Your opinions on my pricing structure and your perspective.

Scotty, I'm here to network. Currently this is a hobby that I'm transitioning into a business. I'm educating myself in this forum on the steps and realize I will have to take baby steps. Now that we have talked about that, I would like to thank you for words of wisdom. Really I haven't advertised much but on CL. It's a difficult balance because I like my freedom and in the past I have done 2-3 cars a day. I only am shooting for 1 a day and really don't want to get burnt out as I have in the past.



As a business owner who runs a reputable, fully insured detailing business that has great credentials may I ask you a question to be answered in a PM? The answer would bring me to a sharper decision on my future. The question is what was your gross profit for 2011. I'm asking this humbly and respectfully since I'm undecided in where to focus my efforts, which are detailing cars or to be selling them.
 
J Young said:
I'm asking this humbly and respectfully since I'm undecided in where to focus my efforts, which are detailing cars or to be selling them.



Do both. I just added samll car sales division to my detail shop. If all the car dealers can "detail" why cant a detail shop sell cars? I ran a small car lot for a few years so I wasn't completely new to the car sales game, and the cost of running the lot adds very little to my overhead.
 
Way too much writing and complication. I agree with everyone else, you need to keep it as simple as possible. Think about it this way, human beings are resistant to change and seek out the path of least resistance ($ being a resistant).



When marketing/advertising (which includes pricing), try to think this way (motivated by your Craigslist ad):



1. People on Craigslist are looking for cheap work only.

2. People Craigslist scroll quickly to prices, if they don't see it, they don't care about the photos.

3. People don't care about the stuff we know, they just want to know we know it. Explaining too much bores the crap out of them.

4. Post photos with you in them, it shows people you are real and human beings are "book cover" judges. We know better, but we will pick better looking people over sloppy or invisible people instantly. (make sure you have a "uniform", I have nice performance PGA polo shirts I got for $15 at Marshall's, they are usually $30!)

5. If you are going to be cheap, be a little cheaper; too cheap and you attract cheap people that won't appreciate your work anyway. When they don't appreciate your work, it's instantly demotivating for people like us who take so much pride in it.



I hope this helps.
 
J Young said:
Scotty, I'm here to network. Currently this is a hobby that I'm transitioning into a business. I'm educating myself in this forum on the steps and realize I will have to take baby steps. Now that we have talked about that, I would like to thank you for words of wisdom. Really I haven't advertised much but on CL. It's a difficult balance because I like my freedom and in the past I have done 2-3 cars a day. I only am shooting for 1 a day and really don't want to get burnt out as I have in the past.



As a business owner who runs a reputable, fully insured detailing business that has great credentials may I ask you a question to be answered in a PM? The answer would bring me to a sharper decision on my future. The question is what was your gross profit for 2011. I'm asking this humbly and respectfully since I'm undecided in where to focus my efforts, which are detailing cars or to be selling them.



My profits won't really have anything to do with your business as you are not only in a completely different area than I am but a different country where a huge amount of factors affect profitability. I will say that the last 3 years have been probably my best in almost 19 years despite our cost factors getting to be what I would consider to be extremely high with respect to wages etc. There is profit to be made in this business but in my opinion you have to be really busy to have a shot at making any money. Last year we did very well but even then we still only ended up with a year end profit of around 10% of gross sales but as I stated earlier I am in Canada and the cost of doing business here is exponentially higher than in the US.
 
Quenga said:
Way too much writing and complication. I agree with everyone else, you need to keep it as simple as possible. Think about it this way, human beings are resistant to change and seek out the path of least resistance ($ being a resistant).



When marketing/advertising (which includes pricing), try to think this way (motivated by your Craigslist ad):



1. People on Craigslist are looking for cheap work only.

2. People Craigslist scroll quickly to prices, if they don't see it, they don't care about the photos.

3. People don't care about the stuff we know, they just want to know we know it. Explaining too much bores the crap out of them.

4. Post photos with you in them, it shows people you are real and human beings are "book cover" judges. We know better, but we will pick better looking people over sloppy or invisible people instantly. (make sure you have a "uniform", I have nice performance PGA polo shirts I got for $15 at Marshall's, they are usually $30!)

5. If you are going to be cheap, be a little cheaper; too cheap and you attract cheap people that won't appreciate your work anyway. When they don't appreciate your work, it's instantly demotivating for people like us who take so much pride in it.



I hope this helps.

Yes it does and Thank you very much. It makes sense and the vision has manifested into delivery...off to create, will share later.
 
rustytruck said:
The Craigslist ad is bad. Keep it simple. I find the forums somewhat interesting because the guys on here want to share way to much info with the customers. Ask the customer what they want their car to look like then shoot them a fair price. Talking about clay will not mean anything to customers.

Mike you should try to change your perspective. Talking about clay builds value to your services. Maybe you're just not explaining how it will remove all surface contaminants bringing back the new smooth feel and look. Whether you're over the phone or when they drop the vehicle off this is a great time to illustrate the importance of clay bar application. I make it standard for all vehicles I wax to be clay bar washed. Tell your prospect to place fingers in a plastic bag and rub the clear coat slowly after they washed their vehicle to understand the reason why a vehicle needs to be clay bar washed. Then close your prospect over the phone or in person. Also in my perspective sharing a glimpse of what we do generates curiosity and an understanding of the level of work that separates a drive-way home owner wash vs a professional detail. If you have a customer still asking questions then that means the next no could be the next yes whilst instilling confidence in your services to your prospect.
 
MichaelM said:
What hourly rate do you need to be profitable? That's really all that matters when you try to figure out your pricing.



I do agree with the other comments though. If you have to explain your pricing and give examples of it in action in your ad then it's going to be too complicated or require more attention then the average shopper will be willing to devote to an ad.



Law of averages. Why do I need an hourly rate when I can rely on the law of averages and commit to volume. I disagree with the other posters because the more questions = more curiosity and an opportunity to instill confidence in your services. If someone cares about a detail, be a salesman and sell the service. Give them the vision and want to do business with you versus the cold shoulder hard priced menu. Further if a prospect doesn't want to talk with me about their car what motivates me to accept the job? Basically what I'm magnetizing is repeat customers who refer and proudly drive off with a smile every-time. I aim to omit prospects who are unappreciative of my services, time and effort.
 
J Young - Although some of the advice seems to go against your beliefs I would suggest you take into consideration their experience. I know because I started out like you and learned real quick. Most people don't care what you say to them. I've tried explaining stuff and most cut me off and say, "yeah, sounds great...so how much?". Even people that want high-end detailing normally don't care. What matters is that you look like you know what you're doing, you sound interested in it and most importantly, you do a good job.



Only a suggestion and coming from experience. I wanted to start out detailing a certain way, but I adapt pretty quickly to what I see in the environment. In general, customers are not interested in the process, they are interested in the price and end result. Especially us Americans, we don't want the journey, we want the vacation.





And with what RustyTruck said, he should be reminded that most detailers start out this way. Enthusiasts can't help but to be enthused. However, the quicker you train your mind to a businessman rather than a detailer, the quicker you'll make money.



Heck, I'm still a new and still learning, but I draw from others experience instead of waiting for it to happen to me. I thought my website was simple, I posted it up and found out how not simple it was, lol. That's the power of forum members. If they are all saying it......it might just be true.



Good luck!!
 
Quenga said:
J Young - Although some of the advice seems to go against your beliefs I would suggest you take into consideration their experience. I know because I started out like you and learned real quick. Most people don't care what you say to them. I've tried explaining stuff and most cut me off and say, "yeah, sounds great...so how much?". Even people that want high-end detailing normally don't care. What matters is that you look like you know what you're doing, you sound interested in it and most importantly, you do a good job.



Only a suggestion and coming from experience. I wanted to start out detailing a certain way, but I adapt pretty quickly to what I see in the environment. In general, customers are not interested in the process, they are interested in the price and end result. Especially us Americans, we don't want the journey, we want the vacation.





And with what RustyTruck said, he should be reminded that most detailers start out this way. Enthusiasts can't help but to be enthused. However, the quicker you train your mind to a businessman rather than a detailer, the quicker you'll make money.



Heck, I'm still a new and still learning, but I draw from others experience instead of waiting for it to happen to me. I thought my website was simple, I posted it up and found out how not simple it was, lol. That's the power of forum members. If they are all saying it......it might just be true.



Good luck!!



Quenga, thanks bro!! You're right, however my visions and my business acumen of salesmanship and attention to detail is what I want to market. When I worked at a shop that was all about the money and had me lying to the customer saying I wheeled a trailer when instead I just de-greased it, that begets no money and an unsatisfied customer. When someone doesn't know about clay and you do it anyways because its to your interest to wax a clean car instead of waxing through dirt its a win/win.



When I do an overnight service I like to have my secondary laptop in my garage when the customer comes to pick it up and before money is brought out I show the before and afters to them and build value. The instant gratification is accomplished and not only do I accomplish having a customer wanting to pay and be off on the road they also tip anywhere from $10-$40 based on how big their heart is and how well I presented. I know people wanna go on vacation and not here about the journey but I tell it to them anyway because I'm a story teller and salesman. My audience listens, agrees, and feels value from my services which by default makes them tell their friends and family. Feelings that feel good create positive outcomes regardless. Give a positive feeling and stay in that frequency to magnetize more business, that's what I'm doing.
 
J Young said:
Quenga, thanks bro!! You're right, however my visions and my business acumen of salesmanship and attention to detail is what I want to market.



The only vision you need is the vision of profit. As a detail business and business owner, you are automatically a salesman and they are already paying you for attention to detail. Those you don't have to market at all. It's like a grocery store that sets out to market that they sell food. Yes, we know that, that's why we go to a grocery store.



The only thing I market to customers is my integrity. It helps that I'm a former Marine, so I play off that. You need to market why you are different, not why you are a detailer. Selling the idea that you are honest and pay attention actually has a negative effect. People in general are cynical. I stopped trying to fluff my customer.



When I worked at a shop that was all about the money and had me lying to the customer saying I wheeled a trailer when instead I just de-greased it, that begets no money and an unsatisfied customer. When someone doesn't know about clay and you do it anyways because its to your interest to wax a clean car instead of waxing through dirt its a win/win.



It's definitely not a win/win if you don't charge them for it. You should study the meaning of value and demand. Value is what people believe will benefit them. Although I can afford a new car, I don't see the benefit of paying for one. On the other hand, I know people who make less money and only buy new cars because they feel it's worth it. You are selling new cars at used prices. What you have to realize is that there are those that will pay the price of a new car and those that will only pay the price of a used one. By selling a new car at a used car price you are only hurting yourself.



Demand isn't what people want, it's what they can afford and what they can afford is what they "value". I would like a new car, but I'm not a part of new car demand because I'm not willing to pay for it. I know I'm not getting a new car when I buy a used one, so when it turns out to be just a used car, I'm still 100% happy. That's a tough concept to realize for new business owners. You want to give people their monies worth, but instead you are underestimating what they already believe their money is worth. Some people shop at Nordstroms simply because they believe they are getting more for their money. Actually giving people more than what they are asking for is detrimental to business success.



Unless they ask a question, I don't give them answers. I don't get paid to talk or explain my services. I only ask 3 questions now: 1. What are you looking to spend? 2. How long is the car available? 3. What are you looking for? Not necessarily in that order either. I then tell them what I can do within their budget and time frame, and then suggest services they don't know they want. But, I only briefly explain what it is. If someone really wants to know something, they'll ask.





When I do an overnight service I like to have my secondary laptop in my garage when the customer comes to pick it up and before money is brought out I show the before and afters to them and build value. The instant gratification is accomplished and not only do I accomplish having a customer wanting to pay and be off on the road they also tip anywhere from $10-$40 based on how big their heart is and how well I presented. I know people wanna go on vacation and not here about the journey but I tell it to them anyway because I'm a story teller and salesman. My audience listens, agrees, and feels value from my services which by default makes them tell their friends and family. Feelings that feel good create positive outcomes regardless. Give a positive feeling and stay in that frequency to magnetize more business, that's what I'm doing.



I bet that if you showed them the pictures afterwards, you'd still get the same amount of money and tip. It's also not the best way to market. I ask for their e-mail address so I can send them photos I took throughout the process. I now have their e-mail for future marketing and they now have an e-mail from me to show to their friends, family and co-workers. Also, it reminds them of me when they are home or at work, which increases the chances they'll show someone. When you show them the photos up front, by the time they get home they forgot about it. If you then e-mail them the photos, they're not as interested as they've already seen it.



I've received $20-$40 tips from people that didn't even see their car after I was done. My last customer came out, paid me, closed the garage door and left. She didn't even look at the car and she still tipped me $30. People are going to tip what they want to tip regardless. And a tip isn't worth as much as a referral....





Just keep it in mind and I suggest you study business. I would also look into reading about the 80/20 principle and really try to apply it to your model. 80% of your business comes from 20% of your available services. Although I am capable of high end paint correction, most just want a wash and wax. Right now you're offering 80% of your services to people that will only pay you 20% of what it's worth.



Lastly. Storytellers and song writers don't make money. Directors and actors do. You are the director and the car is your actor. Showcase the car and they will pay to see your show. Britney Spears can't sing, but she gets paid millions to do so and people don't care.





Your #1 goal in business should always be to make money. Your salesmanship and attention to detail is your foundation. No one cares how a house is built, they just want stainless steel appliances.
 
J Young said:
Law of averages. Why do I need an hourly rate when I can rely on the law of averages and commit to volume.



Law of averages from Wikipedia



"The law of averages is a lay term used to express a belief that outcomes of a random event will "even out" within a small sample.

As invoked in everyday life, the "law" usually reflects bad statistics or wishful thinking rather than any mathematical principle."



Do you want to be busy or profitable? Both, you say? Great. How do you know what profitable is without knowing how much you need to make? Gotta know your margins. Being busy on low margins leads to poor quality and burn out on your part. Whereas being busy on good margins makes for a thriving business that is sustainable over the long term.



J Young said:
I disagree with the other posters because the more questions = more curiosity and an opportunity to instill confidence in your services



Confusion will also turn off all of the people who are on the fence. Make it easy on the average person to figure out and your sales will go up.



J Young said:
I aim to omit prospects who are unappreciative of my services, time and effort.



How do you do that? Do you look for some kind of reaction out of them when they pick up the cars? If they don't flip out do you not take their call the next time around? The only way to tell that a customer appreciates your time and effort is if they come back and/or refer you. My .02...love them (the customers) all.
 
Quenga, I'll check that 80/20. I'm short on time today so I'll respond correctly when I have some extra hours this week.
 
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