Would like to switch to HD products for my shop

Unless you are willing to reword your reply, there is a huge difference between getting some dusting AND dusts quite a bit.



If the product is dusting A LOT it is not normal. CUT was designed to have no dust to very little dust. Having 20 years of experience doesn't help your case either, since that may mean 20 years of bad habits. You need to use little of HD CUT, unlike the products of yesteryears. I also "helped" formulating HD CUT while working for 3D. I know the product a little.



We are all here to learn, leave the EGO at the front door. None of us are right all the time and that includes you too. 105 dusts a lot, 101 dusts a lot. HD CUT doesn't. It can dust a little, if you prime your pads or if you use too much. Adjust your amount and you will see what the label means.







primo spaghetti said:
i find cut still dusts quite a bit....
Click to expand...
 
Thomas Dekany said:
I also "helped" formulating HD CUT while working for 3D. I know the product a little.
Click to expand...



this is exactly why your opinion is biased and unreliable. its not about EGO as you so eloquently put it. its about honesty and that is why is it so hard for someone to post their true experience with a product and call it out on vendor/manufacturer supported detailing forum.



I retail 3d products and find them to be good, and work as described, but i have no problem being honest about a products performance in my experience.



i dont know how that means the EGO needs to be checked. experience was called out and responded to. thats all.
 
What are you talking about? My opinion is biased? Where do you get that from? You make money off it and you are calling me dishonest?



Sounds like your ego got hurt, even though I didn't directly address you, simply replied to the OP. YOU didn't like that maybe you were the reason. Is that not ego?



I have been using HD stuff since 2009, I think I have a little more experience than most with their polishes. Sorry if I call it the way I see it.



This is the forum where you can speak your mind. The only one. However, if it is the user, and not the product, and if I happen to see it, I will let the person know. That is all.



Now, if you are having issues with the product like dusting, and you have people purchasing it from you, how can you sell it as a no dust polish/compound and feel good about that?



And you are calling me dishonest? You better look in the mirror my friend. You should also ask 3D for help if you can't make any of their products work instead of posting it on the forum. Because you are shooting yourself in the foot. Do you not see that? Talk with Francisco at 3D. He is a true master with the rotary, or DA. He can help you fine tune and eliminate most dusting issues.



primo spaghetti said:
this is exactly why your opinion is biased and unreliable. its not about EGO as you so eloquently put it. its about honesty and that is why is it so hard for someone to post their true experience with a product and call it out on vendor/manufacturer supported detailing forum.



I retail 3d products and find them to be good, and work as described, but i have no problem being honest about a products performance in my experience.



i dont know how that means the EGO needs to be checked. experience was called out and responded to. thats all.
Click to expand...
 
Thomas Dekany said:
What are you talking about? My opinion is biased? Where do you get that from? You make money off it and you are calling me dishonest?



Sounds like your ego got hurt, even though I didn't directly address you, simply replied to the OP. YOU didn't like that maybe you were the reason. Is that not ego?



I have been using HD stuff since 2009, I think I have a little more experience than most with their polishes. Sorry if I call it the way I see it.



This is the forum where you can speak your mind. The only one. However, if it is the user, and not the product, and if I happen to see it, I will let the person know. That is all.



Now, if you are having issues with the product like dusting, and you have people purchasing it from you, how can you sell it as a no dust polish/compound and feel good about that?



And you are calling me dishonest? You better look in the mirror my friend. You should also ask 3D for help if you can't make any of their products work instead of posting it on the forum. Because you are shooting yourself in the foot. Do you not see that? Talk with Francisco at 3D. He is a true master with the rotary, or DA. He can help you fine tune and eliminate most dusting issues.
Click to expand...



no ego hurt here my friend. and for the record, i never called you dishonest...just un biased..big difference like you pointed out between dusts quite a bit and a little dusting. lets not forget you are the one that called me out in post 10...then told someone that dusting is not an issue at all in post 12...it seems that you cant quite make up your mind whether the product dusts, whether the user doesnt know what they are doing, or whether some dusting is acceptable. the question by the OP in post 6 as to whether dusting is compared to m105 (which in my experience dusts alot [not quite a bit]) and you repsonded not at all...seriously..what is it..not at all or sometimes...make up your mind.



anyhow, this is my last post on the topic. my business plan does not include blowing smoke up a customers ***...i could care less if i sell 3d, meguiars, optimum, whatever..it doesnt matter to me. what matters to me is honesty, integrity, and customer service. the last thing i want is to deal with a customer who read on a label that doenst was not an issue at all as you siad, and they call and complain that it does dust...im about providing opinions, based on experience, and when a customer has a reasonbale expectation, they are reqrded with extreme satisfaction.



ive got no problem calling a spade a spade, and i really dont care about your opinion one way or the other, but it is really sad that you cant comprehend that the product has dusted for others (and of course NOT AT ALL in your experience) and that any variation to what you have experienced is always and foremost user error. im sure you know many things contribute to dusting including humidity, techinique, ionic charge etc....



it sounds more like your ego was brusied since you "helped" develop the product and told a consumer to "read the label" because whats on the label is true. this is by far the most ridiculous thing ive ever read. lol you must like wipe new! because of the infomercial!



its very sad...ive read many other of your posts, and you seem experienced and knowledgeable, but obviously i caught you at a bad time, insulted your "work to HELP manufacture the product" and obviously my my honest and unbiased un- "i invented this stuff" perception/experience with a product has offended you...and that was not my intention. i merely wanted to share my experience with the product, which did not co-incide with yours...no harm no foul in my book, but obviously thats not the case with you.



everyone listen to thomas dekany...he wrote the label, he invented the product and he has had experience since 1999 with the product..so therefore its true. i must be wrong and havent been able to hone my incorrect skills over the last 20 plus years... so for that i apologize.lol



piss off..honestly...
 
All you would need to do is to be open to the idea that it may be you. Seems like that is not an idea you are playing with. Obviously, if the product dusted for everyone or most, you would be hearing about it left and right. That is not the case.



I called you out because I know how the product works, under dry, humid, rain and everything in between types of conditions. Cut was, as all 3D products are designed to be dust free. Btw, I am sure you could also make even a wax to dust. I know I can.



FYI, I had nothing to do with whether the product was dusting or not. I am not a chemist, but worked with many versions to get the most cut while finishing down nice.



And for the last time, you should learn to use the product inside and out if you are selling it. After all, not using any product the right way and providing miss information is a disservice to your potential customers.



my honest and unbiased
Click to expand...
right - so now you are selling a line of products, where the company is dishonest about the claims they make???? :wall



You provided your experience, but that doesn't mean that you are right (dusts a lot - your words). In this case, I guarantee you it is user error. If I over apply HD CUT, or HD POLISH, (even though 3D has done everything to spread "less is more" ) I will get dusting - if you happen to apply too much use less and the dusting will go away.



I guess you are not willing to learn. Your loss.



piss off..honestly
Click to expand...
- and you try using less and learn about the products you use.





primo spaghetti said:
no ego hurt here my friend. and for the record, i never called you dishonest...just un biased..big difference like you pointed out between dusts quite a bit and a little dusting. lets not forget you are the one that called me out in post 10...then told someone that dusting is not an issue at all in post 12...it seems that you cant quite make up your mind whether the product dusts, whether the user doesnt know what they are doing, or whether some dusting is acceptable. the question by the OP in post 6 as to whether dusting is compared to m105 (which in my experience dusts alot [not quite a bit]) and you repsonded not at all...seriously..what is it..not at all or sometimes...make up your mind.



anyhow, this is my last post on the topic. my business plan does not include blowing smoke up a customers ***...i could care less if i sell 3d, meguiars, optimum, whatever..it doesnt matter to me. what matters to me is honesty, integrity, and customer service. the last thing i want is to deal with a customer who read on a label that doenst was not an issue at all as you siad, and they call and complain that it does dust...im about providing opinions, based on experience, and when a customer has a reasonbale expectation, they are reqrded with extreme satisfaction.



ive got no problem calling a spade a spade, and i really dont care about your opinion one way or the other, but it is really sad that you cant comprehend that the product has dusted for others (and of course NOT AT ALL in your experience) and that any variation to what you have experienced is always and foremost user error. im sure you know many things contribute to dusting including humidity, techinique, ionic charge etc....



it sounds more like your ego was brusied since you "helped" develop the product and told a consumer to "read the label" because whats on the label is true. this is by far the most ridiculous thing ive ever read. lol you must like wipe new! because of the infomercial!



its very sad...ive read many other of your posts, and you seem experienced and knowledgeable, but obviously i caught you at a bad time, insulted your "work to HELP manufacture the product" and obviously my my honest and unbiased un- "i invented this stuff" perception/experience with a product has offended you...and that was not my intention. i merely wanted to share my experience with the product, which did not co-incide with yours...no harm no foul in my book, but obviously thats not the case with you.



everyone listen to thomas dekany...he wrote the label, he invented the product and he has had experience since 1999 with the product..so therefore its true. i must be wrong and havent been able to hone my incorrect skills over the last 20 plus years... so for that i apologize.lol



piss off..honestly...
Click to expand...
 
Well well well wasnt that interesting? {in my best church chat lady voice}
Church-Lady-Dana-Carvey.jpg


and here it all started out as a guy who was interested in becoming a authorized dealer and what pads to use. Which, BTW never got asnwered. THis I would like to know myself.
 
SSizzlin' said:
Website claims 1200 grit on cured paint.
Click to expand...

You're totally correct. Even better!!!:happy:



solekeeper said:
Fantastic! We order lots of stuff from kemperle. David, or anyone can you guys recommend the different pads to use these two polishes? You have no idea how excited iam to try these two polishes. loll.. I'm taking it these are much better than m105.
Click to expand...

It depends on what grit you are sanding to? I am 10000% confident that you will like the new HD Turkish Lambs Wool pads, but (from my recollection) you are using 2000 grit by hand? If that is the case, you should be just fine using the HD Orange foam pad. 2 Steps is all that is usually needed depending on how soft your clear is?



solekeeper said:
How is the dusting compared to m105 compared to HD cut?
Click to expand...

M105 is a great compound (and I still use it), but is notorious for heavy dusting. Not such a big deal in a body shop environment, but it can cause you to do more work at the end by rewashing.

solekeeper said:
With cut and polish, right?
Click to expand...



Dusting with all of the HD polishing compounds is *usually* a biproduct of overworking of the product, too much product and/or not cleaning your pad. If you dial in your technique, you will not have an issue. You'll get more dust settling on your vehicles from your body shop air then you will from HD's products. :grinno:



Looking forward to you pulling the trigger and trying HD CUT & Polish out!
 
The HD pads work great for both of these products, as well as Optimum Microfibers and LC CCS pads. I have yet to find a pad that doesn't perform well with Polish, whereas with Cut it seems that foam pads finish better and with less hassle of removal.
 
David Fermani said:
Mark - you ever try the HD microfiber pads?
Click to expand...



Never have. I haven't even been able to find them on the website. Do they have two different grades like OPT and Megs?



I know LC made their MF pads only one grade and more product dependent and they are some of the worst MF's on the market.
 
IHA Mark said:
Never have. I haven't even been able to find them on the website. Do they have two different grades like OPT and Megs?



I know LC made their MF pads only one grade and more product dependent and they are some of the worst MF's on the market.
Click to expand...



There are no HD MF pads on either the 3D or the HD website. Perhaps you meant the Buff & Shine MF pads which do come in a cutting pad and polishing pad Buff and Shine - Autoality Incorporated
 
Hey David, thanks for the reply. So I would use the HD cut with the turkish wool, then follow up with HD polish on the orange? Am I understanding correctly?



And this should put me at what percentage correction? (I feel like i'm missing a step, for say a black vehicle)



And yes we are sanding with 2k grit, we have stopped wetsanding. We use 2k sandpaper (dry) and we also just purchased a mini air sander. (still learning the ropes on this, however)





And we are using PPG clear, somewhat hard. But corrects well.. nothing overly complicated.
 
Naturally on black you will do an additional step with a finishing pad. Especially non metallic black.



the wool can remove everything. Wait till you try this. And you don't need high rpms either.
 
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