may be looking. So, basically I just use ONR on my weekly wash customer's since they know me, they trust me, and they understand how the product works.

 

[SuperBee364]

If I was paying someone good money to detail my car, I personally would not want that first detail to be with an ONR wash. It's not because I'm afraid it would create more swirls than a conventional wash, but from using ONR firsthand, I know there are lots of areas that are not getting cleaned because of the lack of water pressure. I wouldn't mind it on a maintenance wash, but the first wash in my opinion needs to be thoroughly done. I'm paying for a "detail" after all.



It's like going to get a pedicure, and instead of soaking your feet for awhile, she just gives it a wipedown and proceeds to cut your nails and buff it to a shine. Sure, it looks nice and she did it quicker than normal, but you didn't get a full foot spa treatment.



Superbee, I noticed you said you purchased a gallon of ONR. I don't know if you realize this, but the instructions for the gallon size are really meant for the small bottle. A capful of the gallon size is not the same as a capful of the smaller bottle. So it could be possible that your solution was not diluted properly.

I had no idea.... what's the correct dilution in "gallon capfuls"?? I'll probably end up getting some one-ounce-per-pump jug pumps, but til then it would be nice to know the correct dilution.