buy gas based on politics?

A

accordmaniac

New member
This past weekend I went on a trip with my youth group at church. Since it was several hundred miles away we had to fill up a few times. We went with our pastor and his wife. They are pretty conservative people. My pastor's wife brought up a topic that I have never heard anyone discuss about before. She prefers to buy gas from stations that she knows doesn't use oil from the Middle East. And she feels strongly about not buying gas from Shell, Chevron, and Mobil. Even if Shell is $.05 cheaper per gallon she still opposes pulling in to get gas. So I was wondering how many people here are like that? I have nothing against it but I'm curious about other people's perspectives.
 
Well, I'm a Chemical Engineer employeed in the Oil & Gas refining field, so naturally I support the industry. Secondly, I am a car *enthusiast*. So I will buy what I consider to be the best gas for my vehicles at a given time, not which ever gas is cheaper or who was killed to get it, etc.



Something else that needs to be said. Not all oil processed in North American refineries is from middle eastern crude. There are domestic deposits of conventional crude throughout north american, as well as HUGE deposits of Oil Sands here in Northern Alberta (that's Canada, for those folks that don't know geography outside their own state). Oil Sands becomes bitumen which in turn gets upgraded to "Synthetic Crude" (not to be confused with synthetic motor oil), and this industry is expanding like crazy up here with mega projects starting up all the time. Much of the synthetic crude produced up here gets sent down to US refineries via pipeline. Exxon and Shell are two of many major players that are already heavily invested in the oil sands.
 
That's odd actually. I've found that Shell is usually a few cents more here in OK because they use that fuel cleaning crap additive. Most times I get gas from Murray USA since they usually have the lowest price. Gas is gas, imo. Just know that some less popular/known stations may not keep up on maintenance like keeping water out of the storage tanks.
 
Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs but, there is absolutely no way to determine where the gas came from for certain. What you have to realize is that oil companies buy and sell gas and oil between each other routinely. There is no way to be 100% certain where the gas you pump at the station originated from. In the end boycotting certain stations only hurts the station owner as the oil companies will just sell off any excess to another oil company who may be in short supply. Just because certain oil companies may not import oil from overseas, that does not mean that they don't buy it from companies that do.



Here is a link to an article from the Department of Energy titled "Where does my gasoline come from".



http://www.eia.doe.gov/neic/brochure/gas04/gasoline.htm



This is a good quote from the article that sums it up.



Can I tell which country or State the gasoline at my local station comes from?



The Energy Information Administration (EIA) cannot definitively say where gasoline at a given station originated since EIA does not collect data on the source of the gasoline sold at retail outlets. The name on the service station sign does not tell the whole story. The fact that you purchase gasoline from a given company does not necessarily mean that the gasoline was actually produced by that particular company’s refineries. While gasoline is sold at about 167,000 retail outlets across the nation, about one-third of these stations are “unbranded� dealers that may sell gasoline of any brand. The remainder of the outlets are “branded� stations, but may not necessarily be selling gasoline produced at that company’s refineries. This is because gasoline from different refineries is often combined for shipment by pipeline, and companies owning service stations in the same area may be purchasing gasoline at the same bulk terminal. In that case, the only difference between the gasoline at station X versus the gasoline at station Y may be the small amount of additives that those companies add to the gasoline before it gets to the pump. Even if we knew at which company’s refinery the gasoline was produced, the source of the crude oil used at that refinery may vary on a day-to-day basis. Most refiners use a mix of crude oils from various domestic and foreign sources. The mix of crude oils can change based on the relative cost and availability of crude oil from different sources.
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This is why I just laugh when people bring up these gas station boycott ideas.



Regardless of price the Mustang generally gets Chevron 87 regular unleaded. If I can't get to Chevron I will go to either an Exxon or Mobil station. They don't have any around here but, I also like BP. The wife shops for gas on price alone. She usually winds up getting it from WalMart as they seem to have the best price around here.
 
accordmaniac said:
They are pretty conservative people.
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Yet, I'd bet the farm they voted for Bush whose family has the extroidinary close ties to the Saudi royal family despite their medeival Islamic theocracy and sinister ties to exporting terrorism and anti-Western hate. ;) So much for a moral high ground when it comes to oil money.



I believe in personal boycotts if thats what makes you feel better about your moral compass. I NEVER buy products from France and routinely miss out on good wine at my favorite restaurant (which is French, but owned & operated by Amercans). For a long time, I didn't buy products from China until it came darn near impossible. I'll still put down a product from China if I see the same thing from another country or if I really don't need to buy it. Case in point - I bought a new toaster. I chose the one from Mexico instead of China.



FWIW, I buy Shell gas because it is a few hundred yards from my house :)
 
One of the difference in gasoline is the refinery were it was made. A Shell refinery in New York can make gas different then a Shell Refinery in Illinois. It depends on how modern the refinery is, some are up to date some are very old. We have no choice in were the gas comes from , the pipe line gos all over. The second difference is the additive package thats put in the gas. The additives are VERY important they keep the engine clean . Name brand gas has better and more additives then whosale gas.If you use whosale gas you will need fuel injection cleaner more often to keep the car running right. After all we are Autopians and not only do we want are cars to look good, we want them to run good also.
 
lawrencea said:
One of the difference in gasoline is the refinery were it was made. A Shell refinery in New York can make gas different then a Shell Refinery in Illinois. It depends on how modern the refinery is, some are up to date some are very old. We have no choice in were the gas comes from , the pipe line gos all over. The second difference is the additive package thats put in the gas. The additives are VERY important they keep the engine clean . Name brand gas has better and more additives then whosale gas.If you use whosale gas you will need fuel injection cleaner more often to keep the car running right. After all we are Autopians and not only do we want are cars to look good, we want them to run good also.
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There is less difference than you might think. There are federal and state laws that require additives be present in gasoline. The oil companies aren't adding much over what they are required to. Some companies do have better additives than others but, they all have to meet certain standards.
 
I myself just buy whatever is cheapest and I don't have to prepay and thats usually RaceTrac. Since I'm a liberal, during the whole trip when we filled up I made sarcastic comments about not filling up at Shell when we passed one and the price was reasonable.
 
I usually buy my gas at QT (Quick Trip) because it is Tier1 gas (or whatever that new high level is), it is usually cheaper than the rest and their store inside is the Walmart of convienence stores.
 
There was a fascinating documentary on this very subject on A&Es Modern Marvels show this past week. I'm sure it is still being aired so watch it, it's very interesting. It was very clear that ALL gasoline is virtually identical when it reaches the distribution terminals. They all tap into the same national network. The differences only come about when the individual oil company (Shell, Mobil, Exxon, whoever) puts in additives at the very moment the gas is uploaded onto the tanker truck for delivery to the stations. Up until that additive is put in, the gas could be a mixture from many different sources so the refineries all produce the same product.



Well all this according to the show anyway



As far as boycotting stations based on fuel origin that is useless because it's obvious we have no clue where it came from... HOWEVER... if you want to boycott a brand based on it's ownership and don't want to see $$ flowing overseas that is another story altogether. So if you want to boycott Shell or BP because they are foreign owned that's fine, just don't do it in your Honda! :hairpull
 
DFTowel said:
just don't do it in your Honda! :hairpull
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But my Honda was assembled in Ohio!



Reminds me of the time I brought my mother's fur coat in for warm weather storage and there were protesters outisde and this whack job lady barked at me while in her LEATHER shoes :rofl
 
Spilchy said:
But my Honda was assembled in Ohio!



Reminds me of the time I brought my mother's fur coat in for warm weather storage and there were protesters outisde and this whack job lady barked at me while in her LEATHER shoes :rofl
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Yeah but out of Jap parts and the $$ go to Japan further contributing to the trade defecit.
 
DFTowel said:
Yeah but out of Jap parts and the $$ go to Japan further contributing to the trade defecit.
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I think the larger problem with the US auto industry is healthcare costs. Honda uses US suppliers just like the US automakers do. It would be foolish and costly for Honda to ship their parts here from Japan. None of the Japanese auto makers have anywhere near the expense we have of maintaining a large population of retirees. The first Japanese plants were built here in the 80s so there are hardly any retirees for them to support yet. I think the estimates put the advantage that gives the Japanese manufacturers about $1500 per car.



http://corporate.honda.com/america/...esting_in_america.aspx?id=investing_suppliers
 
Well, I'm a Chemical Engineer employeed in the Oil & Gas refining field, so naturally I support the industry. Secondly, I am a car *enthusiast*. So I will buy what I consider to be the best gas for my vehicles at a given time, not which ever gas is cheaper or who was killed to get it, etc.
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Well said. Some car magazines have said Chevron's Techron is the best but I also stop by QuikTrip which is a very well-run and clean chain.
 
I don't see any Chevrons up here (Northern NJ) and even Amacos and BPs are becoming extinct. I usually get my gas at a Hess station on my way home from school. Its pretty convenient, and their prices are usually a little lower then the average. Lately i've been going to an Exxon in a neighboring town just because its open 24 hrs and has the lowest prices. I like to go later on at night to avoid any traffic, and it gives me a reason to drive around at night ;)



I remember in late 2001 when I first started driving we were complaning that gas wasn't under a $1/gallon, I just paid $2.28/gallon and thats one of the lowest prices around :scared: :angry
 
DFTowel said:
Yeah but out of Jap parts and the $$ go to Japan further contributing to the trade defecit.
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Who are you going to blame for this... the consumer or the domestic auto manufacturers?



A basic business principle "build a better product, and the people will come" seems to be totally lost on GM for example.



I know I'll never buy a domestic automobile in the foreseeable future, not unless they make some drastic changes to their product (particularly GM).
 
Inzane said:
Who are you going to blame for this... the consumer or the domestic auto manufacturers?



A basic business principle "build a better product, and the people will come" seems to be totally lost on GM for example.



I know I'll never buy a domestic automobile in the foreseeable future, not unless they make some drastic changes to their product (particularly GM).
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It costs money to "build a better product". Right now there is no way any of the domestics can build a car of similar quality to the Japanese without it costing significantly more than what they charge. It is basic math, the Japanese do not have the huge population of retirees that the domestic manufacturers have. I believe the current estimate is that the Japanese have a $1500 PER CAR advantage over us. The only things that are going to change this is major health care reform to bring costs down and for the unions to realize that they are gonna have to give a little slack or find another industry as the big 3 could easily go the way of the dinosaur if something doesn't change.
 
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