Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

[acuRAS82]

I was looking through my notes spreadsheet and I did label this one as standalone product, rather than most other SiO2 sprays where I can find evidence of topper (typically “as a topper on your favorite coating or use standalone!”).

 

[roscopervis]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

Sorry its a two part rant but written with Crystal Sealant in mind.

It`s not a topper, so it`s in a very unique bracket of heavier duty products like Cancoat and TAC Moonlight, which require paint prep, degreasing and if you get it wrong a machine to buff off high-spots. Thus rules out detailing novices from using the product.

Any enthusiast I know can`t keep their hands off their car and will know enough to want a really good performing product. If they want something long lasting they`ll go to the bother of applying a coating or lite coating which is as easy if not easier to apply, then use a dedicated Sio2 topper to keep it performing at it`s best? I encouraged a friend to try it on his car and he`s been massively underwhelmed. It`s still there but it`s just `fine` and the least slick part of his car. People get carried away with durability I feel, why go to all that bother for mediocrity, durability is only useful where you really want to enjoy something month after month!

Of all the people I `follow` on detailing forums, I would say you have quite a distinct set of demands from your protection products, the qualities of which I don`t particularly understand either. This isn`t a sleight in any way. I appreciate your comments and reviews, though it clearly shows that different people look for different things in products, and a difference of opinion in what ease of use actually is may come into it.

The original Crystal Sealant says it could be applied over or under a wax (Wowo`s products at least). Common sense would dictate that the best results would come on a well prepared surface, but it isn`t sold as a coating lite, but as a durable sealant that, for the performance, is easy to use. Wipe on a section, and immediately wipe off, then final buff with a dry cloth. I paid £12.99 for 500ml and for the performance I`ve had out of it, I cannot fault it.

I`d much rather a product like that than Polish Angel stuff that promises fantastical claims of durability and which includes ingredients that sound impressive, but which offer very dubious benefits in anything other than the very short term and cost, well, a lot.

Slickness is over rated for me, I`d much rather something that holds up and is versatile whilst allowing the initial gloss to be protected as much as possible.

 

[atbalfour]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

Of all the people I `follow` on detailing forums, I would say you have quite a distinct set of demands from your protection products, the qualities of which I don`t particularly understand either. This isn`t a sleight in any way. I appreciate your comments and reviews, though it clearly shows that different people look for different things in products, and a difference of opinion in what ease of use actually is may come into it.

The original Crystal Sealant says it could be applied over or under a wax (Wowo`s products at least). Common sense would dictate that the best results would come on a well prepared surface, but it isn`t sold as a coating lite, but as a durable sealant that, for the performance, is easy to use. Wipe on a section, and immediately wipe off, then final buff with a dry cloth. I paid £12.99 for 500ml and for the performance I`ve had out of it, I cannot fault it.

I`d much rather a product like that than Polish Angel stuff that promises fantastical claims of durability and which includes ingredients that sound impressive, but which offer very dubious benefits in anything other than the very short term and cost, well, a lot.

Slickness is over rated for me, I`d much rather something that holds up and is versatile whilst allowing the initial gloss to be protected as much as possible.

I can`t disagree that they are distinct - I want my LSP to do everything yet be compatible with my coating.. that`s a lot to ask and the cost is high.

The reality is that in the dozens of well regarded products I`ve tried Polish Angel comes closest - if they were a bit more resistant to alkaline cleaners (I don`t do huge miles so this is my LSP killer ... not traffic film, pollen, salt) I`d buy 5 gallons of the stuff and be done.

I used TAC Shinee Wax tonight for the first time, universally liked... `super easy to use` according to many independent Youtubers. I hated using it, i found it to be smeary and grabby until the film was removed. I`d imagine it`d be a nightmare to use in heat or as a drying aid. Gave my dad some to try and he said he`s never used something so easy. The reality is that Cosmic and High Gloss spoil me, one towel gets you around the car, wet, dry, direct sunlight - no energy, no fuss and very satisfying to see it melt into the paint.

I couldn`t sleep at night being duped out of that amount of money, so I take some confidence that the gloss meter backs up my own perception that these products really can perform at the top end with very few able to match them. How much the human eye can discern isn`t important to me - knowing that it`d be hard to beat is sufficient as crazy as that sounds when reading it back. The reality is, I love detailing and I do a fair few cars a year because I enjoy the transformation and it funds my own obsession of squeezing the very last bit out of my car`s paint, and I know there are plenty of others the same on here... a few PA fans too lol.

I probably am not the best person to give a view on Crystal Sealant - anything long lasting that goes on my own paint needs to leave thickness and add hardness and top-able with something very very hydrophobic. CS as an underlying product doesn`t do that - do many enthusiasts really leave cars for 6 months plus without topping?

Until my friend`s experience I was looking into using it on the cars I detail - I believe there to be easier to use products out there that leave a nicer feeling more hydrophobic surface. My only point in bringing it up was a genuine question of why you wouldn`t go lite-ceramic instead for as much if not less effort..?

Anyway... back to coatings

 

[roscopervis]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

My only point in bringing it up was a genuine question of why you wouldn`t go lite-ceramic instead for as much if not less effort..?
Anyway... back to coatings

Simply - cost! Full price for 500ml (16oz) is £18.99. I just picked up some v3 for £12.73 with their sale. Compare this to Cancoat - 200ml is £33. Also, it is much more fussy about curing. Gyeon says Cancoat will retain most of its hydrophobic and self cleaning properties for 9000 miles if looked after. I think that is not too dissimilar to CS, albeit having its own level.

TAC Systems Moonlight - £35 for 250 ml and similar performance to Cancoat.

CQuartz Lite (my choice) - £42 for 150ml - probably 50% more durability performance than Cancoat.

Master the knack of CS and you get a lot of applications out of the 500ml. It of course can be maintained with many products that may boost hydrophobics if you want, as can the others. It is proving to be resistant to Fse too, unlike BSD/PNS and TW SnS and potentially many ceramic products. It can also be applied through a foam cannon, 50ml to 450ml water. Versatile.

 

[Desertnate]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

CQuartz Lite (my choice) - £42 for 150ml - probably 50% more durability performance than Cancoat.

Is this reference to performance based on actual observation or product claims? I`ve had CanCoat on my car for 10 months and it will easily last a year or longer. I figured CQuartz Lite was similar in durability.

 

[Coleroad]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

Is this reference to performance based on actual observation or product claims? I`ve had CanCoat on my car for 10 months and it will easily last a year or longer. I figured CQuartz Lite was similar in durability.

definitely matters where you are. Here where i am in Colorado. Everthing seems to have a much shorter life. I`ve lived in Michigan, ohio, Kansas, Houston, San Antonio, elPaso, and Colorado has been the hardest on lsp`s. I mentioned the Texas cities because each one of those is like being in a different state. I tried cancoat here and got about four months.

 

[Coatings=crack]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

I can`t disagree that they are distinct - I want my LSP to do everything yet be compatible with my coating.. that`s a lot to ask and the cost is high.

The reality is that in the dozens of well regarded products I`ve tried Polish Angel comes closest - if they were a bit more resistant to alkaline cleaners (I don`t do huge miles so this is my LSP killer ... not traffic film, pollen, salt) I`d buy 5 gallons of the stuff and be done.

I used TAC Shinee Wax tonight for the first time, universally liked... `super easy to use` according to many independent Youtubers. I hated using it, i found it to be smeary and grabby until the film was removed. I`d imagine it`d be a nightmare to use in heat or as a drying aid. Gave my dad some to try and he said he`s never used something so easy. The reality is that Cosmic and High Gloss spoil me, one towel gets you around the car, wet, dry, direct sunlight - no energy, no fuss and very satisfying to see it melt into the paint.

I couldn`t sleep at night being duped out of that amount of money, so I take some confidence that the gloss meter backs up my own perception that these products really can perform at the top end with very few able to match them. How much the human eye can discern isn`t important to me - knowing that it`d be hard to beat is sufficient as crazy as that sounds when reading it back. The reality is, I love detailing and I do a fair few cars a year because I enjoy the transformation and it funds my own obsession of squeezing the very last bit out of my car`s paint, and I know there are plenty of others the same on here... a few PA fans too lol.

I probably am not the best person to give a view on Crystal Sealant - anything long lasting that goes on my own paint needs to leave thickness and add hardness and top-able with something very very hydrophobic. CS as an underlying product doesn`t do that - do many enthusiasts really leave cars for 6 months plus without topping?

Until my friend`s experience I was looking into using it on the cars I detail - I believe there to be easier to use products out there that leave a nicer feeling more hydrophobic surface. My only point in bringing it up was a genuine question of why you wouldn`t go lite-ceramic instead for as much if not less effort..?

Anyway... back to coatings

Have you tried Kamikaze Overcoat?


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[roscopervis]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

Is this reference to performance based on actual observation or product claims? I`ve had CanCoat on my car for 10 months and it will easily last a year or longer. I figured CQuartz Lite was similar in durability.

Based on a couple of things really. First, CQuartz Lite has much more solids in its mix than Cancoat - 45% to 25% so CQuartz Lite is much more like a coating.

Secondly, I watch a lot of YouTube (insomnia is a pain) and I have seen a few videos testing them both side by side. It is clear that CQuartz Lite is much more heavy duty and more durable than Cancoat.

Those are a good couple of examples.

 

[atbalfour]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

Based on a couple of things really. First, CQuartz Lite has much more solids in its mix than Cancoat - 45% to 25% so CQuartz Lite is much more like a coating.

Secondly, I watch a lot of YouTube (insomnia is a pain) and I have seen a few videos testing them both side by side. It is clear that CQuartz Lite is much more heavy duty and more durable than Cancoat.

Those are a good couple of examples.

Nit picking but Jon used an out of date bottle of Cancoat and Moonlight and Sandro didn`t seem to know to allow the recommended 7 days before hitting with detergents (he`s using a concentrated iron remover after 72 hours lol).

Wouldn`t be convinced CQuartz Lite is worth the extra, considering it`s not as slick, not as hydrophobic and Cancoat goes a lot further (for me 8 cars, 2 coats each)? I`ve just polished Cancoat off my wife`s car, 7 months and performing as new hit with BH Auto Foam every week and Power Maxed TFR as a pre-pre wash in winter. That is exceptional performance, can`t comment on Lite but look forward to trying it as a base layer in the future.

 

[atbalfour]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

Have you tried Kamikaze Overcoat?


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I have - they are neck and neck, Overcoat probably edges it overall.

Water behaviour is different (micro beads vs extreme contact angle), Overcoat is a little more durable with better filling capability. I`ve recently seen it applied to a scuffed up test panel and the results are astonishing for pure filling ability. Interestingly Car Pro Lite and Crystal Sealant also fared well on the same panel.

For me, the trade off is that you get double the amount of Cosmic for 100ml of Overcoat and it`s much nicer to use. Whether it`s just me I don`t know, but for products with similar chemical components they give completely distinct looks to paintwork. Pure reflective glass vs. Cosmic accentuating metallics and giving a glow you`d normally associate with wax based products.

Always keep both - KK Overcoat for winter, PA Cosmic for summer.

 

[The Guz]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

Is this reference to performance based on actual observation or product claims? I`ve had CanCoat on my car for 10 months and it will easily last a year or longer. I figured CQuartz Lite was similar in durability.

CQ Lite is definitely more durable. I can see it side by side that it is. Lite has a 1.5 year claim. That is a little inside tidbit. Does not feel as thick/heavy as Cquartz UK.

Nit picking but Jon used an out of date bottle of Cancoat and Moonlight and Sandro didn`t seem to know to allow the recommended 7 days before hitting with detergents (he`s using a concentrated iron remover after 72 hours lol).

Wouldn`t be convinced CQuartz Lite is worth the extra, considering it`s not as slick, not as hydrophobic and Cancoat goes a lot further (for me 8 cars, 2 coats each)? I`ve just polished Cancoat off my wife`s car, 7 months and performing as new hit with BH Auto Foam every week and Power Maxed TFR as a pre-pre wash in winter. That is exceptional performance, can`t comment on Lite but look forward to trying it as a base layer in the future.

Unless you try it you won`t know. Cquartz Lite is actually more hydrophobic. It has a contact angle of 110 degrees where as CanCoat is 100 degrees. Cquartz lite is based on the CQUK 3.0 formula and it does on thicker than CanCoat. I have a friend who is a pro detailer and he gets about 8 cars with Lite. Slickness is overrated when it comes to coatings. As long as it does the job it is not a deal breaker. Look at the success Sonax has with CC36, PNS and BSD that have no slickness to it.

 

[Coatings=crack]

CQ Lite is definitely more durable. I can see it side by side that it is. Lite has a 1.5 year claim. That is a little inside tidbit. Does not feel as thick/heavy as Cquartz UK.



Unless you try it you won`t know. Cquartz Lite is actually more hydrophobic. It has a contact angle of 110 degrees where as CanCoat is 100 degrees. Cquartz lite is based on the CQUK 3.0 formula and it does on thicker than CanCoat. I have a friend who is a pro detailer and he gets about 8 cars with Lite. Slickness is overrated when it comes to coatings. As long as it does the job it is not a deal breaker. Look at the success Sonax has with CC36, PNS and BSD that have no slickness to it.

Unrelated question for you Guz, I ‘ve read on Car Pros global site that CQUK3 now can be wiped on wiped off like Lite. Is this true?

If so thats a game changer.



Also what do you think looks wise between CC and CQ lite?

Lastly could you use light to top off CQUK3 at year mark?

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[atbalfour]

Re: NO REALLY...I MEAN IT THIS TIME!!! Re: Think I`m done messing around with coatings, final thoughts...

I don`t doubt what you are saying but it is interesting that both tests concluded that Cancoat beads better than CarPro Lite. My honest opinion? Gyeon understate Cancoat`s actual water repellancy to create a more noticeable visual performance gap to their heavier duty ceramic coatings.

Cancoat categorically does not have a contact angle less than Gtechniq Exo. I use it specifically to boost Exo v4 (another 110 degree product) to improve hydrophobics - i`d suggest it`s closer to 115.

 

[wannafbody]

I`m not sure contact angle is the biggest issue. I`d be more concerned about UV protection but that kinda stuff isn`t ever really revealed to the public. I know from personal experience with vinyl stripes and letters that darker colored base/clear fades over time.

 

[The Guz]

Unrelated question for you Guz, I ‘ve read on Car Pros global site that CQUK3 now can be wiped on wiped off like Lite. Is this true?

If so thats a game changer.



Also what do you think looks wise between CC and CQ lite?

Lastly could you use light to top off CQUK3 at year mark?

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It has been this way since it came out. It will still be temp and humidity dependent.

You could put a coat if you wanted to. Lite is based on the CQUK 3.0 formula.

It is pretty close but Lite darkens just a bit more. The TiO2 helps its reflective look. It almost resembles the look of the CQUK/TiO2 combo that was popular before Gliss came out. CanCoat as you know has a nice look to it.

I don`t doubt what you are saying but it is interesting that both tests concluded that Cancoat beads better than CarPro Lite. My honest opinion? Gyeon understate Cancoat`s actual water repellancy to create a more noticeable visual performance gap to their heavier duty ceramic coatings.

Cancoat categorically does not have a contact angle less than Gtechniq Exo. I use it specifically to boost Exo v4 (another 110 degree product) to improve hydrophobics - i`d suggest it`s closer to 115.

I want your calibrated eye to discern between 110 and 115 lol. If you want a noticeable difference then look into Gyeon Skin or SPS/Artdeshine graphene as they have 120 and is very noticeable.

 

[acuRAS82]

I don’t understand contact angle values or they just aren’t accurate from some companies. Why does Cancoat at 110 bead so much better than Wowo’s Contact 121?

 

[atbalfour]

I don’t understand contact angle values or they just aren’t accurate from some companies. Why does Cancoat at 110 bead so much better than Wowo’s Contact 121?

This is my point... I`m judging based on comparative performance between products and I`ve found Cancoat to outbead Exo. I`m in no way saying I`ve all the tools to measure between them. The difference is extremely clear.

Also @ the Guz I`ve heard Budget say the same about Skin but quickly faded and unavailable to buy separately from Mohs . I did see a comparison between all Gyeon coatings on a bonnet and the difference was far smaller than I expected (hence my theory about them understating Cancoat to create a bigger gap to the true money makers).

Gtechniq also tell you the water drain angle, I suspect there are other factors when it comes to beading bar contact angle which I no longer pay much attention to.

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[wannafbody]

Products that darken mute metallic flakes. You want as close to optically clear as possible for the most pop.

 

[BudgetPlan1]

Well, so much for one of my `rolling test panels`. Girl we gave this to this Summer escaped relatively unscathed but insurance said "Well, that`s about all for this one..."

Had coated this with a relatively non-descript coating someone had sent me last January to try...made it about 5200 miles until someone pulled out of a parking lot and took the front end off of the vehicle that was sitting at a stoplight.

Got a new vehicle/replacement last Friday but no time to mess with it so I just wiped it down w/ Kleen-Strip, then Eraser and used TAC Moonlight for the body, Gyeon CanCoat for the roof.

 

[JustJesus]

Glad to hear the girl is okay. Sorry about the vehicle. Bummer

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