Revisiting an old enemy: Meg's #7

SuperBee364

SuperBee364

New member
The first and last time I used Meguiar's #7 Show Car Glaze, Ronald Reagan was in office.



I had the worst time wrestling with this stuff. I just could not seem to get it to do anything other than streak, haze, and just look yucky.



Two weeks ago I found myself in the local Autozone (another place I'm not normally allowed to go without adult supervision) to buy a windshield chip repair kit. (Totally off topic, but those kits, at eleven bucks each, are a *great* way to save yourself some cash over having a "pro" repair your windshield).



I figured that since I was saving myself thirty some odd bucks by doing my own windshield repair, I should probably have a look at the Megs stuff they had. I was specifically trying to find the new stuff: Scratch X 2.0, UC, etc. They didn't have any of that, but they did have my old nemesis: #7. So I bought a bottle.



I finally got a chance to try it out on a section of my hood yesterday. Either I've gotten a lot smarter over the last twenty years (very doubtful), or Meg's has reformulated #7 and made it easier to use. Just by following the directions on the bottle, I was able to get fantastic results. Since my car needs absolutely zero correction this year, I spent thirty minutes jeweling one half of my hood. The reult, if I do say so myself, was stunning; the PO85RD and red Edge pad had my hood looking *perfect*. I was thinking there was *no way* that any glaze was gonna be able to make my polishing look better.



As my wife would say, "Wrong". Removing the number seven residue revealed what I would consider to be the perfect surface. It had all of those properties we detailers chase: depth, glow, gloss, wetness, reflectivity, and *flake* like you can't believe. Wanting to lock that look in, I grabbed my Vintage baggy (the remnants of my cube which appears to be lost in Zymol's HQ) and waxed the section I had number seven'd. After removing the Vintage haze, I was rewarded with yet again another improvement: the paint looks like it's an inch thick.



Now I've been at this paint polishing thing since I was sixteen. I'm now forty one. I've seen my fair share of good looking paint surfaces. I've also been going crazy buying, testing, experimenting with a bunch of different glazes, LSP's, etc. So I'm not exactly a newb. Now having established what I hope is some semblance of credibility, I gotta say: it's the best looking paint I have *ever* seen.



I have no idea how much number seven will conceal defects or holos, but the MSDS sheet does say it has kaolin clay in it, which is primarily a filler, so it should provide some filling. If it does do a decent job of concealing, I could see number seven being a black car owner's nirvana.



I've read a bunch about number seven, and the general consensus is that it has about zero durability. Hopefully, locking it under a layer of a good carnauba will prevent the number seven from washing away after the first rain or wash.



Sorry guys, but no pictures. I just could not get the camera to do justice to the true appearance. The only thing I can suggest is giving it a shot yourself. Number seven is *cheap*. Go grab a bottle, prep (polish) a section of your car, use the number seven as per the instructions, and put a bit of a good 'nuba over the top of it. Then come back here and tell us (or if you have the photography skills that I dont, show us some pics) how it turned out.



I'd really like to hear how well number seven perfoms on paint that hasn't been corrected just to get an idea of what it's capable of doing.



This year, I'm dividing my car up into different test sections. It'll be interesting to see how number seven/vintage ages over the warm months. I'm hoping that the number seven won't negatively affect the Vintage's already luke warm durability. Oh, almost forgot to mention.. the "trade secret" oils in number seven make carnauba waxes extremely easy to apply and remove. Vintage isn't the most user friendly wax to apply/remove, and any help in that department is most welcome. Number seven made it easy to apply it evenly and thin. I used about half the amount of wax I normally do.



One test section is going to have number seven under a layer of 476 SD. 476 is a PITA to me. I always have trouble getting it on thin enough, which results in it being a total pain to remove. It'll be interesting to see if the number seven makes 476 easier to apply/remove.



OK, I'll quit rambling now... time to go jewel up another section of my car. :)
 
Nice write up! I'm definitely a fan of #7 myself and after reading some of Mike Phillips write up's on using it, I have had no issues at all.



It's not something I really use when doing corrections on customer cars, but I'll definitely add it to my own ride when I want that extra wet gloss look, like a car meet/show. :2thumbs:
 
SuperBee364- Glad the #7 worked out so well for you! Interesting how it boosted the looks so much (an improvement I did *not* experience last time I used Meg's similar #3 on a well-prepped b/c metallic paint).



Gee, wonder if we're gonna go full-circle here and end up raving about #7 topped with #16, something members of my family were doing ~50 years ago.
 
SuperBee364 said:
They didn't have any of that, but they did have my old nemesis: #7. So I bought a bottle.
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Good writeup and you've inspired me to try it too.



I smiled at your shopping ethic, I'm very similar.

I went to the drug store yesterday, saw my old nemesis too. I bought a bottle of Buckley's Cough Medicine ............ and I don't even have a cold.



-John C.
 
That's funny. I just used #7 yesterday afternoon for the first time in a year. Black LC Pad and speed 5 on PC on a maroon paint. Came out great. Topped with Magic Wax.
 
I agree 100%. When you get #7 to work right it looks spectacular. There is def a learning curve on how to use it properly.
 
Super can you post how exactly you used it please? I use it as well and get the exact same results.. just perfect paint... it does have very good hiding ability from what I've seen and I also plan on doing a lot of testing (on parents' cars) of different products that have little to no cutting ability just to see what to expect as far as hiding defects goes..



Oh and it's funny as I'm going to post something similar (already did on Meg's forum) regarding M80 haha... great minds think alike I guess :think:
 
I've only used a sample of it, and I think it was old when I got it, but it didnt do it for me...



Supe - could you please share how you used it and removed it to get these results ;)



thanks
 
i used #7 about a month ago after M105 and 205. on half a hood (black suburban). I didn't notice a big difference and I was about 80% corrected and just added the glaze then a cheap OTC Nauba. It's my neighbors truck and i just took a look this weekend at that side of the hood and i don't see any evidence that whatever fillers have worn off. Still looks to be at that %80 with just a few RDS left.

I'll try it again on my wife's black Mazda this weekend.



good post Superbee
 
Mike Phillips' response to other questions about #7, it's properties, difficulties (in applying) and benefits when brought up on MOL





Mike Phillips said:
For the last 15 years I have seen a lot people comment as to how hard the product is to get off.



Usually, (and I'm not saying this is what your did), the person makes a couple of mistakes.



#7 is a non-drying oil.



One of the many things it can be used for is to make paint look wet, thus the name… Show Car Glaze.



The reason it can do this is because it is a non-drying oil. Think about it, when you get a brand new paint job, or if you spray some rattle can paint… before it dries… it looks wet, because it is. It hasn't dried.



It's hard to get the "Wet Look" with something that dries, especially if it turns white/opaque.



You cannot make something "more clear" with something that is "opaque".



#26 Yellow Wax, (which is a polymer/synthetic for the most part), dries clear, it does not turn white. It turns the surface very dark and deep however.



So the mistake most people make when using the #7 is this.



1. They apply it too thick - this makes it extremely hard to remove

2. They try to remove it like a wax.



Two tips.



First Tip - Apply #7 with a thin coat



Anybody's product when applied thick is hard to remove, just read the Zaino threads. Same thing applies to most of the Meguiar's waxes. A thick coat does nothing but waste product anyway, think about it. you wipe the excess off, i.e. the stuff sitting on top.



The idea is to "Push" the product into the pores of the paint, allow it to cure or dry, (if it's a drying product) then wipe off the material remaining on the surface. Sure some product remains on the surface, and there are a lot of opinions concerning "Layering", but suffice to say, there is a point of "Diminishing Returns".



If it were true you could create a "film-build" of product, that would mean that after enough coats, you would no longer be applying a coat of product onto paint, but in fact would be applying a coat of product onto a "film-build of product", (In other words, your layers of wax/polish/protectant/polymer/sealant/synthetic, or whatever word/term you want to use to describe your protective coating.



Kind of like trying to re-create a "Clear Coat". Last time I checked, nobody's product is clear, at least not like the clear resin a clear coat of paint is made from, (clear resin is often slightly amber in color)



So I don't know if I subscribe to the "Layering" theory. I am experimenting however, with multiple coats after coat of product on my black demo panel here in my office, so far, no "visible film-build". I do believe that two thin coats are better than one, and three coats wont' hurt. After that, I don't know. I would at least let some time go by.



So apply #7 thin. Use a soft foam applicator pad.



Second Tip - Removing #7 requires a special technique, not the same kind of technique you remove a wax with.



Most people remove their wax like this. Start in one area, begin wiping until all of the wax is removed in that area and then move on to virgin territory.



This will not work for #7. The "Act" of removing #7, tends to "Re-liquefy" the product, basically creating the smearing around effect that you experience when you apply it.



Instead, "Break" or "Disrupt" the "Continuous" layer of film-build and then move on to a virgin area and "Break this film-build up.



You see, #7 doesn't actually dry, but… it will "Skin", somewhat like homemade pudding.



This "Skin" is easier to break up and remove then the more liquid film is.



By breaking up the continuous film-build and then moving on, you are exposing a fresh layer of the film to the air where it will skin. The next time you come around, it will be easier to break up and remove.



So the idea is to apply a thin coat to the entire car.



Then, go around the car two to three times, removing a little bit at a time.



A big soft, high quality, 100% cotton, terry cloth towel works best for the first two passes, and then switch over to a Microfiber polishing cloth for the last pass. Microfiber polishing cloths have an affinity for both water and oil based liquids and will remove oily residues much better with less fiber inflicted scratches.



Anyway, that’s what my experience has taught me after applying and removing gallons of #7 over the years, to every kind of car with every known type of paint.



Another person mentioned it will wash off. This is true. #7 is a "Body Shop" safe polish. It has no "Lasting Characteristics", i.e. it contains no ingredients that will affect "Paint Adhesion", typically waxes or silicones. (There are what are called, "Paintable Polymers", Meguiar's uses these in the "Speed Glaze", a body shop safe, cleaner/polish).



#7 is not meant to last. The idea is it will not semi-permanently "seal" or "Cap" the pores of the paint. (waxes, sealants, synthetics, polymers, whatever you prefer to call them act to semi-permanently seal or cap the pores of the paint. Nothing is permanent, at least not according to the theory of Entropy. This can lead into an entire discussion of "Permeable and Impermeable, but I digress).



This is important when used on solvent-borne paints because it allows the solvents to continue to work their way out of the paint resin through "capillary-action", (I think). The idea being that paint that is fully cured will be harder and last longer than paint that is not fully cured, i.e. softer and will not last as long.



How important this is to Catalyzed paints I do not know. The Synthetic wax crowd usually tells everyone it is safe to wax catalyzed paint shortly after they are sprayed. While this may be safe, I know that paint manufactures "Still" recommend waiting 30/60/90 days before you apply any type of "Sealant", i.e. wax to the surface. Best to follow manufactures recommendations when dealing with something as expensive a s new paint job, not to mention all of the work and inconvenience getting a car painted causes.



#7, in my opinion works better on single-stage finishes, either modern or traditional. For the wet-look, either Deep Crystal Polish, (very much like #7 but in Meguiar's Consumer line), is easier to apply and remove or #80 Hand Polish in the Meguiar's 80's series, (Body shop products, only comes in a quart).



I'm sorry you had a hard time applying and removing the product, perhaps if you try again, following my tips you will have better results.



By the way, as someone else commented, usually, #7 is applied first, then wax is applied over it. This is because the #7 is water soluble and the wax isn't', thus the wax will act to "Lock" or "Seal" in the #7.



However… right before a show… to make the paint look wet and to fill in hairline scratches, it is perfectly alright to apply the #7 on top of the wax, thus the name… Show Car Glaze.



It was never formulated to be a lasting product, but instead a Beauty product.



Now I know the Zaino crowd, including Sal, don't like using "oily" product on their paint for a host of reasons, I understand this fully and also agree they have a point.



With that said… if your goal is to make the paint it's darkest, deepest and wettest looking, then I submit your best bet is a product that is oily and doesn't dry. Yes, it might be temporary, but the show only last one to two days sometimes three.



The name is Show Car Glaze, not water beading, long lasting durable Miracle Wax
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Hi Superbee!



Nothing like visiting some of the oldies, it is a good product with the need for the right technique. Its MUCH easier to apply by machine!



From reading the Mike Philips post (thanks Don M for posting) he suggest #7 is good for a wet look but then suggests DC2 or Hand Polish can do the same job but easier to apply. Anyone concur?



Geoff
 
It's been awhile since I've used #81, but IME, #7 was easier than hand polish (if you are referring hand polish as #81)
 
Don M, thanks for posting the number seven info from Mike Phillips. That's what I read before trying it. Just use it according to Mike's directions and you should get great results.



When I use most glazes, I apply them with a PC and really work them in well. I didn't do that with #7. Just a couple dabs on a hand applicator, a couple of quick passes by hand, then as soon as I was done with the application, buff it off with a Eurow MF. It seems like the more you buff it with the MF, the better the look gets. It just seems kind of weird removing the product before it has dried. You would think that you're just completely removing the product you just put on, but your eyes will tell you differently.



Today's test panel is going to get the #7 applied by PC just to see how it works.



It's great to hear you guy's experiences with #7... Keep em coming!
 
I am (or was) a #7 fan, too. Unlike a lot of people (apparently) I find it very easy to use...the trick is to work it well and put it on thin, thin, thin.



Supposedly, it was developed for single-stage paint and is not for clear coat, but I think it adds wetness and depth to the color.



However, this spring I have begun using Megs #205 and Danase Wet Glaze. The #205 removes Swirls and polishes and the Wet Glaze is awesome, and so easy to work with. I top the #205 with the Danase and then cover with NXT 2.0 and Collinite 845 (heated in a microwave to approx 90-100F).



Jim
 
I have never tried applying #7 with machine, and I understand that some people have success with this method, but my impression from reading a lot of comments about #7 is that it is best applied by hand.



The key is not to allow it to dry. In his video, as well as his old Autopia article, Mike Phillips applies #7 to the entire car and then removes it; but on MOL he usually recommends that one apply and remove it one panel or section at a time.



Massage it into the paint surface and then immediately remove it with a clean microfiber towel. But you need not remove the layer of glaze all on the first try. #7 tends to "skin," like homemade pudding. You remove a layer of skin, thus exposing the pudding underneath, which will then begin to skin again. Move on to the next panel, returning to the previous panel sometime later. I usually return to the "previous" panel immediately following the "first" panel, but others come back to the previous panels after they have glazed the entire car. Does that make sense?



The important thing is not to let #7 dry and be prepared to go back over the polished panels for a second buffing.
 
Last year I did a black CR-V and applied #7 with a MF applicator. I let it dry fully in the scorching sun to see how it will react. To my surprise, it came off extremely easy. (Otherwise I always remove it in 2-3 hits)



And its look is unbelievably rich. Lovely.
 
Bence said:
Last year I did a black CR-V and applied #7 with a MF applicator. I let it dry fully in the scorching sun to see how it will react. To my surprise, it came off extremely easy. (Otherwise I always remove it in 2-3 hits)



And its look is unbelievably rich. Lovely.
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Darnit, Bence, you always seem to be able to find the words that I can't. That's *exactly* how I wanted to describe it but as usual, couldn't find the words.



I didn't apply it by PC today like I'd intended. I hand applied it just to see if yesterday's results were a fluke. They weren't. It looks beautiful.



#7 doesn't have much in the way of concealing or filling abilities. But to be fair, Meg's doesn't say that it does. It's marketed as a glossing agent, and at that it excels.



I put a nice big swath of holos on the roof of my car using one medium pressure pass of 105. I pulled it in the sun, looked at the holos, pulled it back in the garage and applied the 7. Those were some *glossy* looking holograms! If anything, it amplified them.



Another lesson learned today: Cold ONR solution makes a great carnauba spit-shining agent. I used it to spit shine the panel I did yesterday. It's a great way to spit shine carnauba even if you've driven the car, and gotten some dirt/dust on it. Just mix up some ONR with refrigerated distilled water and do a regular ONR wash. If you've never tried spit-shining a carnauba, you're really missing out on bringing your wax to it's maximum glow. It seems like the best spit-shining results are obtained at right about 12 hours after application. If you don't wait long enough, you can degrade and/or remove the wax. If you wait too long, the wax just doesn't seem to take to the spit-shine as well.



This detailing stuff can be so rewarding and fun when things turn out well. :dance
 
SBEE -



If you are on a glaze kick, try the old skool Clear Kote products the next time you have a impulse.Hands down, RMG is my go to glaze in my stash....
 
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