Really expensive waxes...

" They don't last long and the extra pop is not that much better to justify them costing 2-10 times as much as P21s."



I've tried Zymol NSX, Destiny and Atlantique and I think the P21S looks better.
 
Not if you're a UK Porsche or Ferrari owner! They are all raving about the Zymol range but then again they've been told by several "valeting" companies that clay treatment is a highly technical, longwinded process costing hundreds of pounds and that Zymol is different to other waxes because, and I quote "it doesn't remove swirl marks, it hides them by filling them" and that "it won't remove paint like most waxes do".



To avoid the good folks at Autopia telling me off I can send anyone who wants it a copy of the article in which these quotes appeared if PM sent.



I'm sure Zymol is very good, personally I couldn't justify testing my "is it XX times better than....?" equation in the first place bit I honestly can't see the basic wax (Carbon?) for dark coloured cars being 5 pr 6 times better than Nattys etc.



Anyone wanting to send me some free Zymol, please go right ahead and I'll happily test my theory....
 
Zymol, if applied right, will last as long as any wax (Lots of experience). I refuse, though, to tell you whether my brand of zymol is better than p21s, because I have a lot of admiration for p21s, as it is a very good wax in its own merit.



I will say, though, that I will go to my zymol brand every time for the ultimate result that I require from car #1.
 
The bit that always makes me laugh about Zymol users (and I'll hasten to add not all of them say this) is when they tell you it's the best thing for your paint because there aren't any nasty chemicals in it, it's 100% pure plant product. Well, (1) I can't see this being true, there must be some kind of solvent in it, and (2), so what?! Look at the back of your average bottle of shower gel and see how many chemicals are in it that you can't even pronounce. You're quite happy to put this on your skin but for you're chemically painted car outside only plant extract will do?!!



Weird...



Ben.
 
Scottwax said:
Especially on dark metallic blue, NXT is just incredible!



I know some people do swear by some of the more moderately priced Zymol waxes and I don't think $70 is unreasonable for Souveran since it does have a wet shimmer I haven't seen with any other product.



Are the really expensive Zymol products worth the price? They are if someone is willing to pay that much.
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I heard most of the Pebbles Beach Concours winners every year usually use Meguiar's products. Is that true?
 
A thread like this seems to pop up every month or so! :)



For the money you pay, the Zymol Concours makes you work hard. Personally, I cant be bothered re-buffing my paintwork anywhere up to 6 times after the initial application - neglect these steps and you have a hazed up paint job. If you dont apply it by hand, its streaks and smears and is plain terrible to work with. The actual hand application is not too bad - very theauraputic although you probably waste a fair amount of product.



Overall, it does look great, but not significantly better than Souveran IMO, but you certainly pay significantly more for the privilege.
 
lbls1 said:
Zymol, if applied right, will last as long as any wax (Lots of experience). I refuse, though, to tell you whether my brand of zymol is better than p21s, because I have a lot of admiration for p21s, as it is a very good wax in its own merit.



I will say, though, that I will go to my zymol brand every time for the ultimate result that I require from car #1.
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Zymol is a good wax, but the point is that for all of that extra cost is should do something that other waxes can't like last a long time. I know it may shine better than all other like Souveran, P21S, Meguiars, but is it worth 2x,5x,10x more. IMO you might get a 20% better look, but at a 500% extra cost. The old adage is true the preparation is 90% and the final product is only 10% of the results, so its not worth it to me.
 
Have you tried a Zymol product? You would need to try it (and apply it properly.....you should not have to rebuff it, or buff it aggressively after the first application if its dissolved properly) on your car to fully see what I was emphasizing.



I am not really trying to say that a Zymol is a better product than any other wax. IMO, however, the price I paid for it was justified by the result that I received from it, as opposed to some of the results I received from other leading waxes (although I really did not want to say that).
 
lbls1 said:
Have you tried a Zymol product? You would need to try it (and apply it properly.....you should not have to rebuff it, or buff it aggressively after the first application if its dissolved properly) on your car to fully see what I was emphasizing.



I am not really trying to say that a Zymol is a better product than any other wax. IMO, however, the price I paid for it was justified by the result that I received from it, as opposed to some of the results I received from other leading waxes (although I really did not want to say that).
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You may want to re-read your Zymol instructions then.

And yes I have used it, and yes it does require multiple buffs.



If you use it and like it, great for you, but IMO a fool and his money are soon parted.
 
6cyl's_of_fury said:
You may want to re-read your Zymol instructions then.

And yes I have used it, and yes it does require multiple buffs.



If you use it and like it, great for you, but IMO a fool and his money are soon parted.
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Perhaps you should re-read the instructions. I have read it, and have used it properly. The difference is IMO is that I got the full benefit of the product, thus my money was fully utilized. It did not require aggressive buffing, and once the wax dissolved fully into its resolution, it did not have to be rebuffed. It has also lasted much longer than a lot of people have said otherwise.



Thus in the long run, it was money and time saved because for me, I found the right product that delivered the results.
 
Direct from Zymols website, feel free to argue with them if you dont think they can write their own instructions correctly.



1. Put a very small amount of the glaze to the palm of your hand. Use the warmth of your hands to melt the Carnauba. With your hand, gently apply the glaze in a light, even pattern over no more than three or four-square feet of painted surface.

2. Let Concours stand for 30 to 60 seconds.

3. Using moderate to heavy pressure, wipe very slowly with a Micro-Wipeâ„¢ (folded once) to a brilliant lustre before wax is totally dry.

4. Wait three to four hours, then lightly buff the paint again to perfect the shine.
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http://www.zymol.com/concour2.htm



And as I said before, yipee to you if you like - USE IT. At the end of the day, its your money not mine.
 
From the Concours Jar:



1.Wash & Dry Car. HD Cleanse if necessary.

2. Melt small amount of wax in palms. Apply using back and forth motion.



BOLD RED PRINT: DO NOT ALLOW TO DRY



3. Buff with No Pressure to a high gloss using Zymol Cotton Buffing Towels.



Product says it all, and it has paid off in dividends, instead of regrets.



Ciao!
 
I just wish I could get a small sample of this stuff. Not that I would ever buy it of course, I could buy a lot of Tenderloin for that much. I guess it all boils down to how much money a person has to spend on a product. I am sure that in the eyes of the customer , that the excessive (IMO) price is proportional to the benifit, shine, protection of the product. It is unimaginable to me that a pricey product like the ones decribed dont just flow to all parts of the paintwork by simply fliging a dollap onto the hood. ! And then flow out to a blinding shine !:rofl
 
mochamanz said:
I just wish I could get a small sample of this stuff........
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There is a sampler kit:



http://www.zymol.com/samplers.htm



It still isn't cheap, but if someone really wants to try these then it might be a good option.

Originally posted by lbls1

.......IMO, however, the price I paid for it was justified by the result that I received from it.......
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If *you* were pleased with the results vs. price then that's all that really matters. I've read some of your comments in previous threads on Zymol, and while I'm not ready to buy a jar quite yet, maybe when my Souveran gets low I'll try the sample pack that contains Concours. As my best friend used to say, "nothin' is too good for your street (hot) rod!"
 
If you see the pictures of many here who post, most do not use pebble Beach priced waxes. Most you can get right over the counter or by mail order.



It is all in the prep. If you properly polish out your surface and follow up with a finer polish to really burnish the surface to a high, swirl free gloss then you can top with most anything and it'll look awesome.



Mosca proved that with his Miata with both Turtle Wax High Gloss wax and Mother's california Gold wax, both available at any Poop Boys or Autozone.



However, for me Souveran is worth the money. That is as expensive as I'll get. Carnuaba Moose does a good job too; very Souveran like - darkening the paint with a wet, 3D look.
 
Eliot Ness said:
There is a sampler kit:



http://www.zymol.com/samplers.htm



It still isn't cheap, but if someone really wants to try these then it might be a good option.



If *you* were pleased with the results vs. price then that's all that really matters. I've read some of your comments in previous threads on Zymol, and while I'm not ready to buy a jar quite yet, maybe when my Souveran gets low I'll try the sample pack that contains Concours. As my best friend used to say, "nothin' is too good for your street (hot) rod!"
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Thanks, that was a good, open minded comment. It was and still is my choice.



BTW: You should not burnish ANY paint, unless you are correcting issues. It is not just a mirror shine that defines a "resolution" (finish). Clarity, depth, color rendition, a sense of moisture (or in my case...finer ORANGE PEEL), etc. to me defines how well a paint responds to a wax. Any polish and wax can shine, but if you can define the character of the paint, develop outstanding image reflection, and have color as raw as ripe fruit (without burning-burnishing, or overpolishing just to produce glossy paint), then you'll have an outstanding finish that best utilizes the wax of your choice.
 
lbls1 said:
Thanks, that was a good, open minded comment. It was and still is my choice.



BTW: You should not burnish ANY paint, unless you are correcting issues.
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I humblydisagree. The paint won't respond well to a wax if the surface is not properly prepped or "burnished." You can take the $1000 Zymol and wax my grandma's car and it'll look like poop because it needs to be prepped.



In order to "define the character of the paint, develop outstanding image reflection, and have color as raw as ripe fruit" you need to prep or "burnish"/polish the surface! That's why we talk ad nauseum about laying the proper base down to achieve the true effectiveness of a particular sealant like AIO/SG or Zaino or Souveran. For example, to achieve maximum results with Zaino, use 3M polishes or Menzerna polishes because they contain no fillers or oils. You can't lay down those LSP products without first some level of "burnishing" the surface.



It's like priming and even scraping/sanding before painting.



Burnish means:

To make smooth or glossy by or as if by rubbing; polish.

To rub with a tool that serves especially to smooth or polish.

A smooth glossy finish or appearance; luster.



You can "burnish" the surface with a super mild polish like Sonus or Pinnacle or P21s. Or you can "burnish" the paint with a heavier polish if the surface requires. 98% of detailers and weekend warriors here "burnish" the paint of their own cars and cars they detail for profit. I polish my 10 year old car twice a year and it sits outiside 24x7. The integrity of the paint is perfect except hairline cracks in the plastic bumper covers.



Polishing and abrasives and "burnishing" the paint is of paramount importance to a detailer to achieve proper results. It's all in the technique coupled with proper pad/product combos.



There are some who are afraid of abrasives. No need to be unless you are unsure of them.
 
You may have a point if you were referring to burnishing as polish prepping before waxing. Even with polishing, I only use that as a prepping step before the first wax.



I was thinking more of the use of harsh abrasive compounds as to achieve a shine on a good paint surface with minimal issues. I would only recommend that for paint that has heavy swirls or oxidation.



I have never had to use harsh polishes or abrasive compounds to achieve an optimal finish (on new to very good paint) or to maintain good paint. I have had to aggressively polish older finishes that were oxidized and/or abused.



However, that's just my opinion and technique.
 
I understand and agree. However, If you're an expert, "harsh" compounds can be used with zero issues on any paint.



Take a look at CleanDean's images. On classic cars that look flawless with next to no miles, he used Diamond Cut and a rotary but continued down the scale burnishing the paint to an incredible, flawless finish before sealing.



Check this aweosme pics out from him. Oh, he is not using "Pebble Beach" products either!



http://autopia.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=52333



http://autopia.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=51953
 
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