3Dog
New member
I just ordered the new Werkstatt products. I will give some info hopefully next week.
http://www.jeffswerkstatt.com/prime.php
http://www.jeffswerkstatt.com/prime.php
Werkstatt
- Thread starter 3Dog
- Start date
:hairpull Now I have to spend more money!
Based on my results with the Werkstatt products I have already used, I imagine I'll be quite happy. Prime Stong and Carnauba are the two I am most interested in. I need to order more AJ soon, probaby just do it all at once.
Definitely interested in what you have to say about them.
Based on my results with the Werkstatt products I have already used, I imagine I'll be quite happy. Prime Stong and Carnauba are the two I am most interested in. I need to order more AJ soon, probaby just do it all at once.
Definitely interested in what you have to say about them.
Scott, What do you think that strong will provide over standard prime? Have you used standard prime under CJ? I think I would prefer to use standard prime, a coat or two of AJ then CJ rather then PC and CJ. It should last longer I would think. I guess if you only wanted CJ on your car then thats where PC comes in.
Prime: Strong can address light marring and swirling more effectively than Prime, yet the polishing agents--though stronger--are still gentle enough for regular use. It makes a beautiful, easy hand polish for those without machine polishers, and it works quite well as a chrome polish and sealant.
WOO!! Gentle enough for regular use?! Does this mean we can get rid of our wash induced marring once a month? Anyone ever talk to Jeff about specifically how safe this is to use regularly? Sounds very interesting!!
WOO!! Gentle enough for regular use?! Does this mean we can get rid of our wash induced marring once a month? Anyone ever talk to Jeff about specifically how safe this is to use regularly? Sounds very interesting!!
3Dog
New member
I will try them all ( got the Trigger AJ too). But the Prime Strong (WPS?) has my interest more.. a little cutting power sounds good.
3Dog
New member
I never asked what exactly he meant by "regular". But I will.
One thing he did let me know is, the new Primes were born out of customer requests and feedback. So we at least know somebody does listen to what we want instead of telling us what we need. ( That doesnt sound harsh does it)
One thing he did let me know is, the new Primes were born out of customer requests and feedback. So we at least know somebody does listen to what we want instead of telling us what we need. ( That doesnt sound harsh does it)
gmblack3a said:
I am hoping Prime Strong will save me a polishing step. Currently, with regular Prime, I still need to polish out any light defect first.
I have used Prime under CJ and while it looks really good, it seems a little 'bright'. I am hoping that the carnauba version will accentuate the darkening of the paint you get with CJ.
imported_flatstick
New member
[quote name='Scottwax']I am hoping Prime Strong will save me a polishing step. Currently, with regular Prime, I still need to polish out any light defect first.
That would be nice to save people a step. my results have been great with their product. as said before, it is nice that they are willing to produce a product that is geared toward more versatility.
That would be nice to save people a step. my results have been great with their product. as said before, it is nice that they are willing to produce a product that is geared toward more versatility.
Well I recieved a response back today from Jeff:
" Hi Josh,
Thank you for contacting the Werkstatt. We appreciate your interest in our new products.
The new Prime: Strong was designed to be more aggressive than Prime in correcting paint defects such as minor hazing, buffer marks, and swirl marks. Of course, this will be dependent on the hardness of the paint, the extent of the marring, and how the Prime is applied (hand or machine). For Strong, we selected a milder version of the light abrasive often employed in final finishing polishes, and so it can often eliminate the need for a separate final polish. For severe marring, you would still want to use a more abrasive, dedicated swirl mark polish first.
On a vehicle that has already had major imperfections corrected, Prime: Strong can help maintain a clear, mar-free surface. While it could be used every week, our idea of "regular use" was more like every 2-4 months, at every detailing session, if needed. We always recommend that the least aggressive path be taken first, and that the condition of the paint should always dictate the product choices. If wash-induced marring is significant enough to be noticable after a week, the best plan of action would be to try to improve wash technique to prevent marring. It also could become quite a chore to polish the vehicle that frequently!
Bottom line: yes, it would be safe to use often, depending on how your paint responds to it, but it is always better to use any abrasive containing polish--even a mild one like Strong--more infrequently by preventing marring instead.
If you have any other questions or need clarification, please feel free to reply to this message.
Happy Detailing!
JEFFS Werkstatt Product Development Team "
Sounds like this is going to be a great product for those of who want to clear up minor marring from washing once every month or two! Cant wait to try it out!
" Hi Josh,
Thank you for contacting the Werkstatt. We appreciate your interest in our new products.
The new Prime: Strong was designed to be more aggressive than Prime in correcting paint defects such as minor hazing, buffer marks, and swirl marks. Of course, this will be dependent on the hardness of the paint, the extent of the marring, and how the Prime is applied (hand or machine). For Strong, we selected a milder version of the light abrasive often employed in final finishing polishes, and so it can often eliminate the need for a separate final polish. For severe marring, you would still want to use a more abrasive, dedicated swirl mark polish first.
On a vehicle that has already had major imperfections corrected, Prime: Strong can help maintain a clear, mar-free surface. While it could be used every week, our idea of "regular use" was more like every 2-4 months, at every detailing session, if needed. We always recommend that the least aggressive path be taken first, and that the condition of the paint should always dictate the product choices. If wash-induced marring is significant enough to be noticable after a week, the best plan of action would be to try to improve wash technique to prevent marring. It also could become quite a chore to polish the vehicle that frequently!
Bottom line: yes, it would be safe to use often, depending on how your paint responds to it, but it is always better to use any abrasive containing polish--even a mild one like Strong--more infrequently by preventing marring instead.
If you have any other questions or need clarification, please feel free to reply to this message.
Happy Detailing!
JEFFS Werkstatt Product Development Team "
Sounds like this is going to be a great product for those of who want to clear up minor marring from washing once every month or two! Cant wait to try it out!
Setec Astronomy
Well-known member
Joshua312 said:
As Jeff alluded to, if you are getting enough wash-induced marring to have to polish every month or two, I think you need to review your wash technique. Plenty of threads on here.
Maybe Im just too anal about the minor marring I get - It isnt alot at all, can only see minor marring when the sun hits it just right. Currently I use a chenille wash mit, cover the car in foam, then aim the foam gun right in front of the path of my mitt and follow it closely. Then I rinse the section and move onto the next, the maint thing I need to fix is my pressure being applied to the mitt. I also tried accumulators method of the mitt balloon, but it didn't quite work for me, I rinse my mitt every panel or 2 and work from top to bottom, I'll try to get a picture in the sun if I can, I should probably just live with the marring and be thankful it isnt heavy/hazy and lots of swirling.
It's always nice to hear that Jeff or any manufacturer actually listens to product improvement ideas/suggestions.
Just curious as to who actually asked for some of the tweaked Prime formulations, etc. It seems that the Werkstatt products wouldn't be widely known to Joe public. Was it anybody from the forum?
Just curious as to who actually asked for some of the tweaked Prime formulations, etc. It seems that the Werkstatt products wouldn't be widely known to Joe public. Was it anybody from the forum?
Here is another response from Jeff I got....
Hi Josh,
Glad the information was useful.
Washing without marring can be difficult, especially on softer paints, but it is a worthwhile pursuit. And, Prime: Strong will help to address the small imperfections that even the best wash routines can't avoid. Unfortunately, there is always a balance between practicality and perfection... especially on a daily-driven vehicle!
The Werkstatt does not typically compare our products with competitor's products just as we do not test compatibility between our products and competitors products. We try to leave that to our customers! But, in terms of aggressiveness or cut, if we were forced to make a comparison at this time, we would tend to classify Strong just under products like Menzerna Final Polish, PB SSR1, or Megs #80. We employ a different, softer, type of polishing agent from those particular products, however, so the method of action is a bit different and arguably safer for more frequent use. There just doesn't seem to be much in exactly the same category as Strong!
All of the Prime formulas can be applied by hand with a foam pad or by machine with a polishing or finishing pad. Of course, machine polishing will maximize the ability of the formulas to address any marring. Work the Prime into the surface just until it starts to clear out and dry. It can be immediately buffed off, or to maximize protection, allow it to dry/cure for a short time and then buff. You could get more defect removal out of Strong by bumping up to a firm orange pad or other light cut pad, but the pad itself may leave marring then. We feel that with a finishing pad, frequent use is quite safe.
As with any polish, after a use or two on your particular paint, you should get a better sense of the aggressiveness and a better sense of how often you'd feel comfortable using the product. It would be far easier to give recommendations if all paints were the same!
Thanks for all the kind words about our products, about the results you've seen on Autopia, and about our responsiveness to customers. Our customers tend to be a very experienced and dedicated group, so we'd be foolish not to take suggestions seriously!
Our email is always open. We love to hear comments, questions, and suggestions!
Happy Detailing!
JEFFS Werkstatt Product Development Team
**Hope this helps those who are following this thread, asking Jeff has really helped me understand what I want to use this product for. I decided Im only going to use it every 2-3 months on a finishing pad if needed. And I am going to try and work on my wash techniques more and more, and put some good durable layers of 2180 and Pink wax to help protect me
Hi Josh,
Glad the information was useful.
Washing without marring can be difficult, especially on softer paints, but it is a worthwhile pursuit. And, Prime: Strong will help to address the small imperfections that even the best wash routines can't avoid. Unfortunately, there is always a balance between practicality and perfection... especially on a daily-driven vehicle!
The Werkstatt does not typically compare our products with competitor's products just as we do not test compatibility between our products and competitors products. We try to leave that to our customers! But, in terms of aggressiveness or cut, if we were forced to make a comparison at this time, we would tend to classify Strong just under products like Menzerna Final Polish, PB SSR1, or Megs #80. We employ a different, softer, type of polishing agent from those particular products, however, so the method of action is a bit different and arguably safer for more frequent use. There just doesn't seem to be much in exactly the same category as Strong!
All of the Prime formulas can be applied by hand with a foam pad or by machine with a polishing or finishing pad. Of course, machine polishing will maximize the ability of the formulas to address any marring. Work the Prime into the surface just until it starts to clear out and dry. It can be immediately buffed off, or to maximize protection, allow it to dry/cure for a short time and then buff. You could get more defect removal out of Strong by bumping up to a firm orange pad or other light cut pad, but the pad itself may leave marring then. We feel that with a finishing pad, frequent use is quite safe.
As with any polish, after a use or two on your particular paint, you should get a better sense of the aggressiveness and a better sense of how often you'd feel comfortable using the product. It would be far easier to give recommendations if all paints were the same!
Thanks for all the kind words about our products, about the results you've seen on Autopia, and about our responsiveness to customers. Our customers tend to be a very experienced and dedicated group, so we'd be foolish not to take suggestions seriously!
Our email is always open. We love to hear comments, questions, and suggestions!
Happy Detailing!
JEFFS Werkstatt Product Development Team
**Hope this helps those who are following this thread, asking Jeff has really helped me understand what I want to use this product for. I decided Im only going to use it every 2-3 months on a finishing pad if needed. And I am going to try and work on my wash techniques more and more, and put some good durable layers of 2180 and Pink wax to help protect me
3Dog
New member
chml17l said:
Most of my conversations with Jeff have been about developing some sort of one-step. These conversation are more to do with my company HOGtailing more than with autos. But I am sure it will apply to that area also.
Setec Astronomy
Well-known member
Hey, man, I never meant to suggest with my earlier comments that it would be unsafe to use Prime: Strong on a frequent basis. If it's roughly equivalent to SSR1, you should be able to use it every day without any problem! What I meant is that if you are inducing enough marring to have to polish that frequently, you're working too hard and should think about adjusting your washing techniques so you don't have to polish so often.
and should think about adjusting your washing techniques so you don't have to polish so often.Setec Astronomy said:Hey, man, I never meant to suggest with my earlier comments that it would be unsafe to use Prime: Strong on a frequent basis. If it's roughly equivalent to SSR1, you should be able to use it every day without any problem! What I meant is that if you are inducing enough marring to have to polish that frequently, you're working too hard
Oh no no no! No need to take back what you said or apologize...I am not too familiar with abrasive cuts with all these different products and how safe specific products are to use on my surface. In fact I never knew SSR1 was safe enough to use on a daily basis...I myself love to polish, even if it is just to make the surface brighter w/o any abrasives. I dont mind spending time on my car...So I was just wondering if this would be something if I get bored on late nights I could go out once every other week and clear my finish up if needed. I appreciate your input and help. I think I feel comfortable now with this product and being able to use it frequently, however I still plan to only use a finishing pad.
-Just so Im clear on how you feel...If needed on a vehicle, this would be safe to use everyday? Sorry Im not so knowledgeable on some of these mild abrasives!
Setec Astronomy
Well-known member
Oh crap, here I go putting my foot in my mouth again. Accumulator is famous for advising people to live with minor marring because "it's only original once". There is a finite amount of clearcoat on your car, and you don't want to remove any more than you have to, so you want to minimize reasons for having to polish. Of course, if you have a 3 year lease, you probably don't have to worry about polishing thru the paint in that time...but some of us have had our cars for a bit longer (16 years next month for one of mine). I was being a little facetious about using SSR1 every day...it is very mild, but...