True Condition AFTER Polishing
- Thread starter spotpad
- Start date
I've been following #80 with AIO on my black 626 and I haven't noticed any degradation in the polished appearance of #80 after using AIO, which does remove the TS oils in #80. It may be pad selection or buffing technique plays a role in any marring that may be left behind. My last pass over #80 is always excruciatingly slow, before I started doing that, I was getting some light marring. I've also been sticking with polishing pads, or the Propel Light Cut pad (green) when using #80.
Accumulator
Well-known member
Scottwax- Could also be the differences between Mazda and Audi clear, at least with regard to my experiences. The clear on our MPV is a bit softer than that on the Audis, and maybe the #80 just works better on it. The stuff on the A8 was *unremoved old marring* as opposed to anything new. And FWIW, it would've taken some real work to get it out with any other product too, so I hope I didn't sound like I was bashing the #80.
George-I didn't take it as bashing, on harder paints, #80 doesn't have enough oomph, so I go up to DACP and I've also been trying PB's SSR2.5 as well. #80 is my main polishing, seems to be aggressive enough on about 85% of the vehicles I detail.
Didn't do much on my neighbor's Regal (man, I wish I took some before shots!) so I had to step up to DACP then back to #80. At that point, I ran out of light and since she was going to be out of town until today, I figured I'd stop with #80. Anyway, it rained mud the next day (it had been dry and windy, so all the dust in the air came down with the rain) and for the next 9 days, it just sat with only #80 as protection. I got a couple hours to finish it today and of course, had to QEW wash the crude all over the car. Paint was beading nicely and even after washing, it still looked freshly polished. Not too bad for a polish, eh? BTW, finished off with VM and 1Z Glanz Wax.
Didn't do much on my neighbor's Regal (man, I wish I took some before shots!) so I had to step up to DACP then back to #80. At that point, I ran out of light and since she was going to be out of town until today, I figured I'd stop with #80. Anyway, it rained mud the next day (it had been dry and windy, so all the dust in the air came down with the rain) and for the next 9 days, it just sat with only #80 as protection. I got a couple hours to finish it today and of course, had to QEW wash the crude all over the car. Paint was beading nicely and even after washing, it still looked freshly polished. Not too bad for a polish, eh? BTW, finished off with VM and 1Z Glanz Wax.
Accumulator
Well-known member
Scottwax said:
Yeah, it's interesting that the "fresh-paint-safe-polymers" held up so well. That's well worth knowing.
Accumulator said:
Yes, it is good to know. I'm going to have my hood repainted since at one point before my brother owned it, someone repainted it and didn't do a good job laying down the base coat. In certain lighting, you can see light streaks down the length of the hood. The shop I am taking it to uses Spies-Hecker paints and he recommends not waxing for 3 months! #80 is going to get a bi-weekly workout for 90 days!
After using #80, I usually go to NXT and then #16. I am not concerned about hidden micro marring, which is hard to see on white. I was thinking about adding EX or EX-P to this mix. After NXT, since NXT has cleaners in it?
Can anyone tell me the specific difference between EX and EX-P? They are both sealants, right? Hypothetically, they should go on before NXT, right?
Can anyone tell me the specific difference between EX and EX-P? They are both sealants, right? Hypothetically, they should go on before NXT, right?
gearhead said:I'm confused, it's better to polish the fresh paint which can't be waxed?
You can polish fresh paint, that is what they do after wetsanding. I will be polishing with #80 because it lays down a breathable polymer protection that will not interfere with the curing process.
tripper_111
New member
As big fan #80, I guess I have to chime in. Normal to us hardcore and professional detailers is the conduct of experiment on the different detailing products. Honestly, in my not-so-long detailing expereince, I've only got to experiment with a few proline megs products and some Mothers, 3M. By experiment, I mean, I've got to play with it by changing the different variables like, machine used, pad, hand application, etc. I have tried the Zaino and Klasse, but wasn't able to play with them much because they're too expensive.
Now back to the topic:
This is what I've got:
1.) Yes, it has fillers that's why it's Speed "Glaze."
2.) Yes, it has abrasive cutters thus the "Speed" (as if a polisher and glaze in one ---> multi-purpose product.
It can "hide" marring or "eliminate" them depending on the machine.
If used with an orbital/dual-action even with a polishing pad (megs yellow pad), it will eliminate "minor" defects but much of this result is attributed from the "swirl hiding" ability of the TS oil.
However, if used by rotary with the same pad, it produces the result like using an orbital/dual-action with the same pad and DACP.
So one factor that affect #80's result is the machine used. There are a lot of overlapping setups that I've just discovered in my not-so-long period of detailing. Like:
- W8000 pad + DACP + orbital = W8000 pad + #80 + rotary
- W8000 pad + #80 + orbital = W9000 pad + #83 + rotary
- and the list goes on.
From my detailing products diary may be found:
- #80 by hand (shake well) = glazing effect only/hides swirls/no cutting
- #80 by orbital (depending on pad) = light cut/hides swirls/not totally eliminate swirls/swirls re-appear when the oils evaporate
- #80 by rotary (depending on pad) = medium cut for not so deep swirls/eliminates totally/swirls doesn't re-appear even if oils were no longer apparent.
All the notes in my detailing diary was done on a scrap hood panel which I guess have been with me for as long as I've started detailing. It's my beloved test panel.
DISCLAIMER: You're results may vary. You know what I mean.
Now back to the topic:
This is what I've got:
1.) Yes, it has fillers that's why it's Speed "Glaze."
2.) Yes, it has abrasive cutters thus the "Speed" (as if a polisher and glaze in one ---> multi-purpose product.
It can "hide" marring or "eliminate" them depending on the machine.
If used with an orbital/dual-action even with a polishing pad (megs yellow pad), it will eliminate "minor" defects but much of this result is attributed from the "swirl hiding" ability of the TS oil.
However, if used by rotary with the same pad, it produces the result like using an orbital/dual-action with the same pad and DACP.
So one factor that affect #80's result is the machine used. There are a lot of overlapping setups that I've just discovered in my not-so-long period of detailing. Like:
- W8000 pad + DACP + orbital = W8000 pad + #80 + rotary
- W8000 pad + #80 + orbital = W9000 pad + #83 + rotary
- and the list goes on.
From my detailing products diary may be found:
- #80 by hand (shake well) = glazing effect only/hides swirls/no cutting
- #80 by orbital (depending on pad) = light cut/hides swirls/not totally eliminate swirls/swirls re-appear when the oils evaporate
- #80 by rotary (depending on pad) = medium cut for not so deep swirls/eliminates totally/swirls doesn't re-appear even if oils were no longer apparent.
All the notes in my detailing diary was done on a scrap hood panel which I guess have been with me for as long as I've started detailing. It's my beloved test panel.
DISCLAIMER: You're results may vary. You know what I mean.
Hmm, interesting, now i remember the shop that painted my spoiler told me not to wax for only 2 weeks. Guess they didn't use Spies Hecker.
But #80 is pretty aggressive for just polishing for protection--could you use something like VM instead or would that interfere with the curing?
Accumulator
Well-known member
You *do* have to be careful using #80 on really fresh repaints; it can be too aggressive for some of them and require follow u with milder products.
gearhead & Ben54- the VM *would* interfere with the curing. Use a fresh-paint-safe glaze like Mothers, 3m IHG, or Meg's #3/#5 (my fave)/#7/#81. Regardless of the paint, I'd wait a lot longer than 2 weeks. Example: the RM paint they used on the Volvo was too soft for #80 after longer than that, but was OK after a couple of months.
ScottWax- My S-H repaints were pretty hard after a few days, but I too think the #80 will be overkill abrasion-wise. I'd just glaze it until it's cured and *then* hit it with the #80. #5 is about as idiot-proof a product as I've ever used, easy as *anything* can be. Using a Cylco/PC it almost applies/removes itself. If you get a bottle and don't like it I'll take it off your hands
I need to get some more anyhow since I gave mine away with the Volvo and will need some if I ever find a painter for my Caprice.
Tripper_11- that was a good post about #80 :xyxthumbs I find it sorta gums up on me when I use it with a rotary, so I turn to other products for that (there's that "YMMV" bit, huh?). But yeah, it's the whole combination (product/machine/pad) that matters and you covered it very well :xyxthumbs
gearhead & Ben54- the VM *would* interfere with the curing. Use a fresh-paint-safe glaze like Mothers, 3m IHG, or Meg's #3/#5 (my fave)/#7/#81. Regardless of the paint, I'd wait a lot longer than 2 weeks. Example: the RM paint they used on the Volvo was too soft for #80 after longer than that, but was OK after a couple of months.
ScottWax- My S-H repaints were pretty hard after a few days, but I too think the #80 will be overkill abrasion-wise. I'd just glaze it until it's cured and *then* hit it with the #80. #5 is about as idiot-proof a product as I've ever used, easy as *anything* can be. Using a Cylco/PC it almost applies/removes itself. If you get a bottle and don't like it I'll take it off your hands
I need to get some more anyhow since I gave mine away with the Volvo and will need some if I ever find a painter for my Caprice.Tripper_11- that was a good post about #80 :xyxthumbs I find it sorta gums up on me when I use it with a rotary, so I turn to other products for that (there's that "YMMV" bit, huh?). But yeah, it's the whole combination (product/machine/pad) that matters and you covered it very well :xyxthumbs
Accumulator
Well-known member
Scottwax said:
Think the protection from the #80 was better than that from the #81? I would've sorta expected the protective ingredients in #80 to be similar to those in #81 (but it's just a guess). If you're happy with #81, there's sure no reason to try the #5. #5 lasts through one of my "extreme" washes, but a regular one would probably strip it all off.
As for using DACP/SFP on the Accord, just goes to show how different paints are, well, different
I was using a 2.5K block and 3M RC on my S-H repaint right away...it just depends.I used DACP/SFP because there were some minor rotary swirls after the wetsanding, cut and buff at the shop. The paint was absolutely flat, no need for further wetsanding. I know when he buffs he uses a cutting compound with wool, swirl remover with a foam pad and 3Ms IHG with a foam waffle pad. He just missed a couple minor swirls in the hood.
I don't know if #81 has any real protective ability beyond the layer of oils it leaves behind. Seemed to be adequate though. :nixweiss
I don't know if #81 has any real protective ability beyond the layer of oils it leaves behind. Seemed to be adequate though. :nixweiss
Accumulator
Well-known member
Scottwax said:
Heh heh, if he's leave off the IHG he probably wouldn't miss any swirls
Next time I have painting done I might tell 'em to do a final polish with Menzerna FP or something similar so we all see just what it really looks like.
Barry Theal
New member
about ten years ago when i got into the business the guy who taught me said one thing that always stuck with me! no matter how you do it or how your taught! make this skill your own. then he said, " remember its not the wax it whats underneath it that counts" which for years i truly never really thought to much about it, but as more exsperiance came to me. i now understand him. in my mind its okay to use if polish with fillers, but make sure your compounding is perfect. for me my first 2 steps are all compounding with no fillers all body shop safe compounds. then ill wipe it down with rubbing alcohal. then i ll rinse all dust off the car with water. at this point the paint is clean. and i can see how true my results are. so now if there are any wheel marks in the paint now is the time to correct it, but after ten yeas and many cars later i got it down so truth fully if im gonna jewel a car with fillers it really wouldn't matter. the only thing it should affect is how my wax bonds to the paint. this is just from my personal exsperiance take what you want and leave the rest!