The Unofficial *Official* Politics Thread

Ronkh said:
This is very simple. THe fact is that you don`t like guns and are blinded by that.
What`s so different when we were kids? Guns haven`t changed............

And as far as you being uneasy at the sight of guns in the airport after 911, is simple to fix as well. The "school marshals" (for lack of better phrase) can be in plain clothes and unobtrusive.
Click to expand...

I believe Gearhead cautioned us earlier not to make presumptions about other members or what goes on inside their heads, lest we veer from opinion into insult.

I don`t think you know my "feelings" on guns, I`m certainly not blinded, and I certainly wasn`t "uneasy" about National Guardsmen in the airports after 9/11, I simply felt it was for show and not a real solution to what happened, and a step in the wrong direction--it gave the appearance of weakness, not strength. Do you feel less safe in airports now that the Guardsmen (generally) aren`t there?

So, you feel there weren`t enough resource officers in Parkland, fine, point taken. Should the Pulse nightclub, similarly, have had more than one trained, armed, plainclothes security officer? Is that the reason that cop was ineffective? Because there was only one of him? What is the right number for a 3000-student school or a nightclub?
 
My thoughts on why over the past few decades there`s been such an increase in mass shootings. Schools/society has been teaching that any behavior should be accepted, except for standing up for the golden rule. Don`t ask don`t tell, your picking on them. Things like the homemade clock the student brought to school in Houston. Yes it looked like it could be a bomb. Those who spoke up, and to action to make sure everyone was safe. Those people were so chastised, humiliated, torn down, and the child to be made out as a hero. This is just one example of how we may be told to speak up. The reality is if you do, you`ll be treated so horribly prison might sound better.
We as a society need to stop letting people/media divide us into groups for the sake of confrontation and entertainment. Don`t even get me started on totally fake news, which is way worse than single angled news. These things are only used to incite anger. Ok I`m rambling now.
 
Ronkh....your entire argument is akin to a doctor telling you the reason you have heart disease is because you don`t have enough Crestor or Lipitor in your body
 
In that same logic, not having enough Crestor or lipitor in your body means the existing disease gets worse.

Sooooo, ban heart disease? Or ban Crestor or Lipitor? I`m not following.
 
Ronkh said:
What`s so different when we were kids? Guns haven`t changed............
Click to expand...

I suspected the answer was "but the availability has" but I didn`t have anything to back it up, however here`s a quote from the SunSentinel:

"The Gun Control Act of 1968 increased the age to buy a handgun to 21 but set the age for rifles and long guns at 18, said William Vizzard, an expert on gun laws and a professor at Sacramento State University.At that time, the AR-15 — introduced in the early 1960s — was not easy to find, he said.
“Nobody bought them,” said Vizzard, a former ATF special agent. “Long guns were seen differently when the law was passed, and nobody has made a concerted effort to change that. They were all American and used for hunting and target shooting. The market has shifted.”

No one is trying to take your guns away, Ron, or Gearhead`s. I fail to see any impact to either of you if the age to buy an AR-15 were raised to 21, or if the background check requirements for a semi-auto weapon were a little more invasive than they are now, since it seems you both have had rigorous background checks. Again, according to the SunSentinel this is what the shooter passed:

"Cruz passed a background check, which looks at criminal history and whether someone has been found to be “mentally defective” by a court, said Peter Forcelli, the special agent in charge of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in South Florida. People who voluntarily seek mental health treatment can still buy a gun, a loophole intended to not penalize them for seeking help. Cruz was in mental health treatment until 14 months ago, when he stopped going, Broward Mayor Beam Furr said.Gun store employees had no knowledge of Cruz’s medical history because it didn’t have to be reported to them, the attorneys said."


Perhaps a law enforcement interview in order to buy a semi-auto weapon would have prevented this shooter from having a gun. Again, this is something I presume you have already done and Gearhead has stated he has also, so you two already "pass".



 
Angus said:
I love how the Broward County sheriff owned the NRA spokesperson last night:
Click to expand...

unfortunately his sheriff`s department seems to have also failed as did the school system for not reporting someone who brought bullets to school and had been known to threaten people .. there is more than enough blame to go around and standing behind statistics will not bring any of the victims back from any of the shootings .... what happened to people trying to find answers rather than blame ?


<<<----- now jumping off box
 
And not having enough armed police officers in schools doesn`t cause gun violence either. The drugs (armed guards) can be useful in treating and preventing heart disease (gun violence) from getting worse, which I think was the point Ron was trying to make using the logic of your analogy.



DBAILEY said:
Its a pretty simple analogy, not having enough Crestor or Lipitor in your body is not the cause of the heart disease.
Click to expand...
 
House of Wax said:
Yet when she called law enforcements failures out, all of a sudden the only person to blame was the shooter

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

No actually what happened was the sheriff told the NRA hack she was wrong:

"You`re absolutely not the litmus test for how law enforcement should follow up. You`re wrong. There weren`t 39 visits. Some of them, they were GOA. Some of them called from other states, so say there were 39 visits I don`t know where you go those facts, but you`re completely wrong... It`s incorrect. We are looking at every single case we got. We are following up on it. We will decide and discern what deputies did, what investigators did and we will - - I will handle it accordingly and people will be punished if they didn`t do what they were supposed to do..."
 
Angus said:

No actually what happened was the sheriff told the NRA hack she was wrong:

"You`re absolutely not the litmus test for how law enforcement should follow up. You`re wrong. There weren`t 39 visits. Some of them, they were GOA. Some of them called from other states, so say there were 39 visits I don`t know where you go those facts, but you`re completely wrong... It`s incorrect. We are looking at every single case we got. We are following up on it. We will decide and discern what deputies did, what investigators did and we will - - I will handle it accordingly and people will be punished if they didn`t do what they were supposed to do..."
Click to expand...

If what he said there is true.......... He got bitten in the butt by his own greed. Using any "contact" as a "case number". Tons of departments now do this to increase stats.

If he were to handle it correctly, he would resign since he is the boss, buck stops w him.
 
Setec Astronomy said:
Perhaps a law enforcement interview in order to buy a semi-auto weapon would have prevented this shooter from having a gun. Again, this is something I presume you have already done and Gearhead has stated he has also, so you two already "pass".
Click to expand...


From the sounds of it he did have quite a few interviews w/law enforcement........... 39 of em, but the # is up for debate.
 
943_zpseplglolp.jpeg
 
Setec Astronomy said:
Since you say "this is one of the sacrifices we all made when we joined the Military" I take it you are a vet...which makes it even more puzzling that you don`t seem to remember how the Reserves/Guard work, and that these people are not sitting around during the week with nothing to do, on the gov`t dole, where we could simply "reassign" them to protect schools. They are not Maytag repairmen or suburban firemen. And the people that I know who joined the National Guard, never expected to be called to active duty, except maybe for a few days or a week, in the case, say, of a natural disaster.

And I don`t think we really want to get into a discussion on the effectiveness of the National Guard troops that were stationed in airports after 9/11, and whether they stopped any airports (or aircraft, for that matter) from being "blown up". But I`ll grant you I feel a lot safer flying now that none of the old ladies have knitting needles...some of them are very nasty!
Click to expand...

Setec Astronomy ---

I said this --

Setec Astronomy --
""Yes, I did realize that they are the Guard - I just did not know what they are doing lately...""

Why would that be puzzling ?? What about the AGR part of the Guard ?

So if your Guard friends are not apparently happy to deploy and serve the State in the Country or in another country they signed up to do, then why would they sign up in the first place?

I just don`t get that part.. I am of the persuasion that one is "all in" or not - there is no - "well, I think I will be there for you, perhaps not if it doesn`t fit my schedule"..

Yes I am a Vet, and come from a long line of way harder, tougher, stronger men who parachuted into Normandy, landed on Omaha Beach, and fought in the Philippines, Leyte, Bataan.. Have you ever seen Band of Brothers ? Yes, those types of men in similar situations..

And the Reserve I was in for 2 years after I was Honorably Discharged in 1971, was Active Reserve, attached to the USAF and subject to be called back at any time.. Yeah, guess I was like the Fireman or Maytag Repairman.. :)

Regarding the "effectiveness of National Guard in Airports after 09/11", how does anyone know for certain how many acts of terrorism were indeed prevented because of these men standing there ? :)
Dan F
 

Attachments

  • 19408717_best-inappropriate-bumper-stickers-of_tf2b75286.jpg
    19408717_best-inappropriate-bumper-stickers-of_tf2b75286.jpg
    7.3 KB · Views: 6
  • got_ammo_bumper_sticker-rf5c50a1f67f146baa180643ffa91e78d_v9wht_8byvr_630.jpg
    got_ammo_bumper_sticker-rf5c50a1f67f146baa180643ffa91e78d_v9wht_8byvr_630.jpg
    20.9 KB · Views: 6
So... just spit balling here, if more in-depth background checks are the solution to the problem. Who pays for them? Where does the money come from? The costs from what I see being proposed, if applied to every lawful purchase would be huge.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top