WW/RW Showdown - N-914 vs Feynlab Pure Rinseless

[TheMeanGreen]

What makes you think you can use a 2x dilution ratio with a Marolex? I have one, and it works basically the same as my IK & Kwazar. Seems to be that would be really really stretching it too far.

I have 1:32 mixed up in my Aerator and the foam is pretty runny compared to 1:20, but still usable. I then tossed this mix into the IK9 with the densest foam plug and I got near the level of foam that the Aerator produces at ~1:25. I do need to preface that I have not tried this mix purely as a waterless wash. I won`t do that ever as the name of my game is surface preservation. I supplement a rinseless with the higher dilution of FROTHe as a pretreatment. This is also being done with R.O. water as my tap water is pretty hard, so the lack of crap in the water allows the chemicals to do be extended a little bit farther. My guess about the Marolex extending product usage could be completely wrong as well, though.

To keep these last few posts somewhat on topic, at 1:250 Pure Rinseless foams better than any "non-foaming" rinseless washes. Comparison to N-914, M37 RFWW, Uber Rinseless, Carpro ECH20, DPC Revive, ONR, and ONRWW.

 

[Coatings=crack]

What makes you think you can use a 2x dilution ratio with a Marolex? I have one, and it works basically the same as my IK & Kwazar. Seems to be that would be really really stretching it too far.

Would love to hear back on marolex. Thinking 3000 to have bigger chamber for more pressure. Especially interested in regular 1-16 and 1-20 ratios


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[Coatings=crack]

.

To keep these last few posts somewhat on topic, at 1:250 Pure Rinseless foams better than any "non-foaming" rinseless washes. Comparison to N-914, M37 RFWW, Uber Rinseless, Carpro ECH20, DPC Revive, ONR, and ONRWW.

I just did a pure rinseless wash today and noticed how much it foamed up. Gonna give it a whirl in an IK.

To note you use frothe as a foam pretreat then wipe away with a rinseless wash. Seams like an expensive pretreat. How’s it working for you?

I pretreat with N-914 and then frothe then wipe away. Works well no noticable marring. Gonna try with Pire as pretreat next



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[Coatings=crack]

I just use to rinse less wash my car and tried on wheels and tires..... awesome sauce

Rim cleaned tire not

Foamed wheel used lo pro tire brush

Rim and tire cleaned with just Pure no product applied.

Used this. Love it for tire cleaning. Keeps product off wheel.

Awesome no rinse tire and wheel cleaner.


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[TheMeanGreen]

I just did a pure rinseless wash today and noticed how much it foamed up. Gonna give it a whirl in an IK.

To note you use frothe as a foam pretreat then wipe away with a rinseless wash. Seams like an expensive pretreat. How’s it working for you?

I pretreat with N-914 and then frothe then wipe away. Works well no noticable marring. Gonna try with Pire as pretreat next



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Considering ONR at $42.99 per gallon, and I fill my bucket with one gallon of R.O. water at $0.25/gallon and 0.5oz of ONR at 1oz:256oz dilution. Let`s just call FROTHe use at $1.50 for the wash. That entire part of the wash process comes out to be $1.92. This process is for in-between scheduled washes if it is needed, mainly for water spot prevention as the rain in West Texas is about as hard as the water that comes out of the tap.

 

[William_Wallace]

Based on this thread I bought feynlab pure rinseless. It was exactly the wash solution I was looking for. Anyone that has a coated car will have the same issues I had. When I sprayed ONR, N-914, Wipeout, ect. The coating causes the waterless wash solution to bead up. Even if you sprayed and sprayed the other WW don’t have the ability to lay flat on the coating. I was always worried about the bare paint between the beads getting marred.

Feynlab is the exact opposite it must be specially designed to lay flat no matter what the contact angle is. My CQUK did not bead feynlab WW solution, every square inch of my paint was covered in WW solution. I did not feel guilty and lazy . I felt like I could trust the product.

I have seen videos on YouTube about cleaning power. I thought they were exaggerated it turns out the product really has ability to clean wheels and lift dirt off the wheel if you spray with the nozzle close to the wheel. I mixed 15MlLs to 1 gallon it seems like that is unrealistic amount to a gallon and the first time I did 25mls it was too strong and streaked, it felt like normal car wash solution.

They remind me of an American version of IGL.

They have another product called PRIME it is a special clay lube that fills all the valleys and pits of clear coat it has to be used before polishing/compounding. It is supposed to have ceramic ingredients fill these voids so that polishing oils can’t fill in these spaces. It puts the ceramics stuff deep enough that compounding does not remove it all. Even pane wipe can’t get all the oils out of the cervices. So when you do go to coat the car when you run your applicator across the crevices the coating can bond to the ceramic stuff in PRIME instead of polishing oils..........Is this a gimmick? I don’t know I love the thought process behind it and the way of thinking.

Has any one use any other products or have a link to a great thread.

Mckees 914 was my preferred WW until I tried this.

To the others that stated the wax or sealant was effected they should real explain this as something different than WW this is more of a mix between car wash soap and panel prep. They should warn people and call it a Waterless Prep solution or indicate it’s stronger than other WW. For the person that does not have a coated car you would probably be better off with ONR, Ultima WW

 

[acuRAS82]

Based on this thread I bought feynlab pure rinseless. It was exactly the wash solution I was looking for. Anyone that has a coated car will have the same issues I had. When I sprayed ONR, N-914, Wipeout, ect. The coating causes the waterless wash solution to bead up. Even if you sprayed and sprayed the other WW don’t have the ability to lay flat on the coating. I was always worried about the bare paint between the beads getting marred.

Feynlab is the exact opposite it must be specially designed to lay flat no matter what the contact angle is. My CQUK did not bead feynlab WW solution, every square inch of my paint was covered in WW solution. I did not feel guilty and lazy . I felt like I could trust the product.

I have seen videos on YouTube about cleaning power. I thought they were exaggerated it turns out the product really has ability to clean wheels and lift dirt off the wheel if you spray with the nozzle close to the wheel. I mixed 15MlLs to 1 gallon it seems like that is unrealistic amount to a gallon and the first time I did 25mls it was too strong and streaked, it felt like normal car wash solution.

They remind me of an American version of IGL.

They have another product called PRIME it is a special clay lube that fills all the valleys and pits of clear coat it has to be used before polishing/compounding. It is supposed to have ceramic ingredients fill these voids so that polishing oils can’t fill in these spaces. It puts the ceramics stuff deep enough that compounding does not remove it all. Even pane wipe can’t get all the oils out of the cervices. So when you do go to coat the car when you run your applicator across the crevices the coating can bond to the ceramic stuff in PRIME instead of polishing oils..........Is this a gimmick? I don’t know I love the thought process behind it and the way of thinking.

Has any one use any other products or have a link to a great thread.

Mckees 914 was my preferred WW until I tried this.

To the others that stated the wax or sealant was effected they should real explain this as something different than WW this is more of a mix between car wash soap and panel prep. They should warn people and call it a Waterless Prep solution or indicate it’s stronger than other WW. For the person that does not have a coated car you would probably be better off with ONR, Ultima WW

Well put, on all accounts. I use mine now only on my coated wheels and glass. I tried it weeks ago on my ceramic wax test area and it improved the behavior on those for a bit... but they were already toast and may have also been weakened some by it.

The consistency is definitely one of a kind. Had they marketed it better or provided warnings for non-coating usage (i.e. “this will change/reduce the properties”) then it would have saved a poor sap like me from ruining a few tests. But overall it’s really good at what it really does.

The only other Feynlab product I have is Ceramic Spray Sealant but haven’t used to any significant degree. It’s supposed to be really good. They seem to be a high quality company focused on coatings/ceramics.

 

[William_Wallace]

Well put, on all accounts. I use mine now only on my coated wheels and glass. I tried it weeks ago on my ceramic wax test area and it improved the behavior on those for a bit... but they were already toast and may have also been weakened some by it.

The consistency is definitely one of a kind. Had they marketed it better or provided warnings for non-coating usage (i.e. “this will change/reduce the properties”) then it would have saved a poor sap like me from ruining a few tests. But overall it’s really good at what it really does.

The only other Feynlab product I have is Ceramic Spray Sealant but haven’t used to any significant degree. It’s supposed to be really good. They seem to be a high quality company focused on coatings/ceramics.

Well I’m looking forward to your review. I see some Feynlab authorized detailer use it as their sealant option if customers don’t want the coating applied

 

[DetailZeus]

Based on this thread I bought feynlab pure rinseless. It was exactly the wash solution I was looking for. Anyone that has a coated car will have the same issues I had. When I sprayed ONR, N-914, Wipeout, ect. The coating causes the waterless wash solution to bead up. Even if you sprayed and sprayed the other WW don’t have the ability to lay flat on the coating. I was always worried about the bare paint between the beads getting marred.

Feynlab is the exact opposite it must be specially designed to lay flat no matter what the contact angle is. My CQUK did not bead feynlab WW solution, every square inch of my paint was covered in WW solution. I did not feel guilty and lazy . I felt like I could trust the product [...]

Totally agree with the part about wetting. I don`t have the original link on hand but this was a post from the chemist I clipped from the sister forum. You can probably google it.

" A tip is to apply whatever wash solution and see what happens. If it beads up or instantly runs off, it is far from ideal. We encounter this all the time where we have low energy finishes and associated products which simply are incapable of wetting them properly. The reality is that most coatings are absolutely NOT easy clean, they are actually `hard to dirty` - the difference is subtle if you don`t know your cleaning chemistry, but absolutely crucial. Water based cleaning is almost always reliant on `wetting` the soiling - that`s almost the most fundamental cleaning principle that exists. Coatings are often really water repellent - they are really hard to wet. If the wash solution beads, it isn`t wetting well at all. What this means is that your wash is not gently lifting soiling which has been mostly loosened by a wash, it means that your wash media is mechanically removing the soil with limited real help from the solution until you have actually removed it from the surface (at which point, the solution might help lubricate or suspend). Basically you are sanding the surface. The coatings should be really tough to damage but, because we have so few appropriate cleaners, we are negating the protection because cleaning becomes more mechanically abrasive."


It looks like feynlab gets this. Food for thought.

 

[TheMeanGreen]

I completely understand this logic, and the reason that I really like Pure Rinseless. PR just takes too big of bites out of my sealants.

 

[William_Wallace]

I would like to see some of the YouTube channels test these products like spray sealant

 

[acuRAS82]

Bump!

I just wanted to give a heads up that I used Pure Rinseless as my clay lube because it seemed like a good idea, trying to strip the old LSP anyways and it’s very lubricating...

But silly me didn’t do a thorough dry off, figuring that there’s no harm in letting the excess lube sit around until I did a coating prep wash the next morning. The areas where the Pure Rinseless solution sat around crevices and on horizontal panels dried the paint out. It had a chalky look but it wasn’t residue to my knowledge.

Luckily, the polishing step fixed the dryness, but Pure R is not something I’ll try as clay lube in the future since its strong.

Additionally, there was noticeable marring left in some areas but I can’t pin it onPure Rinseless. I used a new clay mitt and perhaps didn’t fully remove the protective later.

Definitely my most frightening clay experience!

 

[Accumulator]

..there was noticeable marring left in some areas but I can’t pin it onPure Rinseless. I used a...clay mitt ...

That just reinforces me determination to never use a clay mitt/towel, for which *I* would probably blame the marring. Should`ve been able to see it immediately while doing the work, the way you can with conventional clay, so you could stop and switch to some less damaging approach.

 

[Stokdgs]

That just reinforces me determination to never use a clay mitt/towel, for which *I* would probably blame the marring. Should`ve been able to see it immediately while doing the work, the way you can with conventional clay, so you could stop and switch to some less damaging approach.

Hello, Hermano, hope all is well and safe up there in NEOH..

I have only used one vulcanized rubber towel ever, to replace claybars and it is this one - https://www.autopia-carcare.com/speedy-prep-towel.html#.Xt1Jm9WpH3g

Have also only used one claybar lube because it is the best for me ever, and it is this one - https://www.autopia-carcare.com/dodo-juice-clay-lubricant.html#.Xt1HT9WpH3g

The instructions for this Speedy Prep Towel say to avoid using soap and water as a lubricant, and do not use it on hot surfaces because it may cause the rubber to melt..
Dan F


I have only used it a zillion times inside the garage after the wash, and it has never messed me up.. Sometimes, the embedded gunk is so thick on paintwork, that I have to go over a few places again, to make sure the surface is all the same smoothness, so it all matches..

I like that it is a towel big enough to fold 4 times, so I have 4 surfaces to use before I rinse it out..
Dan F

 

[acuRAS82]

That just reinforces me determination to never use a clay mitt/towel, for which *I* would probably blame the marring. Should`ve been able to see it immediately while doing the work, the way you can with conventional clay, so you could stop and switch to some less damaging approach.

So I’ve used the BF clay mitt before with no noticeable marring (to my knowledge). For this session I started with a new one and used it on a window for a minute, which I’d directed in order to remove whatever protection layer exists on the mitt. So was thinking I didn’t do that very well.

I should have seen marring but was doing this at night in my mediocre lit garage (I do my hobby around my job and parenting the best I can which often is nights). Black car, blah lighting and me knowing I’m prepping for polish, I sped along fairly carelessly. However, now that I’ve seen most of the car up close in good light, the only significant mar spots were on the hood where the WG ceramics were protecting. This was also the spot I started the claying process.

So me being a little careless and tired, new lube texture, new mitt... I was probably asking for a problem to occur and am lucky it was only to a 2’x2’ area. But hopefully life goes back to normal soon and I can get some more daylight hobby time.

 

[Accumulator]

Stokdgs- We`re doing fine here, hope all is well with you too.

Although I kneejerk against DodoJuice stuff (due to its boutique/etc. angle), that lube does sound good. I dunno if you`ve ever tried Sonus Glyde, but it sounds similar to that.

When it comes to the towels/etc. not marring for *you*, I`ll observe that you can do other stuff (e.g., finish out via rotary) that I don`t expect others (myself included) to be capable of

Also, I suspect that most here, especially you Pros, are dealing with much worse contamination than I ever have to deal with. I mean..when I finally clayed the Dailies after *years* it turned out to be a waste of time as virtually nothing came off...

acuRAS82- OK, sounds like you`re on top of it.

Though I simply don`t see how people can use those things without some degree of marring. Sheesh, I have to work inch-by-inch, literally, to clay without marring, taking every conceivable precaution.

 

[acuRAS82]

The only other thing I can add to this step in the process of paint correction is that one has to handle this step with finesse, "soft hands", and all in straight lines..
Not like you are sanding down a rough piece of hardwood, etc.. One has to strive to "feel" what is going on under that media, listen to the sound, feel the resistance, and not just put full weight on and go hard on it..

It is Paint, it is hard, medium, soft, super soft, extremely finicky, and everything in between..

And all under the best lighting you can provide.. No exceptions.. You have to see, hear, and feel, what is going on under your hand, ALL the way around the vehicle..
I even take the time to Dry each section I just did, dry my clean, bare, hand, and run it over that section to insure it is exactly as smooth as the previous one, and of course, look it over under that excellent lighting, to know what I just did..
Dan F

Lol, you make me feel like a jackass. But clay is clay and I’ve done it enough to know about the worst I can do to my paint in poor lighting at night... but although I don’t particularly make love to the clay mitt, I do hold it very lightly and go in straight lines. Whatever I harm will just be more work for myself during the next correction step. But this is all in the name of juggling real life with hobbies, and I consider myself a lucky man to do everything I enjoy, even if at odd hours.

 

[Coatings=crack]

Speed shine an amazing lube and their brilliant shine synth clay puck is better than the couple of other towels and mitts i’ve tried


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[Stokdgs]

Lol, you make me feel like a jackass. But clay is clay and I’ve done it enough to know about the worst I can do to my paint in poor lighting at night... but although I don’t particularly make love to the clay mitt, I do hold it very lightly and go in straight lines. Whatever I harm will just be more work for myself during the next correction step. But this is all in the name of juggling real life with hobbies, and I consider myself a lucky man to do everything I enjoy, even if at odd hours.

Mi Hermano,
I am so sorry ! I would never say something to do that to you or anyone..
Please know, I was just thinking out loud how I do it, and nothing more..
I will delete that post now..
So sorry...
Dan F

 

[acuRAS82]

Mi Hermano,
I am so sorry ! I would never say something to do that to you or anyone..
Please know, I was just thinking out loud how I do it, and nothing more..
I will delete that post now..
So sorry...
Dan F

Nooo! Please, I was joking. I think you already deleted but add back if you have copied somewhere.

I was just alluding to how detailed and sensual you make the claying process sound, which is awesome. And then you have me at midnight in a dingy one car garage butchering away, it was funny in my head. The way you described is how one should think while claying. It can help someone in the future. I understood what you meant through all of it, it’s what mist of us strive for.

add it back?