are these TWO changing the face of detailing??

S

steck

New member
i have taken the winter off from Autopia, as we go into hybernation here (think ice age).



just spending a couple days back here, TWO newer products have caught my interest:



meg's m105 and 3M's Ultrafina.





just by the initial sounds of things, these two products might be all you need to complete a full exterior detail (from serious defect removal right thru to final polishing, lsp ready.)



is that good news or what?



what am i gonna do with all the time i'm going to save this year ?
 
It surely seems like they are the miracle products; however, just because they work well for one person (or a few) doesn't mean they're for everybody. I've never used either, and I do plan to....but the people that are coming out and raving about it are some of the best out there. People like Todd are highly skilled and very experienced, so the average joe may not be able to get results like those. These products are pretty new as well so they may not have been put up against too many different finishes. Definitely looks like a winning combo.



I cant wait to try the stuff, but it's going to be a while before I do.
 
Or................

Its just possibly the FOTM.........(Flavor of the month)

Man I have so many products waiting to be tried, I dont know where to begin, i dont need anymore!! And why should I/Do I feel compelled to try something new all the time? Im totally content with my own prescriptions.
 
It's just fun to have new products hit the market, there are several combinations that could perform as well as those two in finish terms, Patrick pretty much said it best, it's only the new thing till the newer thing comes out.
 
VaSuperShine said:
It's just fun to have new products hit the market, there are several combinations that could perform as well as those two in finish terms, Patrick pretty much said it best, it's only the new thing till the newer thing comes out.
Click to expand...



In the last year, I have noticed a change in discussions. I recall much more discussion about Edge pads, Eagle Tire Cleaner, and just the PC and rotary (no flex, udm, etc).
 
Bunky said:
In the last year, I have noticed a change in discussions. I recall much more discussion about Edge pads, Eagle Tire Cleaner, and just the PC and rotary (no flex, udm, etc).
Click to expand...



What do you expect, we're crazy about car care. And I do mean crazy.
 
i finally go to use m105 today and it lives up and surpasses the hype. i used it on a black GMC Sierra w/ edge yellow wool 2 passes. i then followed w/ UF using red edge foam. it was blown away. i have a UF pad, but i wanted to try the edge red since it seems very similar to UF blue. i hope to get some pics on monday.
 
VaSuperShine said:
It's just fun to have new products hit the market, there are several combinations that could perform as well as those two in finish terms, Patrick pretty much said it best, it's only the new thing till the newer thing comes out.
Click to expand...





so what two step do you know of, that would 'perform as well' as these two new guys..



not being jerky....just wondering.



my last real 'two step' was #84 and #80.
 
Flavour of the month? YOU BET!!



M105 has a fair bit of hype at the moment. Its way too early to determine exactly how good it is.



The fact is M105 gums up really quick because they replaced most of the lubricant with a larger quantity of abbrasives. Having such a short working time and extreme cut can be very bad. I can see alot of users burning through clear coat quite easily.



Meguiars M86 is better in my opinion. Its cuts nearly as much but has more lubrication and can be worked longer. Alot of people have suggested adding optimum polish to M105, this basically would increase the working time and reduce the cut. You'd end up with M86 solo cut creme.



Yet no one else here has even used M86 yet.. so M105 is simply flavour of the month as in most cases M86 is better.



Regarding 3M ultrafina. Its not even that good. Nearly everyone here is using a rather strong final polish or pad. They then act suprised when they use a fine polish/pad combination and get good results. Menzerna 106FF is a very popular final polish yet it has an insane amount of cutting power. On soft clearcoats users often use polishing pads instead of finishing or finessing pads which would no doubt be a better pad choice. Menzerna has many finer polish's that will reduce the chance of holograms on soft black paint.



A Red Lake country pad and Menzerna PO87MC could acheive all the results of the Ultrafina process.
 
TTWAGN said:
Regarding 3M ultrafina. Its not even that good. Nearly everyone here is using a rather strong final polish or pad. They then act suprised when they use a fine polish/pad combination and get good results. Menzerna 106FF is a very popular final polish yet it has an insane amount of cutting power. On soft clearcoats users often use polishing pads instead of finishing or finessing pads which would no doubt be a better pad choice. Menzerna has many finer polish's that will reduce the chance of holograms on soft black paint.
Click to expand...



The 3000 line was developed with bodyshops in mind, not weekend warrior hobby guys. Bodyshops are around to make money as fast a possible. The 3000 system, if you know how to use it, is a VERY fast system from sandpaper to high-gloss swirl free repair. It's unacceptable in a bodyshop to have a polish that requires a long time to work out swirl free.



I've also noticed a lot of people on this site expect the world from Ultrafina and a lot of them don't even know how to use it, or what it's intended for.
 
TTWAGN said:
Flavour of the month? YOU BET!!



M105 has a fair bit of hype at the moment. Its way too early to determine exactly how good it is.



The fact is M105 gums up really quick because they replaced most of the lubricant with a larger quantity of abbrasives. Having such a short working time and extreme cut can be very bad. I can see alot of users burning through clear coat quite easily.



Meguiars M86 is better in my opinion. Its cuts nearly as much but has more lubrication and can be worked longer. Alot of people have suggested adding optimum polish to M105, this basically would increase the working time and reduce the cut. You'd end up with M86 solo cut creme.



Yet no one else here has even used M86 yet.. so M105 is simply flavour of the month as in most cases M86 is better.



Regarding 3M ultrafina. Its not even that good. Nearly everyone here is using a rather strong final polish or pad. They then act suprised when they use a fine polish/pad combination and get good results. Menzerna 106FF is a very popular final polish yet it has an insane amount of cutting power. On soft clearcoats users often use polishing pads instead of finishing or finessing pads which would no doubt be a better pad choice. Menzerna has many finer polish's that will reduce the chance of holograms on soft black paint.



A Red Lake country pad and Menzerna PO87MC could acheive all the results of the Ultrafina process.
Click to expand...



I really hate ultrafina too. :cry: :rofl



M105 is a little challanging to use, but if you follow the advise here you will have very good results in a short period of time. So far on harder clears, I can follow up with Ultrafina after M105/yellow wool pad. Again follow the instructions with ultrafina, do not work it dry, you always want that wet film of polish on the surface when you work it.
 
Invigor said:
And as for flavor of the month...I think 3000 system has been out for about 18 months now.
Click to expand...

No one in this thread has mentioned the 3000 system including the original poster.



We are talking about the 3M ultrafina SE liquid and the matching 3M ultrafina blue pad.



Menzerna and lake country have nearly identicle products available. If all the users here bought the correct products they too would be getting a hologram free finish.



Its a shame it takes a big company like 3M to show people a good matching pad/polish combo for final finishing. Atleast it takes the testing out of something that works, but other combinations can acheive better results than ultrafina. 3M have not re-invented the wheel, they have matched one of the softest pad and finest compounds, which could also be done with most other brands.



Its aimed at bodyshops but so is Menzerna and Meguiars pro lines. It would be narrow minded to suggest products aren't interchhangable between systems.
 
steck said:
so what two step do you know of, that would 'perform as well' as these two new guys..



not being jerky....just wondering.



my last real 'two step' was #84 and #80.
Click to expand...



Steck, you appear to have been on this forum for some time, look up several trusted two step product selections and you will have your answer. Realistically, very few finishes need the aggressiveness of 105, but I am willing to bet that's not going to stop several members of this board and others from using it. I personally don't think uf is the only or best way to follow 105, but sure it works, any compound you are able to follow with a finishing polish is great, but there are several, once again, we all love new products and 105 is so user friendly which is why it gets the hype it does. If using several compounds properly, you will get similar results, and follow up with a similar fp.
 
TTWAGN said:
Flavour of the month? YOU BET!!



M105 has a fair bit of hype at the moment. Its way too early to determine exactly how good it is.



The fact is M105 gums up really quick because they replaced most of the lubricant with a larger quantity of abbrasives. Having such a short working time and extreme cut can be very bad. I can see alot of users burning through clear coat quite easily.



Meguiars M86 is better in my opinion. Its cuts nearly as much but has more lubrication and can be worked longer. Alot of people have suggested adding optimum polish to M105, this basically would increase the working time and reduce the cut. You'd end up with M86 solo cut creme.



Yet no one else here has even used M86 yet.. so M105 is simply flavour of the month as in most cases M86 is better.



Regarding 3M ultrafina. Its not even that good. Nearly everyone here is using a rather strong final polish or pad. They then act suprised when they use a fine polish/pad combination and get good results. Menzerna 106FF is a very popular final polish yet it has an insane amount of cutting power. On soft clearcoats users often use polishing pads instead of finishing or finessing pads which would no doubt be a better pad choice. Menzerna has many finer polish's that will reduce the chance of holograms on soft black paint.



A Red Lake country pad and Menzerna PO87MC could acheive all the results of the Ultrafina process.
Click to expand...





106 cuts like water pretty much, you were most likely given a false impression of the product due to improperly using it. No offense, there is a video of a guy using it on detailersdomain, that depicts the use of sip and 106, he doesn't even come close to breaking down either polish, matter of fact, he works them each less than 2 minutes with a pc, yet his results were astounding, only proving the pro's on here point what the product is capable of. 106 cuts like a dude with no fingernails scratching his head.
 
VaSuperShine said:
Steck, you appear to have been on this forum for some time, look up several trusted two step product selections and you will have your answer. Realistically, very few finishes need the aggressiveness of 105, but I am willing to bet that's not going to stop several members of this board and others from using it. I personally don't think uf is the only or best way to follow 105, but sure it works, any compound you are able to follow with a finishing polish is great, but there are several, once again, we all love new products and 105 is so user friendly which is why it gets the hype it does. If using several compounds properly, you will get similar results, and follow up with a similar fp.
Click to expand...







hmmmm, so maybe i will stick with my tried and true "megs #84 to #80" two step process !
 
VaSuperShine said:
106 cuts like water pretty much, you were most likely given a false impression of the product due to improperly using it. No offense, there is a video of a guy using it on detailersdomain, that depicts the use of sip and 106, he doesn't even come close to breaking down either polish, matter of fact, he works them each less than 2 minutes with a pc, yet his results were astounding, only proving the pro's on here point what the product is capable of. 106 cuts like a dude with no fingernails scratching his head.
Click to expand...

Totally agree with you Brian!:spot
 
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