I think i have to buff again

B

blownvert

New member
I have a black g35x and for the first time buffing this car i thought i would remove most of the swirld/scratches. i have a pc 7424. Honestly after 12 hours, paint is very smooth, but the swirls and some heavy scratches or i dont even know if there heavy are there still. im not blown away from the work and time i put into it. it looks great in no sunlight lol. today was very sunny and the sun hit the car and i was just looking, it just doesnt look very deep wet amazed look. i saw awful scratches/swirls on side of fender. i dont even if i did that after or was there before. I thought the PC could do some good correction. Maybe i wasnt pressing down hard enough to work it in? I used the orange with 2.5, it did nothing seemed like getting scratches out so i bumped it up to yellow and did whole car with yellow then followed it with white on srr1. Was that a mistake? Did i put more scratches in with that?





wash

claybar

ssr 2.5

ssr1

pink moose

PB EX

CMW

Then day later applied Nattys blue.
 
OK, what you want to do is pick a small section and try out different products (pads, compounds, polishes) until you find the combo that corrects that one small area. Don't go any further until you find the combo that works, otherwise you risk spending 12 hours on a car and having to do it all over again. You also need to have some kind of lighting that allows you to see the defects so you can check your progress.



It is possible that 2.5 on a yellow pad left some hazing that the SSR 1 on white wasn't able to remove. The actual scratches were most likely already there, at least that is my guess. I'd say it's time for you to invest in some 4" orange pads and a 3.5" backing plate.
 
As always, John has great info there. About the only thing I could add is that you might need to rethink your polishes. The PC has very limited correction ability (as you found out). That being the case, you need to use the most agressive polishes in each category. For finishing polishes, that's PO106FF and PO85RD. In medium weight polishes, menzerna sip and 1z intensive paste are the champs. In heavy compounds, you'll probably do well with Megs M95. These polishes have the most horsepower in their respecitve classes. That's what you need to help give the PC a little additional muscle. I'd take John's advice and start with SIP and an orange (yellow LC foam pads suck. They can leave terrible marring that requires a rotary to remove) LC pad, or if you have them 3.5" Purple Foamed Wool pads. PFW are *really* easy to use, and will give you much better cut and finish than the yellow LC foam. Try that combo for most of your correction After the swirls and defects are out, switch to a 4" white LC pad, and go to PO106FF for at least two full applications. Speaking of applications, you may need to do several applications of SIP followed by several applications of 106 to have your car looking it's best.



Good luck!
 
I have one question have you ever removed defects before?



if the answer is no

then you need to work on your basics

before you worry about trying new products

slow down, work on a small area, use speed 6, add pressure

(I thinnk from your other thread you were using too much polish and maybe polishing too long, from the amount of dust you got)
 
I had a similar experience when I first started using my PC 7424. I discovered it was my technique, not the products that prevented me from removing defects. Here's what I learned:



1. Don't use too much product. 2 or 3 pea sized dots are sufficient.



2. Put a mark on the back of the pad (the side facing up when you are polishing) so you can observe how fast the pad is rotating. It should rotate 1 to 2 times per second when you are polishing if you are applying the right amount of pressure.



3. Work the product in thoroughly. I was afraid of working it too much so as a result I wasn't working it in enough. It was hard to wipe off the residue, and the polish couldn't do it's work.



4. Clean the pad after every application using a terry cloth towel in your hand and holding it up against the spinning pad. When product builds up on the pad you'll get poor results. Switch pads when a pad gets gummed up if you have to.



5. Work in small areas, 12 x 12 with your more aggressive polishes. Use a 50/50 mix of water and alcohol to remove polishing oils that may be filling in defects in between passes to inspect your work.



6. Use a high quality microfiber towel to remove the polish residue. Cheapo micro fibers towels can mar the surface (learned this one the hard way!)



Good luck :up
 
kerrinjeff said:
I had a similar experience when I first started using my PC 7424. I discovered it was my technique, not the products that prevented me from removing defects. Here's what I learned:



1. Don't use too much product. 2 or 3 pea sized dots are sufficient.



2. Put a mark on the back of the pad (the side facing up when you are polishing) so you can observe how fast the pad is rotating. It should rotate 1 to 2 times per second when you are polishing if you are applying the right amount of pressure.



3. Work the product in thoroughly. I was afraid of working it too much so as a result I wasn't working it in enough. It was hard to wipe off the residue, and the polish couldn't do it's work.



4. Clean the pad after every application using a terry cloth towel in your hand and holding it up against the spinning pad. When product builds up on the pad you'll get poor results. Switch pads when a pad gets gummed up if you have to.



5. Work in small areas, 12 x 12 with your more aggressive polishes. Use a 50/50 mix of water and alcohol to remove polishing oils that may be filling in defects in between passes to inspect your work.



6. Use a high quality microfiber towel to remove the polish residue. Cheapo micro fibers towels can mar the surface (learned this one the hard way!)



Good luck :up
Click to expand...
I agree expect for #5. I would do a 2'X2' section.
 
BigJimZ28 said:
I have one question have you ever removed defects before?



if the answer is no

then you need to work on your basics

before you worry about trying new products

slow down, work on a small area, use speed 6, add pressure

(I thinnk from your other thread you were using too much polish and maybe polishing too long, from the amount of dust you got)
Click to expand...



this is actually my 2nd time buffing. my paint is smooth but all the defects like scratches seem to still be there. Maybe the PC cant correct that. My fingernail cant grab it so it can come out.
 
SuperBee364 said:
As always, John has great info there. About the only thing I could add is that you might need to rethink your polishes. The PC has very limited correction ability (as you found out). That being the case, you need to use the most agressive polishes in each category. For finishing polishes, that's PO106FF and PO85RD. In medium weight polishes, menzerna sip and 1z intensive paste are the champs. In heavy compounds, you'll probably do well with Megs M95. These polishes have the most horsepower in their respecitve classes. That's what you need to help give the PC a little additional muscle. I'd take John's advice and start with SIP and an orange (yellow LC foam pads suck. They can leave terrible marring that requires a rotary to remove) LC pad, or if you have them 3.5" Purple Foamed Wool pads. PFW are *really* easy to use, and will give you much better cut and finish than the yellow LC foam. Try that combo for most of your correction After the swirls and defects are out, switch to a 4" white LC pad, and go to PO106FF for at least two full applications. Speaking of applications, you may need to do several applications of SIP followed by several applications of 106 to have your car looking it's best.



Good luck!
Click to expand...



I think i have terrible marring. I thought SSR Line was good, now i basically have to buy and try a whole new line. Whats with 1z intensive paste and Megs #95 if you didnt tell me to use it in the buffing at the bottom? I just want everything gone from my car lol. I wasted all this time. I saw the 3.5 purple wool pad, would that replace orange? So i have to get 3.5" BP now with just 4" orange pads?
 
kerrinjeff said:
1. Don't use too much product. 2 or 3 pea sized dots are sufficient.



2. Put a mark on the back of the pad (the side facing up when you are polishing) so you can observe how fast the pad is rotating. It should rotate 1 to 2 times per second when you are polishing if you are applying the right amount of pressure.



3. Work the product in thoroughly. I was afraid of working it too much so as a result I wasn't working it in enough. It was hard to wipe off the residue, and the polish couldn't do it's work.



4. Clean the pad after every application using a terry cloth towel in your hand and holding it up against the spinning pad. When product builds up on the pad you'll get poor results. Switch pads when a pad gets gummed up if you have to.



5. Work in small areas, 12 x 12 with your more aggressive polishes. Use a 50/50 mix of water and alcohol to remove polishing oils that may be filling in defects in between passes to inspect your work.



6. Use a high quality microfiber towel to remove the polish residue. Cheapo micro fibers towels can mar the surface (learned this one the hard way!)
Click to expand...



i was going to say the same things, only exception is step 4. i used 3 oranges w/ SIP and 3 whites w/ 106FF on a bmw 3 series, split the car into thirds and switched to a new pad b4 the existing pad got gummed up. i find working w/ fresh pads to be much much easier.
 
blownvert said:
..........I thought SSR Line was good, now i basically have to buy and try a whole new line. ............I saw the 3.5 purple wool pad, would that replace orange? So i have to get 3.5" BP now with just 4" orange pads?
Click to expand...
The SSR line of polishes have worked well for a lot of people over the years. If you have one of the harder clear coats then a PC with standard size pads (> 6") and the SSR's might be struggling. Supe made some good suggestions on polishes if you want to give them a try, but you need to get some smaller pads to get more cut out of your PC. 4" pads with a 3.5" BP or the 3.5" PFW with a smaller BP for spot corrections. Accumulator has a pretty good thread about PWF and the PC in this forum.



Remember to think about your technique as BigJim mentioned and don't do the whole car until you find a combo that works on your test section. Below is a link to a DA guide and also the PWF thread I mentioned:



http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/images/misc/dapolishing.pdf



http://www.autopia.org/forum/machin...purple-foamed-wool-pads-via-pc-very-long.html
 
Eliot Ness said:
The SSR line of polishes have worked well for a lot of people over the years. If you have one of the harder clear coats then a PC with standard size pads (> 6") and the SSR's might be struggling. Supe made some good suggestions on polishes if you want to give them a try, but you need to get some smaller pads to get more cut out of your PC. 4" pads with a 3.5" BP or the 3.5" PFW with a smaller BP for spot corrections. Accumulator has a pretty good thread about PWF and the PC in this forum.



Remember to think about your technique as BigJim mentioned and don't do the whole car until you find a combo that works on your test section. Below is a link to a DA guide and also the PWF thread I mentioned:



http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/images/misc/dapolishing.pdf



http://www.autopia.org/forum/machin...purple-foamed-wool-pads-via-pc-very-long.html
Click to expand...





Thanks, i also do have a big tripod work light. I should of stayed on the hood where i saw the scratches. I went over it a few times and it really didnt clear up. So i just moved on to do the whole car. I want everything to clear up and dissapear. Maybe i didnt push down hard enough.
 
blownvert said:
I think i have terrible marring. I thought SSR Line was good, now i basically have to buy and try a whole new line. Whats with 1z intensive paste and Megs #95 if you didnt tell me to use it in the buffing at the bottom? I just want everything gone from my car lol. I wasted all this time. I saw the 3.5 purple wool pad, would that replace orange? So i have to get 3.5" BP now with just 4" orange pads?
Click to expand...



Always start with the least agressive method first. That's why I recommended you start with either the SIP or 1Z Intensive *first*, then -only if necessary- move up to M95. There's no reason to remove more clear than necessary.
 
SSR2.5 left some nasty marring and hazing on a black Porsche Cayenne I did, took forever to get rid of it.



I find that Meguiars #83 followed by #80 works well on softer black paints like the G35.



Make sure you use enough pressure to bog the PC then back off just enough to bring it back up to speed. Use that pressure, keep the speed on 6 and move the PC about 1" per second using 50% overlapping passes for best results.
 
Scottwax said:
SSR2.5 left some nasty marring and hazing on a black Porsche Cayenne I did, took forever to get rid of it.



I find that Meguiars #83 followed by #80 works well on softer black paints like the G35.



Make sure you use enough pressure to bog the PC then back off just enough to bring it back up to speed. Use that pressure, keep the speed on 6 and move the PC about 1" per second using 50% overlapping passes for best results.
Click to expand...



im going to try again a full buff on monday besides clay since i just basically clayed.
 
Scottwax said:
SSR2.5 left some nasty marring and hazing on a black Porsche Cayenne I did, took forever to get rid of it.



I find that Meguiars #83 followed by #80 works well on softer black paints like the G35.



Make sure you use enough pressure to bog the PC then back off just enough to bring it back up to speed. Use that pressure, keep the speed on 6 and move the PC about 1" per second using 50% overlapping passes for best results.
Click to expand...





I'd agree with this advice, try a different polish like the above mentioned, follow the technique scott describes and mark the backing plate with a line from spindle to outer, so you can see the speed of spin, without a marked plate on the PC it's very hard to judge if the machine is just stalling completely.
 
It doesn't sound *to me* like the problem is too-soft paint, but rather ineffective pad/product/technique issues.



The 3.5" PFW, with 1Z Pasta Intensiv, will remove most anything that's safe to remove, at least on medium-hard clear. And it does it so easily that I have *zero* doubt it'll do it on harder paint too.



blownvert- Get some smaller pads. The 3.5" PFW will replace the orange/yellow cutting pads and yeah, it's a whole lot more effective. It'll leave some marks so plan to go over the same area with the same product (again, I highly recommend 1Z Pasta Intensiv) with a milder pad (the 4" Cyclo brand green works well IME).



Then do a final-polish follow up.



The three steps will go a *lot* faster than anything else I can think of (and that's quite a long list of options ;) ). Check out my thread on the 3.5" PFW pads, I'm pretty sure it'll be worth your time.



I'm not a huge fan of Menzerna 106FF due to the way it can hide stuff, which only comes back after quite a while (apparently not as easy as just doing an IPA wipe :think: ). Never used it myself, but I've seen the problem first-hand. My same-old advice still holds: "when it comes to polishes, if you have to ask then the answer is 1Z".
 
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