Using M105 for the first time today

One last correction... After taking a very long close look at the car after the M105, there were some compounding swirls and quite a few holograms. Not nearly as bad as what I would normally get from a heavy compound, though. Not even close. In a few places, I got lucky. There were no compounding marks or swirls. I think that if you had enough practice with M105, you could consistently get no swirls or holos at all from it. I think that Tdekany and Howareb were getting these kind of results (no holos or swirls).
 
Okay, this my experience only....



M105 features a very hard abrasive that breaks down very slowly (everything breaks down). By adding additional lubrication to the mix, you are suspending these abrasvies in a meduim and allowing them to cut and cut and cut...



I believe that the quick flash of the lubricant (carefully chosen by Meguiars) is a safe guard to prevent people from over working the very aggresive nature of the abrasive.



M105 has a very different character depending on the pad used..



On a wool it has a shorter work time but cuts super fast.

On a soft finishing foam, it works a lot longer.



If you are still getting heavy hologramming you are working the product too long and going to a dry buff (very easy to do if you are using a wool pad).



Also I have noticed that this polish hates to be placed on the pad and worked in. By the time you get up to speed the lubricants are ready to flash. For best result and constienst results, apply the product to the paint and pick up the bead into the pad at full speed (I like 1700-2000 RPM with wool, 1500-1200 with foam) and work it into the paint quickly with decent arm speed and slight pressure.



Depending on conditions, the product with flash in 5-15 seconds (on wool). As soon as it starts to flash (or as you learn the product, right before) stop and wipe away. Since the abrasives do not break down in the traditonal sense, you do not have to break the compound down. What you do need to do is hit it hard, hit it fast, and wipe it off quick.
 
SuperBee364 said:
If I had the money, I would buy every Autopian an Edge 2k White Finishing wool pad. It's that good, and it's a deadly combination when used with a good finishing polish like UF, PO106FF, or PO85RD. You can buff with your eyes closed when using UF and white wool. It's that easy. And F A S T.
Click to expand...



Alright......you sold me.....:D



I'll order a few this weekend and give them a try.......:xyxthumbs



I thought the black version of the blue finishing pad was pretty close and would provide similar results but, you've sparked new intrest in Edge......
 
SuperBee364 said:
Yeah, Scott, that blue ultrafina pad is a great pad... far better than any foam pad I've used, but I don't have a backing plate big enough to use it comfortably, and the eight inch size is huge. I'm gonna try and order some of the six inchers from England.



OK, so more results...



I kinda changed my plans a bit. I did half the hood with Ultrafina and a brand new white finishing wool pad. There were alot of compounding marks and holograms. Key word there is "were". ;) UF and the finishing wool destroyed them fast while leaving a mirror finish. I got alot less sling with the wool than I was getting with UF and foam. It still required using a sling bucket, though. The finish it left is beautiful.



I then finished the other half of the hood with PO85RD and the other side of the finishing wool pad. This took *much* more time than the UF. UF is a simple four-pass-and-your-done deal. With PO85RD you need to pack a lunch. It did do a good job of getting rid of the holograms and compounding marks, much to my surprise. It also left a finish almost identical to the UF; it does look a bit glossier, but not enough to be concerned about. It took quite a bit more than twice the amount of time to do this half of the hood than the UF side.



I then moved on to the roof with PO85RD and a black LC foam pad. This combo just didn't have the chops to get rid of the holos and compounding marks. I thought for sure that it would at least gloss up better than the finishing wool, but it didn't.



Moving onto the other half of the roof, I used UF and black LC foam. It did a much better job of taking out the compounding marks and holos. However, it did not finish as well as the finishing wool did. This was a big surprise. I thought that the foam would finish better than the wool, but not get out the marks as well. The sling is harder to control with the LC foam pad than the 3M Ultrafina pad.



On this particular car, the white finishing wool/UF combo flat out wins, no contest. Yeah, you could get a slightly better shine with the 85RD, but the additional time required just isn't worth it.



If I had the money, I would buy every Autopian an Edge 2k White Finishing wool pad. It's that good, and it's a deadly combination when used with a good finishing polish like UF, PO106FF, or PO85RD. You can buff with your eyes closed when using UF and white wool. It's that easy. And F A S T. The only other pad that really compares to it when used with UF is the blue pad that Scott mentioned. If we could just get it in six inch size here in the U.S...



I had been having mixed results with UF and the white wool, but I'm sure it's because my pads were on their last legs. It also feels like Edge has changed the quality of wool being used in the finishing pads. The ones I broke in today felt much softer and fluffier than my last pads.



A few weeks ago, I conceded that you can get a better finish with finishing foam and PO85RD than you could with finishing wool. That might be the case for some finishes, but today the wool triumphed over the foam by a long shot. UF and wool destroyed compounding swirls and holos in four quick passes, while leaving behind a beautiful gloss.



M105 followed by UF on either the 3m blue pad or white finishing wool makes a formidable combination when you need serious correction. I'll go snap some pics of the hood, but you're not going to be able to see a difference between the UF side and the 85RD side.
Click to expand...



Let me know if you ever do end up ordering those 6" 3M pads from the UK. I might be interested in going in on that with you. Otherwise, I'll have to get my hands on that white Edge wool pad.



You've created a detailing monster within me Supe! :grinno: Just kidding man... glad to hear your evaluations on this product and its behavior with different polishing mediums. :buffing:
 
TH0001 said:
Okay, this my experience only....



M105 features a very hard abrasive that breaks down very slowly (everything breaks down). By adding additional lubrication to the mix, you are suspending these abrasvies in a meduim and allowing them to cut and cut and cut...



I believe that the quick flash of the lubricant (carefully chosen by Meguiars) is a safe guard to prevent people from over working the very aggresive nature of the abrasive.



M105 has a very different character depending on the pad used..



On a wool it has a shorter work time but cuts super fast.

On a soft finishing foam, it works a lot longer.



If you are still getting heavy hologramming you are working the product too long and going to a dry buff (very easy to do if you are using a wool pad). All the places I had holograming or swirls were where I had polish flash over. Now it makes sense why.



Also I have noticed that this polish hates to be placed on the pad and worked in. By the time you get up to speed the lubricants are ready to flash. For best result and constienst results, apply the product to the paint and pick up the bead into the pad at full speed (I like 1700-2000 RPM with wool, 1500-1200 with foam) and work it into the paint quickly with decent arm speed and slight pressure.



Depending on conditions, the product with flash in 5-15 seconds (on wool). As soon as it starts to flash (or as you learn the product, right before) stop and wipe away. Since the abrasives do not break down in the traditonal sense, you do not have to break the compound down. What you do need to do is hit it hard, hit it fast, and wipe it off quick.
Click to expand...



I'll defnitely use this technique next chance I get to use M105. Thanks, Todd. :)
 
Dave1, you're going to love it. E2K Lambs Wool 6" Final Finish if you get them from the Geek, make sure you tell them it's part number W624.



Denzil, maybe we should see if we can get enough interest for a group buy on the 3M six inch blue waffle pads...



TH0001, thanks for the information. I always look forward to reading your posts. I learn something every time.
 
Just wanted to say thanks to everyone for the great info. I'm still waiting for my white wool from Edge/AG. So, these 3M blue waffle pads are like nothing else, eh?
 
bert31 said:
Do you find the Ultrafina pads at the same place you find Ultrafina? That would make sense but several shops that sell Ultrafina in Louisville do not sell the Ultrafina Pad.:sadpace:
Click to expand...



My 3M distributor carries both Ultrafina and the pad. :)
 
Here's the hood after UF/85RD. The right side was PO85RD, left UF. Both with white finishing wool. Man, I'm having problems focusing this camera today.



IMG_1022.jpg




IMG_1026.jpg
 
SuperBee364 said:
Here's the trunk before M105. These pictures don't really show how hammered it really was.



IMG_1008.jpg




IMG_1009.jpg




IMG_1010.jpg




Here's the PFW afer multiple passes on the trunk.



IMG_1015.jpg




Here's the amount of polish I used. Actually, it's a bit more than I was using. I got a bit ham fisted with the dots on the left side of the pad. The dots on the right side are the right size. That's enough polish to easily do a 12x12 sized area.



IMG_1018.jpg




I'm gonna have to take back what I said earlier... More is *not* better. TH0001 hit it right on. Use less. I kept cutting down on the amount of polish I was using until there was hardly *any* residue left behind after two passes. If you watch Meguair's training video, you'll notice there's hardly any residue left to be wiped up. That's really what you should shoot for. It seems that it leaves the nicest finish when there's nothing left to wipe up.



Pre treating the panel with FK1 425 seemed to help quite a bit. Keeping the pad damp with QD is a must.



Here's the trunk after. The only things used on it were FK1 425 and M105. Unbelievable finish.

IMG_1019.jpg




IMG_1020.jpg




IMG_1021.jpg




There are still quite a few RIDS left in the trunk, but I wasn't shooting for 100% correction. They're just too deep. The above pictures were after three applications of M105. It didn't really need that many, I was just practicing. :)
Click to expand...



Thats about the amount i use. I tend to run a bit fast though, about 1800 rpm or so for about two hits and it does an amazing amount of correction. Finishes nice too, 106 on a grey pad finishes well and you have a stellar finish in a fraction of the time that would other times require.
 
swirlnuts said:
Thats about the amount i use. I tend to run a bit fast though, about 1800 rpm or so for about two hits and it does an amazing amount of correction. Finishes nice too, 106 on a grey pad finishes well and you have a stellar finish in a fraction of the time that would other times require.
Click to expand...



What pad are you using with the M105, swirlnuts?
 
for starters its a either a lambswool 6.5 inch, get it from a local dist. not sure the manufacturer, or a schlegel 8 inch twisted wool. The lambswool is much closer than the the twisted to lsp, but 106 on a grey finishes out flawless on either, even after several prepsol wipedowns. I havent had a chance to try the UF, no one around here carries it, but it sounds like a sure winner. I would also like to try out the finishing wool you talk about, i have finished halo and swirl free with lambswool but knew it could be a notch higher as far as finish, i will have to try the finish wool and see if i can get it close to the results you've been getting.
 
Good idea, TTWAGN, I had actually planned on doing that, but I got distracted by the M105 learning curve. I can see getting darn close to LSP ready with M105 and *alot* of practice. I did get lucky a few times and have it finish hologram and compounding mark free, but even in those areas, the gloss was very much improved by a finishing polish. Maybe in the hands of a pro M105 could be used as a single-step, but definitely not by me.



I'd love to see Totoland Mach, Scottwax, Rydawg, Picus, David Fermani, TH0001, or any of the other pros whose names escape me right now take a crack at one stepping M105. I'd bet the results would be amazing.
 
SuperBee364 said:
Maybe in the hands of a pro M105 could be used as a single-step, but definitely not by me.I'd love to see Totoland Mach, Scottwax, Rydawg, Picus, David Fermani, TH0001, or any of the other pros whose names escape me right now take a crack at one stepping M105. I'd bet the results would be amazing.
Click to expand...



Definitely not me either.....



But, when did the fastest cutting new big dog on the block turn into a one step deal...?



M105 has it's place and a final finishing polish for most clear coats probably isn't in the cards. I'll bet one might be able get away with pulling it off using a mix on certain cars and certain colors, a mill yellow C5 would be a perfect subject. Hard clear and a very forgiving color....



A black car with soft paint is a whole different ballgame though......



That said.....A M105 mix with white wool sounds like your next project SB.......:D



You know your white wool so, get the mix down and you'll be good to go......M105/ 85RD..../UF...../FPII..../DWG......ect......



I'll bet you can do it......:xyxthumbs
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top