What am I doing wrong - Disappointed with Menzerna - Please HELP!!

rcurley55 said:
bwaaahahaha...that's great - leave it to me - whoops!
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Same here! Scared me for a sec...thought it was my wife on line!



One of the things I've learned here about the pc is to work the product thoroughly. My first use of the pc was apply the polish, wipe off with a mf. After some practice, I learned to work DACP until it almost disappears on the surface. This was the big difference for my customer's cars.
 
Are you using the handle with the PC? I find you get much better control, less vibration and can apply more pressure without the handle and just holding onto the PC body.



Michael
 
Thanks for the tips everyone....



I only polish my car when it's in my garage, so absolutely no direct sunlight.



I may try it without the handle to see how it goes.



Thanks for the tips. I wouldn't mind trying poorboys - but I have enough products as is...here's the list of abrasives



Menzerna IP and FP

3M FI-II and SMR

Megs DACP



So I'm thinking that a combo of those should bring the Bimmer back to life.
 
rcurley55i I second the advice to use the PC without the handle. I can't remember the last time I had a handle on one of mine. Some people are just more bothered by the PC's vibration than are other people. If it *really* bothers you (numbness is *not* good- it can actually cause real damage), I'd consider getting a Cyclo instead. Yeah, it's money, but you don't want to hurt yourself doing something like polishing your car ;)



Sometimes the PC is just not the tool for the job. Some scratches are really beyond it's capabilities, calling for a rotary or at least a Cyclo. Even when they *are* doable with the PC, it can take *so* long that you just can't imagine it (literally hours for one panel). That said, I'd do almost *all* my marring removal-by-PC with the yellow pad, just following up with the white one to remove any hazing. The PC isn't a very aggressive tool (and it can't generate the heat you need for aggressive products), so you gotta compensate with your choice of pad.



If the IP, DACP, and FI-II aren't strong enough, well, you're nearing the limit of the PC's abilities. You can try some more aggressive products but you'll soon be using them "outside the box" by not using a rotary.
 
Thanks for your input!



Accumulator said:
rcurley55i I second the advice to use the PC without the handle. I can't remember the last time I had a handle on one of mine. Some people are just more bothered by the PC's vibration than are other people. If it *really* bothers you (numbness is *not* good- it can actually cause real damage), I'd consider getting a Cyclo instead. Yeah, it's money, but you don't want to hurt yourself doing something like polishing your car ;)
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I don't think it *really* bothers me that much - but the handle side is the one that bugs, so I'm going to test it with the handle off and see if that makes it feel a bit better!



The better question is - is this level of vibration appropriate for a PC?



Sometimes the PC is just not the tool for the job....

If the IP, DACP, and FI-II aren't strong enough, well, you're nearing the limit of the PC's abilities. You can try some more aggressive products but you'll soon be using them "outside the box" by not using a rotary.
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Well, everyone tells me that if you can't feel it with your fingernail, you should be able to get it out. Well, either I missed that fact that you need MANY passes - i.e. more then 2, or my technique is wrong...



I think it's a combo - I think I move too fast across the panel, and maybe don't apply enough pressure. I'm probably a bit impatient too!



I'm going to step things up to the DACP with the yellow and give that a go with the tips I have received here and we'll see how that goes....



I can't get to the car until tonight or tomorrow, so hopefully, I'll have a good update soon. That and I need to grab a halogen from my brother's house - he stole it for a home improvement project.



I've been driving the show car to work so that way I can keep the M3 out of the sun and clean - as it has no protection on it at all. Good thing I have a short commute!!



Thanks again everyone - this place is awesome!
 
rcurley55 said:
The better question is - is this level of vibration appropriate for a PC?
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Probably. If you have the 6" counterweight on there, there isn't much more you can do. The PC just vibrates quite a bit.







Well, everyone tells me that if you can't feel it with your fingernail, you should be able to get it out. Well, either I missed that fact that you need MANY passes - i.e. more then 2, or my technique is wrong...
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I dunno about the "feel it with your nail" test for this. IMO, there are plenty of scratches that you won't feel that still won't come out by PC. I think people overestimate what the PC can do.



But yeah, it can take over a *dozen* very slow passes to get marring out by PC. I wasn't kidding about how it can literally take hours per panel.
 
Accumulator said:
But yeah, it can take over a *dozen* very slow passes to get marring out by PC. I wasn't kidding about how it can literally take hours per panel.
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Sounds like my expectation level was a bit too high - now I can re-evaluate what this is worth to me and move forward from there.



thanks again for the advise!



Would it be better to attack some of these scratches by hand with a different product, or just use a glaze and cover them up?



comments?
 
Accumulator said:
IMO, there are plenty of scratches that you won't feel that still won't come out by PC. I think people overestimate what the PC can do.



But yeah, it can take over a *dozen* very slow passes to get marring out by PC. I wasn't kidding about how it can literally take hours per panel.
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I'll second that
 
rcurley55 said:
Would it be better to attack some of these scratches by hand with a different product, or just use a glaze and cover them up?



comments?
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Only few aggressive products have worked well for me by hand. 1Z Ultra/Extra comes to mind. You could try working a limited area with that and then going over it with something milder using the PC. IMO the hiding qualities of most glazes is over-rated, but yeah, it wouldn't hurt as a penultimate step before your LSP. Using a "heavy" wax like #16 will help a little too.
 
Well, I think I'll try the DACP next, then follow it up with the Menzerna twins - I love the color they give. Then I have some leftover blackfire that I may use on top...
 
You may be a the limits of what can be accomplished with a dual-action machine. Remember to remove a swirl or paint defect you must remove the layer of clear coat or paint that contains the defect. You literally abrade away the surface until the defect is gone. D-A polishers are not designed to remove paint. That's their big safety advantage. Unfortunately it also limits what can be accomplished. A D-A machine will always make the surface look better but may not be able to fully remove deeper swirls and spots.

Terry Freiberg

Classic Motoring Acc
 
rcurley55 said:
Sounds like my expectation level was a bit too high - now I can re-evaluate what this is worth to me and move forward from there.



thanks again for the advise!



Would it be better to attack some of these scratches by hand with a different product, or just use a glaze and cover them up?



comments?
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Your case souds a lot like mine. I was able to remove swirls, at least from plain view i.e. no direct light, but there are this fine linear scratches all around the car that make me mad becouse I haven't been able to get rid of them. And as you say they seem very light as the can't be felt with my fingernails.



See my thread and you'll see that you are not the only one disapointed.





http://www.autopia.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38836



Ricardo
 
Terry, thank you for the input - I guess I can't express how minor these scratches are. They are so light - I've pulled out worse from clears by hand using just some basic cleaner wax.



I think it's just my technique or the PC isn't really capable of some of the feats I see on this site...something tells me it's my patience and the prior...
 
ricastm8 said:
Your case souds a lot like mine. I was able to remove swirls, at least from plain view i.e. no direct light, but there are this fine linear scratches all around the car that make me mad becouse I haven't been able to get rid of them. And as you say they seem very light as the can't be felt with my fingernails.



See my thread and you'll see that you are not the only one disapointed.





http://www.autopia.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38836



Ricardo
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Wow!! Amazing how similar that could be - nice BMW BTW. It does look great - similar to my results - it's gets me 90% there, but I'm a damn perfectionist!!
 
rcurley55 said:
Wow!! Amazing how similar that could be - nice BMW BTW. It does look great - similar to my results - it's gets me 90% there, but I'm a damn perfectionist!!
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I guess it has something to do with non metalic BMW paint, I mean about those light linear scratches. :nixweiss



It's a good begining, as a perfectionist, to have a BMW:D , and even more if its an M3:bow .



Ricardo:xyxthumbs
 
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