Best products for swirl mark removal by hand?

Marlin, where you located?
If someone is close by they may let you try a DA.
I'm still inexperienced . I get awesome finishes and am slowly working on an older car with heavy swirls. I'm not very good at swirl removal but agree with everyone's input.
My theory as a beginner is that I want to see improvement but don't get disappointed when it's not swirl free. I figure then I'm not being too aggressive.
I have Meguiars ultimate polish/compound and all the PoorBoys SSRs and polishes.
Now I know it's just me being too careful.
I have a Griots, Flex 3401, and the Rupes 15. Once I get more experience I can stop blaming the products and polishers.��
 
Thanks for all the info guys. My main reason not to want to buy a polisher is not to risk doing something harmful to the finish while I'm learning how to use it. I think for this car I'll pay someone to get it good and then I'll just keep it nice as I have all of my cars (funny how it seems like you can never find a used car in quite as nice condition as it would be if you owned it the whole time).

What about if I change my question to be more localized, like after wet sanding out a small scratch? The 3M Rubbing Compound gets out the sanding marks, but then the 3M swirl mark remover seems to do very little (or perhaps it leaves behind it's own fine scratches), and the 3M Hand Glaze does nothing at all as far as I can tell (I now use P21S Paintwork Cleanser where I would have used the Hand Glaze before, i.e. just to get out contaminants). I try to avoid Meguiar's ever since I watched their wheel cleaner strip the paint off my wheels and bleach the driveway below the wheel. Maybe all the other products are good, but just out of spite I don't like to buy their products after that (even though I'll admit a good body shop where I used to live told me they tested a bunch of different products and the Meguiar's Professional line was as good or better than anything else).

EDIT: I've been reading some of the links. I'm starting to think my real problem with the products I already use isn't the product, but that I use a towel to apply it. Time to research pads...



I'm going to take a little different opinion here. The hand can be quite (overly) aggressive. Sure it's near impossible to correct a modern clear coat car completely by hand for normal people.

But, compounds used by hand, in certain situations will remove a lot of clear coat (material). What your going after (want) is uniform material removal. This is predicable and reproducible with a DA.

By hand, there will be certain positions that are more comfortable, where you will be over removing clear coat, and certain positions that will be less comfortable - where you will be under removing.

It's not too hard to put "finger marks" in paint by being overly aggressive with compounds by hand. In this respect, the DA is actually safer than the hand, because it provides uniform downward pressure and uniform/predictable/reproducible material removal.

Seriously, we've all been through it here. Buy a DA or just live with the finish.

Can you find me a single thread on a detailing forum where someone said a DA Screwed Up My Paint???

You can pay a pro - but it won't beat the satisfaction and the learning experience of doing it yourself. Plus - buying all the stuff is cheaper than paying a pro and you will have it for future use.

Meg's stuff is pretty good. If you damaged a wheel using Wheel Brite - you didn't read the directions. That being said, I'd stick to boutique brands (Wolfgang, BlackFire, Menzerna, etc..) to start. They will be easier to use (compared to Megs Professional line).

As for microfiber towels, they are the correct thing to use. If they are picking up all sorts of stuff - the car is not clean, the towel is not clean, or you are not storing them correctly. We are all using them successfully. They "pick up stuff" - because they excel at picking up dirt on paint. Cotton is a dinosaur. It's time to adapt to high quality microfiber. Learn about microfiber and how to clean and store it. It's not too difficult - and you will get better results with microfiber.
 
..Can you find me a single thread on a detailing forum where someone said a DA Screwed Up My Paint???

Well, the one time I had a major "oops!" with a polisher it was with an original-model PC (as opposed to my numerous more aggressive units)! Mild pad/product combo too. Heh heh,...."leave it to me?!?", huh?

I have seen a fair number of threads about this over the years, and known people who did real damage too (including a pal here who managed to do it under the direct tutelage of a certain highly regarded expert!), but it was almost always a case of, to put it bluntly, carelessness or stupidity.

Hey marlinspike- that won't apply to you so don't worry.
 
Hey marlinspike- that won't apply to you so don't worry.

I guess I'm just outdated, as I've done a bit of reading and I'm apparently stuck in the days of rotary polishers that needed skill to use (or at least that's what the people I knew told me). Looks like these new things are a lot safer, and after getting a quote from a pro, the way I'm going to go. Now to research polishers...

ShawnF350, I'm in the Tidewater region of Virginia.

Swanicyouth, I appreciate the info and the help, but again, for clarity, it was NOT the wheel brightener that I used. I don't even know if that existed back then. It was off-the-shelf consumer-grade wheel cleaner they sold a little over a decade ago (I remember I bought it at Trak Auto, so it can't have been within the last 10 years).
 
marlinspike- Yes indeed, it's a whole 'nother ballgame now that there are so many good Random Orbital polishers out there.

FWIW, a good sure-to-be-safe wheel cleaner is the one Griot's Garage sells. And speaking of Griot's, their 6" Random Orbital Polisher is *great*, lifetime warranty too. If I could only have one of my polishers, it'd be that one. The Rupes 21 is superior, but more expensive. The Flex 3401 is a bit more capable (than the Griot's) with regard to serious correction, but IME it doesn't finish *quite* as well (note that others don't see a diff) and some folks dislike its, uhm...signature handling qualities (it has just a bit of "recoil" due to its forced rotation).
 
When I bought my Camaro 3 years ago I was by no means a professional detailer and I still am not one. I have used a rotary in the past, learned back in high school 30+ years ago. Used one about 8 years ago to fix my Monte Carlo. When I got this car since it was black I surely did not want to go rotary. I went online did some research and ordered a Griot's Garage DA. I then found this site and have since learned how to correct the cars paint myself. There is no way I could keep my car looking decent doing it by hand. If you are on a budget the GG 6" is a great deal compared to the more expensive polishers out there. If I compare the money I have put into towels, pads, polishes etc, the money I saved paying someone once or twice a year to do a full detail I have about paid for it all. As long as the products I have don't go bad I have enough for a few years and a lot of details to come. I can only say don't get carried away with the latest and greatest items. Take it from someone who has gone overboard on buying just stick to the necesities.
 
As long as the products I have don't go bad I have enough for a few years and a lot of details to come. I can only say don't get carried away with the latest and greatest items. Take it from someone who has gone overboard on buying just stick to the necesities.

Don't buy the latest and greatest???? Now ya tell me after I just got 3 cans of pns (and didn't use it today)

And only a few years supply ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!!?


Resistance is futile !
 
marlinspike- Yes indeed, it's a whole 'nother ballgame now that there are so many good Random Orbital polishers out there.

FWIW, a good sure-to-be-safe wheel cleaner is the one Griot's Garage sells. And speaking of Griot's, their 6" Random Orbital Polisher is *great*, lifetime warranty too. If I could only have one of my polishers, it'd be that one. The Rupes 21 is superior, but more expensive. The Flex 3401 is a bit more capable (than the Griot's) with regard to serious correction, but IME it doesn't finish *quite* as well (note that others don't see a diff) and some folks dislike its, uhm...signature handling qualities (it has just a bit of "recoil" due to its forced rotation).

I have always used and been pleased with P21S gel. I ran out, and ran to Trak Auto one time, just one time, and one time was all it took! lol... :(

Right now I'm looking at the Porter Cable vs. the Griot's. The cost of paying a pro just one time is equal to the cost of buying all the equipment I need to do it myself. Did not expect that.
 
I have always used and been pleased with P21S gel. I ran out, and ran to Trak Auto one time, just one time, and one time was all it took! lol... :(

Right now I'm looking at the Porter Cable vs. the Griot's. The cost of paying a pro just one time is equal to the cost of buying all the equipment I need to do it myself. Did not expect that.

And you get a big supply of product that lets you do numerous cars !! And a feeling of accomplishment that is INSANE

Welcome to the addiction :D

My advice is call Ray tomorrow and have him price match the geek since they got 15% off everything
 
20150222_201246_zpsfez5eqrs.jpg
 
And you get a big supply of product that lets you do numerous cars !! And a feeling of accomplishment that is INSANE

Welcome to the addiction :D

My advice is call Ray tomorrow and have him price match the geek since they got 15% off everything

Funny thing is, I always thought myself already addicted, with a closet full of P21S, Sonax, 3M, Wurth, wool mitts, Apple Leather Care, and separate trash bags for microfiber and cotton, washing my car weekly (when it had an engine in it) and waxing every 3 months. Then I saw these forums, and realized I'm downright lackadaisical.
 

Appreciate the coupon, but it will be a couple of months before I can drop the coin (set myself a deadline to clear out a couple of credit cards). The trunk was repainted right before she bought the car. Am I correct in assuming I have to wait a couple of months before messing with that anyway?
 
Funny thing is, I always thought myself already addicted, with a closet full of P21S, Sonax, 3M, Wurth, wool mitts, Apple Leather Care, and separate trash bags for microfiber and cotton, washing my car weekly (when it had an engine in it) and waxing every 3 months. Then I saw these forums, and realized I'm downright lackadaisical.

HAhahahahahahahah


It gets worse, believe me
 
Appreciate the coupon, but it will be a couple of months before I can drop the coin (set myself a deadline to clear out a couple of credit cards). The trunk was repainted right before she bought the car. Am I correct in assuming I have to wait a couple of months before messing with that anyway?

ask the guy who painted it

Some paints ok right away, some 30-90 days later
 
Correct it all you want right away. The problem comes from wax or sealant. That will interfere with the paint curing and usually requires you wait 30 days to allow the paint to cure before any protection can be put on
 
Don't buy the latest and greatest???? Now ya tell me after I just got 3 cans of pns (and didn't use it today)

And only a few years supply ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!!?


Resistance is futile !

I said a few years. i was trying to keep my addiction quiet. I should have said a lifetime if they last that long! 3 kinds of wax, enough to do car about 150 times, one was free during a sale that I couldn't pass up. 2 kinds of WOWA sealants, at least one was free but of course I had to spend $150 at one of these awesome Autopia sales, haven't touched it yet. Towels, pads, polishes more towels, list goes on. At least once I realized what I had accumulated I put an end to it last spring. So actually resistance is not futile!!! LOL.
 
Appreciate the coupon, but it will be a couple of months before I can drop the coin (set myself a deadline to clear out a couple of credit cards). The trunk was repainted right before she bought the car. Am I correct in assuming I have to wait a couple of months before messing with that anyway?

-AND-

Ronkh said:
..ask the guy who painted it..



Gotta be careful about that seemingly safe and obvious approach! The vast majority of autopainters I've known (and that's quite a few) didn't really know much about this, many not even being familiar with the paint manfacturers' (current) potition on the topic. Just because they can run a paintgun really well that doesn't mean they know other things about the paint, like what goes on after it's sprayed and the car goes home with the customer (who's usually clueless).

They (the painteres) have always been especially ignorant regarding my primary concern with paint curing- attaining maximum hardness. Sometimes they will say something like "yeah, it'll get harder for a while, I couldn't get it quite perfect right now...", usually after I complained about marring in the new paint.

The concern here is that if anything (i.e., some LSP) interferes with the outgassing process then there's a chance the paint won't get as hard as it otherwise might. That has happened to a few Autopians and I've always been paranoid about it happening to me (I've had paint get *dramatically* harder over the course of up to six months).

Whether this is a valid concern is one of those things that'll be debated forever. David Fermani and I have agreed to disagree on it, and he and I hardly *ever* disagree about anything!

To be on the safe side I use products that are determined to be fresh-paint-friendly for the first 3-6 months (at least 90 days). For decades I used Meguiar's M05 (or M03/M07/M81/Deep Crystal Step #2 Polish) or 3M Imperial Hand Glaze. These days I use OCW, based on the testing/approval by Ford regarding its use on "post-production paintwork". So IMO it's easy- err on the side of caution by using OCW, which isn't a bad product anyhow.
 
Back
Top