zaino topped with p21s

1

1andrews

New member
As I washed my car today I got it into my head to finally try and top the zaino with p21s. A big reason for this was my car has been a huge dust magnet, and people on here say p21s has good anti dust properties, we shall see. Also what fun is being an autopian without experimenting??



After washing it and taking a few 'before' pix I almost had second thoughts, the 6 layers of Z2 I put on a month ago were really shining big time. In fact when I was putting p21s on the white parts of my car I couldnt look directly at the white because it hurt my eyes, no joke.



so on to the results: I was absolutely shocked and amazed by p21s and how easy it went on how great it looked. Its pretty dang impossible to tell by these picks, but the topped zaino looks way better. Maybe its just a 'taste' issue, but the darker, wetter look of the p21s topped zaino is simply amazing.



zaino pic 1

http://www.angelfire.com/rebellion/robkirk/images/zaino1.JPG

zaino2

http://www.angelfire.com/rebellion/robkirk/images/zaino2.JPG

p21s1

http://www.angelfire.com/rebellion/robkirk/images/p21side2.JPG

p21s2

http://www.angelfire.com/rebellion/robkirk/images/p21sreflection.JPG

p21s3

http://www.angelfire.com/rebellion/robkirk/images/p21frontside2.JPG
 
:xyxthumbs



I totally agree! It's a matter of personal preference and the color of the car. I did Z on red last month and did not like it until I put some P21 on it...results were great!



But I ended up removing the Z to try another product....oh well, too much time on my hands...
 
I love your car! The shine is incredible too. :up :bow





I also tried a topper over zaino. I posted pictures for all to see as well. Funny thing though, I could NOT see a difference. I was shocked. I used Pinnacle Souveran, which is suppose to be one of the better ones for dark cars (Carbon Black ///M5). Perhaps the 3 layers of Zaino were so good that the difference was nominal.:confused: :confused: .





Anyway I love both products but Zaino is king in my garage!



Happy "mini" detailing

Bruce
 
Same here. I could not believe how nice my car looked and felt after putting S100 on top of Zaino.:bounce



Now I can use nice cheap Meguiar's car wash :D
 
emanon said:
Same here. I could not believe how nice my car looked and felt after putting S100 on top of Zaino.:bounce



Now I can use nice cheap Meguiar's car wash :D
Click to expand...



I used meguiar's GC shampoo anyways. And I never used z5...and I put carnuba on zaino OH MY!



hehe. seriously though, I wouldn't worry so much about sticking to the 'zaino' regimen.



brucepeter: maybe the fact that I used z2 and not z5 had something to do with the huge difference it made. Or maybe it was the fact the sun had set some (doubt it). I'm just hoping that p21s really keeps the dust off over the week cause that gets really annoying when my car looks super dirty after 2-3 days.

Thanks for the complements!!!
 
Oggle -



Yes, you have to remove S100 before going back and adding more Zaino. No big deal, wash with Dawn soap to remove the wax, then add more Z.
 
F 355 said:
Oggle -



Yes, you have to remove S100 before going back and adding more Zaino. No big deal, wash with Dawn soap to remove the wax, then add more Z.
Click to expand...



F 355, is this just your user name, or do you really have the F 355? If so, you actually use Dawn on it? Why not use a product that is designed for cleaning a car's surface instead of something designed to remove chicken grease from a dinner plate?:scared
 
SpeedBlack said:
Why not use a product that is designed for cleaning a car's surface instead of something designed to remove chicken grease from a dinner plate?:scared
Click to expand...
I doubt you will find anyone here that recommends Dawn as a regular wash; however, when you need to "de-wax" the car (required for some polymer sealants to bond to the paint correctly), it's cheap, available, and safe when only used occasionally. For most polymer users, that's once a year or less.



Tort
 
Jon S said:
tried looking at the pics. It comes back with insuffiient bandwidth, try again in a couple of hours.
Click to expand...

Seems to work for everyone else :confused:



perhaps just try again in a couple of hours like it says...I mean it is angelfire we are talkign about here and not some expensive super server. ;)



What does everyone think about this. Does waxing on top of zaino extend the life of the zaino? It seems like common sense that it would, but who knows. If it does that would be great, you would really only have to use z once a year for maximum protection, and get to use a carnuba ~once a month for that super shine. I'm liking this the more I think about it.
 
I've thought long and hard about topping synthetics, but the more I think about it, the less I think it "proves" anything. Here's why...



Typically, synthetics are optically pure - they don't add depth, color or jetting; they increase shine and offer slickness and durability that is not easily surpassed. Carnauba's are not typically optically pure - they deepen the shine, jet the surface, increase color depth, etc (which I prefer, BTW).



So, when you put a product that alters the optics over a product that is optically pure, you can't judge the "look" of the synthetic accurately. Sure, you'll have a slight increase in base shine, but from what I've seen, if I use P21S GEPC under P21S wax, the shine is nearly the same as "straight" synthetic.



Further, I think all durability testing goes out the window when you start topping synthetics because the synthetic is no longer playing a role in the protection - the carnauba is now being the 'sacrifical lamb' - if folks are willing to re-wax their topped synthetic on a monthly basis, why bother with the synthetic base coat?



I've long wondered how folks can say stuff like, "man! I topped my synthetic with carnauba and the durability went through the roof!" or, "product x looks so much better when topped with product y"



How can we tell which is doing what? Topping sort of clouds the whole evaluation process, IMHO. That's not to say it's a bad thing, it just sorta throws a monkey-wrench in to the evaluation process. :)



I also appologize for the ranting/rambling post - I've been sick the past few days and my spirits aren't what they should be. :)



Oh, almost forgot - the car looks excellent, so I'd say keep doing what you're doing - a job well done!
 
Geekysteve,



Doesn't the synthetic base add uv protection? The wax alone has no uv protection.



I was under the assumption that having a synthetic base and using a wax topper gave me the best of both worlds. Let me know what you think.



Cheers,

My Black 7 Series
 
I have to agree with Steve. After trying a topper I think the Zaino being optically perfect lays a base from which wax can not effectivly deepen the look. Perhaps this is why I saw no difference after topping with carnuba. Just throwiung out an Idea.



I looked under various lighting, both natural and unnatural. Waxing the car right down the middle. I asked several people to have a look too and no one was able to see a difference.



Is Zaino really that good? My prep was good, but not great. I applied three coats over three weeks, waiting one week in between each coat. Mostly due to time and no ZFX.



I love Zaino and really don't have a lot of time to detail, so the longevity is a key. I tried a topper because of all the dialogue I've read about topping synthetics like Klasse and Bf.



Frankly,I didn't think I could improve much on the Zaino base but I though I'd try it anyway. evidently I was right.



Happy topping!

Bruce
 
With regards to UV protection, somone posted earlier about the thinness of wax/sealant layers and how they are really inadequate for UV protection. The protection already in the clearcoat is key. After thinking about this, it made sense. I'm beginning to think UV protection is just a marketing ploy...the product ITSELF may be more UV resistant, but actual protection for the car's paint is negligable. If anyone has more info on this, or better yet some sort of real test, I would be most grateful. :xyxthumbs
 
Ahh see - I told you I wasn't thinking clearly when I wrote that post...how could I have forgotten about UV protection?



Many products claim to contain UV inhibitors, but I'm not sure whether or not they actually do. I do recall reading somewhere that the UV inhibitors in carnauba don't/can't work for some reason, but I don't recall what that reason was.



I don't believe that the amount of product that's layered on would have any effect on the UV protection quality - it's just a matter of getting the stuff to work properly in the protectant itself. The layer doesn't have to be very thick to work (sorta like window tint).
 
Thanks Intermezzo & CharlesW. :xyxthumbs



Very interesting test. If this test is half correct, there is really no benefit to using a synthetic sealant before you apply a wax topper.



That said, I personally have had the best outcome, (looks wise), when I have topped either AIO or PUPP with P21S. I have tried all the above by themselves and they don't look as good as the sealant with the wax topper. Oh well, it works for me so I will continue to do the two part process.



Cheers,

My Black 7 Series
 
even if something has very little UV protection, it can and will be marketed as something that does(especially if its competitors are doing it).:o Does this mean i have to believe it....no
 
Well I have to say my car definitely looked to have a 'richer' color. I even got my first ever 'looks really great' comments right after applying teh p21s, could be coincidence but I do wash my car plenty in this lot for my neighbors to notice it.



If any of you were interested, the back of my car has quiet a bit of dust on it after just one day...I guess nothing but frequent washings is going to keep my car clean, oh well!



As for the musings on why top a polymer, I just see it as a way to ensure that your paint has the best protection possible, while still being able to 'play' with the car on the weekend. And if the wax is now the sacrificial lamb, isn't that a good thing? won't that just make the zaino last longer. And let's say the wax layer is depleted before the next waxing is applied, then there is zaino under it in the meantime.



I hope that makes sense, thats just how I see it. It was not any work at all to apply the p21s anyways, and it really looks great now, so I'm glad I did it. Maybe it would look just as good w/o the zaino...but it already has zaino on it, so it is all good.



I'm still a newby so doing something like this was fun to me and good experience.



I'm glad everyone seems to like the pix :bounce
 
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