Godspeed Paris

Ronkh said:
The reason we haven't "won" a war since Vietnam time, is simple. We don't fight to win.
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Very true, they should have started at the DMZ and made Grand Canyon 2 with everything North. There is a lot of American blood in Vietnam, Iraq etc. and for what. It is just disgusting. If we are not going to war to win then we should not go at all which maybe the present Govt. is doing but Isis and a world full of degenerates is a different story. All of these Syrian people running to Europe, most are said to be male, why do they not stay and fight to keep their country, if our fore fathers acted like these places we would still be part of England as everyone would have fled to Canada, Mexico etc.. Guess maybe I am incapable of understanding some of this but I know the 2 bit feces of Isis is not intimadating me one bit. As stated earlier the U.S. with Lemay, Patton would have unleashed he** on these people and Allah would have his own zip code with new residents.

Dave

Dave
 
Ronkh said:
The reason we haven't "won" a war since Vietnam time, is simple. We don't fight to win.
Click to expand...

davidc said:
Very true, they should have started at the DMZ and made Grand Canyon 2 with everything North. There is a lot of American blood in Vietnam, Iraq etc. and for what. It is just disgusting. If we are not going to war to win then we should not go at all which maybe the present Govt. is doing but Isis and a world full of degenerates is a different story. All of these Syrian people running to Europe, most are said to be male, why do they not stay and fight to keep their country, if our fore fathers acted like these places we would still be part of England as everyone would have fled to Canada, Mexico etc.. Guess maybe I am incapable of understanding some of this but I know the 2 bit feces of Isis is not intimadating me one bit. As stated earlier the U.S. with Lemay, Patton would have unleashed he** on these people and Allah would have his own zip code with new residents.

Dave

Dave
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We have fought "humane" wars. Soldiers have to ask a lawyer, if it's ok to blow something up.

The Israelis call & drop leaflets that they are going to bomb something. Heaven forbid we get a strongly worded letter from the UN.

Either fight to win, or walk away.
 
I do not think you can win like we did in WWII where someone represented the country and most complied. Iraq is a country with opposing groups (Kurds, Sunnis, Shiites) that do not really get along. One minute the rank and file are your allies and then they become your enemies at a whim. No loyalty. The middle east creates groups in these areas and keeping track of who opposes who takes a huge spreadsheet. In Libya. Ghadaffi is gone and the elected government did not get the people support so it now in chaos.
 
The way I see it, the best answer involves containment and a heavy dose of "racial profiling" (yes, it's not PC and I'm a jerk....whatever, I really don't care).

We can't wipe out all Muslims...it wouldn't be right and I honestly believe there are millions of Muslims that are good people. When it comes to global terrorism though, there is a common denominator. If there's one single person on here that didn't immediately think young Muslim male when they heard the news of what happened, you're either completely delusional or a liar.

If it was up to me, every middle eastern muslim person in the country that isn't a natural born citizen would be shipped back out to their country of origin A.S.A.P. Next item up, Visa's or any entrance to the country by an individual from a M.E. country......DONE. The goal going forward to do whatever possible to contain these people to the M.E.

Every time an event like this unfolds, we hear the rhetoric "it's just a few bad apples". I certainly don't believe it's all Muslims, but I hate to tell everyone, it's a hell of a lot more than "a few". I've seen claims of 1%.....I'm sorry, but that's just b.s. Between legit extremists, those that aren't yet sympathize with them, and those that won't do anything to fight the problem, we're talking milllions and millions of Muslims that have blood on their hands as far as I'm concerned.

The claimed 75-99% of claimed peaceful Muslims want to prove to the world that Islam is a Religion of peace? Great. YOU fix it. YOU solve the problem. YOU root out the extremists of the group and get rid of them. Of the 1 point whatever billion Muslims on the planet, if 75+% are supposedly good, then they've got the numbers on their side to solve the problem and win. Until then.....they need to be contained and isolated from the rest of the world as much as possible, because quite frankly they haven't shown to be compatible with any modern society. They want to remain stuck in the 7th century with their Sharia Law? Fine, do it in your own territory and wipe eachother out as they see fit.


Having said all that, nothing is going to change. We'll continue to hear tough talk and we need to do this and we need to do that. No western society has the stones at the moment to do what is necessary to rid the world of the problem or at least contain it. So we'll continue to see attacks like this escalate while doing little pin prick strikes here and there that accomplish nothing. We've heard tough talk from Hollande about retaliation with "no mercy". Sounds great, but forgive me if I'm not going to hold my breath. About the only thing I could see changing that is if/when they get their hands on a nuclear bomb and wipe out the majority of a major city.
 
Has anyone heard if Isis was responsible for bringing down that aircraft as they once said they did ?. I would find that very interesting if true yet Iran is supposedly fighting Isis but has not been attacked.

Dave
 
Last I heard was they claimed they brought it down with a bomb and signs are strongly pointing towards a bomb on the plane bringing it down.
 
House of Wax said:
No western society has the stones at the moment to do what is necessary to rid the world of the problem or at least contain it. So we'll continue to see attacks like this escalate while doing little pin prick strikes here and there that accomplish nothing. We've heard tough talk from Hollande about retaliation with "no mercy". Sounds great, but forgive me if I'm not going to hold my breath. About the only thing I could see changing that is if/when they get their hands on a nuclear bomb and wipe out the majority of a major city.
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Nobody at this point with the stones is right on the money. The day/night before the attack O said that Isis was "contained".

France has resumed air attacks in Syria, so lets see how long or how much.

Till then,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYJMtn6IJeE
 
House of Wax said:
No western society has the stones at the moment to do what is necessary to rid the world of the problem or at least contain it. So we'll continue to see attacks like this escalate while doing little pin prick strikes here and there that accomplish nothing. We've heard tough talk from Hollande about retaliation with "no mercy". Sounds great, but forgive me if I'm not going to hold my breath. About the only thing I could see changing that is if/when they get their hands on a nuclear bomb and wipe out the majority of a major city.
Click to expand...


Nobody at this point with the stones is right on the money. The day/night before the attack O said that Isis was "contained".

France has resumed air attacks in Syria, so lets see how long or how much.

Till then,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYJMtn6IJeE
 
Fantastic. Michigan, Alabama, and Texas have all let Obama know they won't be accepting any refugees now. This needs to spread in a hurry. If the administration is so stupid, hopefully the states will band together and put a stop to the nonsense
 
House of Wax said:
Fantastic. Michigan, Alabama, and Texas have all let Obama know they won't be accepting any refugees now. This needs to spread in a hurry. If the administration is so stupid, hopefully the states will band together and put a stop to the nonsense
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I thought this thread was about what happened in Paris...
 
I have been watching the 6-DVD set, Band of Brothers, since Veteran's day, in honor of my Father and his 4 brothers, 3 of whom parachuted into Normandy on D-Day, June 6, 1944..
There are interviews with some of the last men of the 101st Airborne, Easy Company, on whose heroics, this movie is based... I am sure that by now, all of the men who were still alive I think 14 years ago, when they were interviewed are probably all gone or very, very, old..

I cannot watch this very long without tears coming to my eyes as I see the absolute awfulness of war, how brutal it is for everyone even for those that managed to not be killed or wounded there..
They were able to even capture the sounds of hot lead going by your face, and I can tell you, there is a no more horrifying sound than that...

And then, the unbelievable brutality in Paris, France..

But for all this incredible suffering, for the Military and the Civilian sides of war, there are strong reasons why men and women go there and serve, sacrifice, and even give their very lives for it..

I read something that I feel I must share with you all, in hopes that somehow, we can all get back to the very core, the root of why we all really need to do our part to keep this country free and go to the aid of those that desire the same...

May, 1940, as the spectre of Nazi infamy grew closer to England, a man named Winston Leonard, Spencer Churchill was called to the post of Prime Minister of England..
He very quickly formed a government and on May 13, 1940 went before the House of Commons with his first speech and declared:

"I would say to the House, as I said to those who have joined this Government:" 'I have nothing to offer but blood, toil, tears, and sweat.'
"We have before us an ordeal of the most grievous kind. We have before us many, many long months of struggle and of suffering..

You ask what is our policy? I will say: It is to wage war, by sea, by land, and air, with all our might and with all our strength that God can give us...
That is our policy...

You ask, What is our aim? I can answer in one word: Victory-victory at all costs, victory in spite of all terror; victory, however long and hard the road may be."
(Churchill: The Life Triumphant, American Heritage, 1965, p. 90.)

Then six days later Churchill went on the radio speaking to the world at large, saying, "This is one of the most awe-striking periods in the long history of France and Britain...
Behind us...gather a group of shattered states and bludgeoned races; the Czechs, the Poles, the Norwegians, the Danes, the Dutch, the Belgians- upon all of whom the long night of barbarism will descend, unbroken even by a star of hope, unless we conquer, as conquer we must; as conquer we shall." (Churchill, p. 91.)

Two weeks later he was back in front of Parliament; "We shall not flag or fail," he vowed.. "We shall go on to the end, we shall fight in France, we shall fight on the seas and oceans, we shall fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the air, we shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender." (Churchill, p. 91)

These words have to be among the most stirring calls to courage and patriotism out there, and they give me great hope that once again, the nations of the world can come together and once and for all, stop this bloodshed of innocent people...

It is time... We have to do this...
Dan F
 
Stokdgs said:
It is time... We have to do this...
Dan F
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It has been time. If the countries in the region do not join in, we cannot succeed. Iraq had its chance and blew it with more political division. I see some (McCain has been big and now more) wanting to arm everyone to fight them but they will likely just get used to fight us when the ISIS situation morphs again. The enemy will be hard to find since they just disappear into the crowd and then re-appear again when motivated or coerced by yet another movement.
 
Bunky said:
The enemy will be hard to find since they just disappear into the crowd and then re-appear again when motivated or coerced by yet another movement.
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The very reason we NEED intelligence and eyes on the ground, so they can be identified and located.

Or maybe we should just draw another 'red line".
 
Ronkh said:
The very reason we NEED intelligence and eyes on the ground, so they can be identified and located.
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Definitely. I am sure we are spending a lot trying to buy information and need to do more. Whomever is selling them all those Toyota trucks is making a lot of money.
 
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