The Unofficial *Official* Politics Thread

[rlmccarty2000]

There are no comparisons on the purpose of the border wall Trump is proposing and the Berlin wall. The latter was built to contain people and prevent them from escaping the communist rule in East Germany. Ours isn`t being proposed to keep people in our country but to prevent illegal crossing of people and contraband into our country.

Having a border is NOT a bad or evil thing. We need controlled access and should not be free to openly allowing just anyone unfettered access to our society. Controls and costs are put in place for a reason and that`s the entire purpose of having a governed society. The wall wouldn`t be necessary if people south of the border respected our system and followed the rules. Again, what happens to them when they break the rules and enter illegal is due to their actions not ours and we should not feel guilty or responsible for that. That is on them. Our policies need to cap the numbers even on those seeking asylum. at the end of the day, we are about 3rd or 4th on the list of countries whom many of these people have passed through, let the others rule on giving it to them as they too need to be held accountable.

The two year old girl in that photo was never actually separated from her family. That is completely bull-pucky and those that pull up the details of that case would know that. TIME Magazine is just putting forth more inaccurate information. That entire matter also had no connection to Trump. Most all of the photos circulating occurred under Obamafail`s administration not under the current administration. Ironically NONE Of the politicians on the left spoke up then either. Talk about hypocrisy; that`s the real hypocrisy. Also, look at the children who were separated, 70%+ come to the US Border without their parents so their "separation" occured at the hands OF THE PARENTS not our Immigration system and it`s officers. Again more facts being ignored but thankfully not by all.

We are also not the only ones who practice this policy.

These unaccompanied minors left for reasons that are varied, but I have seen children picking through huge garbage piles just looking for something to eat in Honduras. Some are escaping gang violence. Some are orphans who have no parents and they have little choice other than go to some place that might give them a future. Aren’t we supposed to help the less fortunate? Should we shoot them like dogs or provide aid where we can? Choices.

The Berlin Wall served two purposes, to keep people in and ideas out. The wall seperated families. When it came down it was good for both sides. The West Germans needed the manpower and the East Germans needed jobs. Look around and see what jobs illegal immigrants are taking. They are far and away the jobs no American will take. Most pay taxes but reap no benefit from those taxes. Migrant workers serve a purpose and it benefits you and me by keeping agricultural products affordable. Building a wall will not even slow the drug trade down. As long as there is a demand there will be a supply from some where.

The Time photo was there to show the two sides. The mighty American government vs. the powerless immigrant. It really had nothing to do with Trump the man, but more on the heartless policies of our nation towards immigrants. Trump is the face of America.

 

[pdqgp]

Why does he want to alienate most of our allies? Isolationist policies are not going to work, this is a global economy. You can`t treat other countries leaders as contestants on a reality show. Have some restraint and respect and the same will be returned.

Time for our Allies and trade partners to work with us to insure we don`t get stuck with trade deficits. Pretty damn clear that their answer to trying to level playing fields on product is to strike back with even HIGHER tariffs of their own vs lowering the current ones so that again, trade is fair. Allies yes, but they are NOT looking to be fair partners.

These unaccompanied minors left for reasons that are varied, but I have seen children picking through huge garbage piles just looking for something to eat in Honduras. Some are escaping gang violence. Some are orphans who have no parents and they have little choice other than go to some place that might give them a future. Aren’t we supposed to help the less fortunate? Should we shoot them like dogs or provide aid where we can? Choices.

There needs to be control and balance. We can help but so can the other countries they pass through. Trump is the President of the United States and his job is first to look out and be fair to OUR People. We can`t be the crazy cat-lady taking in every stray. There will always be those in need and less fortunate. Taking them in has a cost and taking them in properly helps balance that cost.

The Berlin Wall served two purposes, to keep people in and ideas out. The wall separated families. When it came down it was good for both sides.

Agree, but more than anything it was purposely built to keep people in. There`s still no correlation to the wall Trump is calling to have built. Texas has over 30 locations for legal entrance and the process to begin. The families being separated did NOT go through those entrances and chose to go the Illegal Alien route. That`s on them. Go through the proper steps and channels and that separation would not have occurred.

Look around and see what jobs illegal immigrants are taking. They are far and away the jobs no American will take. Most pay taxes but reap no benefit from those taxes. Migrant workers serve a purpose and it benefits you and me by keeping agricultural products affordable. Building a wall will not even slow the drug trade down. As long as there is a demand there will be a supply from some where.

Still does not make ILLEGAL Crossing any better. We need to shut-down the illegal crossings and stop wasting resources and time "processing" thousands. Time to shore-it up period.

The Time photo was there to show the two sides. The mighty American government vs. the powerless immigrant. It really had nothing to do with Trump the man, but more on the heartless policies of our nation towards immigrants. Trump is the face of America.

Complete media BS is what it is and many of us see it. Wins them no respect and actually hurts their cause. There`s no "mighty US" vs Immigrants. That war is in media. Flat-out there`s a process to enter our country; either do it correctly or be labeled ILLEGAL. Again, nothing is happening TO THEM it`s their choice to disrespect our laws and they bringing the repercussions upon themselves. They are not VICTIMS of the US of A and our laws, so let`s stop beating that dead donkey. We are FAR FAR FAR from heartless towards immigrants. NO OTHER country on earth goes so far as we do, so there too, please stop speaking that BS. Trump is our President not that of the world. We can`t afford as citizens to take in all those in need. Resources need to better be directed at demanding the other countries be better.

 

[2quikta]

These unaccompanied minors left for reasons that are varied, but I have seen children picking through huge garbage piles just looking for something to eat in Honduras. Some are escaping gang violence. Some are orphans who have no parents and they have little choice other than go to some place that might give them a future. Aren’t we supposed to help the less fortunate? Should we shoot them like dogs or provide aid where we can? Choices.

how about we worry more about the less fortunate in our own country before spending time and resources helping those entering illegally

 

[Stokdgs]

Aren`t we supposed to help the less fortunate in America also ???

Where do you get this "shoot them like dogs" ??? That, my friend, is a sad thing to say...

America has always provided aid to other countries..

I remember reading about the Secretary of Agriculture, Ezra Taft Benson, organizing huge amounts of railroad cars full of clothing, etc., for the people who survived the war with nazi germany, sending many of those cars directly to Germany...

Many Churches including mine, have worked for decades with other relief efforts like the Catholic Relief Fund, etc., to continually send help to those who had emergencies throughout the world..
America has always been there first, always had the biggest heart...

Don`t agree for a second that this is the mighty american government vs the powerless immigrant..
It is in all reality, the immigrant that is caught entering into America illegally, that puts himself in a bind..

Heartless policies ?? Really? then why has not ANYONE on the left, once, talked about these very heartless policies Congress passed a long time ago, and the enforcing of these policies by the last few presidents of this country???

So it was ok then to enforce them, and pictures taken in 2014 (who was President then???), show pretty harsh conditions for people who were caught, again, entering this country - illegally - and separated from each other at much higher numbers than now, and why was there no, none, nada, uproar from the left/liberals/etc., back then????

This has Everything to do with the President.... This hateful tirade has been unrelenting since he was elected...

The photoshopped Time magazine photo -- wow - how inaccurate a picture can you make - shame on those who did that... Did Time publish a disclaimer saying that this picture never really happened and instead it was a photoshop of 2 separate pictures??

They interviewed on film, the photographer who actually took that picture of the little girl, and he said on camera something like " well, I couldn`t be sure that she was separated from her Mother when I took that picture"...

You talk about the wall in Germany because you were there.. Glad you could be there, serving our Country, and had first hand knowledge of that supreme moment when it came down.. Thank you..

Again, the wall around the southern border is not there for the same reason as the Berlin wall, no matter how you spin it...

Perhaps you need to talk to the good people of Texas and Arizona who live close to that border and let them tell you the way they feel about total strangers, trespassing across their fenced land for decades, and all the things that have happened to them and things they have had to do because of these immigrants illegally trespassing across their land constantly..

There is no way to stop, or at least slow this illegal border crossing down except by a wall.. Can you tell us the best solution that will work instead of a wall ??

Why is the left not demanding the leaders of these countries do something to create jobs for their very own people so they don`t have to leave ???

Does it not bother you that these people get in illegally, then go straight to welfare and food stamps places, social security, get emergency money, get housing, and then maybe some but certainly not all, perhaps not even half of them will actually pursue a job????

That a lot of illegals, many that were caught and deported back many times already, have already separated forever, American children from American Families through their tragic, bad behavior with vehicles, guns, gang violence, etc., for starters??? What about that separation of American children from their families ?? I hear no left wing people screaming about them, why is that???

Perhaps you are well enough off that you will not have to worry about having enough $$$ to see you through the end of your life, and then enough left to see your family to the end of theirs, and then still whatever is left to go to your children... Good for you if this is the case...

I am not one of those lucky ones, and I have worked hard since I was 10 and still have that really old SSI card I applied for when I was old enough to do so.. I was in middle school when I got it and all those little jobs that I paid SSI into are faithfully recorded in that statement...

How about you do what I did when I changed addresses after the marriage imploded in 2012 - I went to the SSI office in Bellevue WA one morning.
It had been open 1 hour before I got there..

There were nothing but really nice, new, mostly black, shiny, Lexus, Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Porsche, Escalade, vehicles in the parking lot.. The rest were new and newer cars, all very nice, all much newer than my lowly 2009 Grand Cherokee..

Went inside and was instantly amazed that everyone in that big waiting room was dressed in middle eastern garb, or very nice clothes, sweaters, shoes, etc...
The languages I heard being spoken were not english... No one was speaking english..

I sat down in a chair among these people and looked at all of them one at a time..
I tried to make eye contact with any of them..
They would not make eye contact with me - none of them..

No one wanted to say something simple and human, like "good morning"..
Why do you think they were like that???

Did they possibly think that they knew they were there stealing the very dollars that you, me, and almost everyone on this Forum, have laboriously put in to that Social Security system all our lives????
Yes they were and they really didn`t care...

This Social Security office looked to me like any other Welfare - give me free money and food stamps office.... I have been in a couple of Welfare offices only because I knew people who worked there that were members of my Church..

If you really believe President Trump IS the face of America, and you appear to dislike him, then why are you still here? If you dislike him so much and all the things he has accomplished, so far, for the GOOD of this Nation, why are you still here??

I want to be associated with anyone that is honest, hard working, approachable, has incredible vision and leadership, can work circles around most others, and perhaps even believes in God.. And knows that God inspired all those common farmers, merchants, bakers, bankers, lawyers, store owners, etc., to put onto paper the most perfect sets of laws, etc., that actually made this Blessed country a Nation....

It is on their very shoulders we are all so Blessed to stand on, it was their hard work, in face of much more peril to the loss of their very lives, that we should celebrate and offer much gratitude to, and remember in our daily prayers; it is their own extreme sacrifices that they personally experienced walking across this Nation, even leaving their children behind in unmarked graves, that we should be so thankful for and remember always..

And as imperfect as ALL of us are, this person, "the Face of America", and the American people, are all at least striving to get better, to do better, to look out for each other and for all mankind/womankind....
I am happy to add my face to any who represent the real Face of America...
Dan F

 

[Bunky]

Lol!!

 

[jrock645]

Another fun weekend in Chicago! When will the people there wake up and stop electing the same people that got them into this mess?

 

[rlmccarty2000]

Aren`t we supposed to help the less fortunate in America also ???

Where do you get this "shoot them like dogs" ??? That, my friend, is a sad thing to say...

America has always provided aid to other countries..

I remember reading about the Secretary of Agriculture, Ezra Taft Benson, organizing huge amounts of railroad cars full of clothing, etc., for the people who survived the war with nazi germany, sending many of those cars directly to Germany...

Many Churches including mine, have worked for decades with other relief efforts like the Catholic Relief Fund, etc., to continually send help to those who had emergencies throughout the world..
America has always been there first, always had the biggest heart...

Don`t agree for a second that this is the mighty american government vs the powerless immigrant..
It is in all reality, the immigrant that is caught entering into America illegally, that puts himself in a bind..

Heartless policies ?? Really? then why has not ANYONE on the left, once, talked about these very heartless policies Congress passed a long time ago, and the enforcing of these policies by the last few presidents of this country???

So it was ok then to enforce them, and pictures taken in 2014 (who was President then???), show pretty harsh conditions for people who were caught, again, entering this country - illegally - and separated from each other at much higher numbers than now, and why was there no, none, nada, uproar from the left/liberals/etc., back then????

This has Everything to do with the President.... This hateful tirade has been unrelenting since he was elected...

The photoshopped Time magazine photo -- wow - how inaccurate a picture can you make - shame on those who did that... Did Time publish a disclaimer saying that this picture never really happened and instead it was a photoshop of 2 separate pictures??

They interviewed on film, the photographer who actually took that picture of the little girl, and he said on camera something like " well, I couldn`t be sure that she was separated from her Mother when I took that picture"...

You talk about the wall in Germany because you were there.. Glad you could be there, serving our Country, and had first hand knowledge of that supreme moment when it came down.. Thank you..

Again, the wall around the southern border is not there for the same reason as the Berlin wall, no matter how you spin it...

Perhaps you need to talk to the good people of Texas and Arizona who live close to that border and let them tell you the way they feel about total strangers, trespassing across their fenced land for decades, and all the things that have happened to them and things they have had to do because of these immigrants illegally trespassing across their land constantly..

There is no way to stop, or at least slow this illegal border crossing down except by a wall.. Can you tell us the best solution that will work instead of a wall ??

Why is the left not demanding the leaders of these countries do something to create jobs for their very own people so they don`t have to leave ???

Does it not bother you that these people get in illegally, then go straight to welfare and food stamps places, social security, get emergency money, get housing, and then maybe some but certainly not all, perhaps not even half of them will actually pursue a job????

That a lot of illegals, many that were caught and deported back many times already, have already separated forever, American children from American Families through their tragic, bad behavior with vehicles, guns, gang violence, etc., for starters??? What about that separation of American children from their families ?? I hear no left wing people screaming about them, why is that???

Perhaps you are well enough off that you will not have to worry about having enough $$$ to see you through the end of your life, and then enough left to see your family to the end of theirs, and then still whatever is left to go to your children... Good for you if this is the case...

I am not one of those lucky ones, and I have worked hard since I was 10 and still have that really old SSI card I applied for when I was old enough to do so.. I was in middle school when I got it and all those little jobs that I paid SSI into are faithfully recorded in that statement...

How about you do what I did when I changed addresses after the marriage imploded in 2012 - I went to the SSI office in Bellevue WA one morning.
It had been open 1 hour before I got there..

There were nothing but really nice, new, mostly black, shiny, Lexus, Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Porsche, Escalade, vehicles in the parking lot.. The rest were new and newer cars, all very nice, all much newer than my lowly 2009 Grand Cherokee..

Went inside and was instantly amazed that everyone in that big waiting room was dressed in middle eastern garb, or very nice clothes, sweaters, shoes, etc...
The languages I heard being spoken were not english... No one was speaking english..

I sat down in a chair among these people and looked at all of them one at a time..
I tried to make eye contact with any of them..
They would not make eye contact with me - none of them..

No one wanted to say something simple and human, like "good morning"..
Why do you think they were like that???

Did they possibly think that they knew they were there stealing the very dollars that you, me, and almost everyone on this Forum, have laboriously put in to that Social Security system all our lives????
Yes they were and they really didn`t care...

This Social Security office looked to me like any other Welfare - give me free money and food stamps office.... I have been in a couple of Welfare offices only because I knew people who worked there that were members of my Church..

If you really believe President Trump IS the face of America, and you appear to dislike him, then why are you still here? If you dislike him so much and all the things he has accomplished, so far, for the GOOD of this Nation, why are you still here??

I want to be associated with anyone that is honest, hard working, approachable, has incredible vision and leadership, can work circles around most others, and perhaps even believes in God.. And knows that God inspired all those common farmers, merchants, bakers, bankers, lawyers, store owners, etc., to put onto paper the most perfect sets of laws, etc., that actually made this Blessed country a Nation....

It is on their very shoulders we are all so Blessed to stand on, it was their hard work, in face of much more peril to the loss of their very lives, that we should celebrate and offer much gratitude to, and remember in our daily prayers; it is their own extreme sacrifices that they personally experienced walking across this Nation, even leaving their children behind in unmarked graves, that we should be so thankful for and remember always..

And as imperfect as ALL of us are, this person, "the Face of America", and the American people, are all at least striving to get better, to do better, to look out for each other and for all mankind/womankind....
I am happy to add my face to any who represent the real Face of America...
Dan F

Dan you make a lot of good points and as much as I would like to address them all I just don’t think my mind is working that well lately. I wish we could sit down over a beer and have a good old fashioned discussion. I don’t know if either one of us would change their opinion but we could at least get to know each other a little better. I will try to hit some of the high points.

1. I did leave the US with intentions of never returning, but my Mother got sick and I came back to take care of her. I loved living in Honduras. I loved the scenery, the beaches and the mountains, and the people were warm, friendly and accepting. The cost of living was very low. I lived very well on the small amount of money I took with me. I married a Honduran woman who just recently became a US citizen at my urging. She is a supervisor at the local Post Foods plant and makes more money than I did when I was in the Army and she didn’t even graduate from high school. The other supervisors are always getting fired, mainly for drugs. If they instituted a mandatory urinalysis the place would shut down. Post is the only employer in town that does not hire illegal workers. Illegal workers get paid less, get no benefits even though they pay into social security and can’t file a tax return. Unlike a lot of American who are happy to sit and accept a check EVERY illegal I know wants to work and will take the toughest job available, which is farm work. Try loading watermelons from sun up to sundown.

2. The Wall. It’s just too easily defeatable, ladders, tunnels, dynamite, etc. Also is screws with our fragile environment by blocking endangered animals from crossing borders to breed. The initial cost is unbelievably high and of course it will have to be maintained. I don’t believe for a minute that Mexico will (or should) pay for it.

3. American is the shining light of democracy and people want to come here for a better life. My people are Irish and came here for the same reasons so it’s hard for me to say “go back and make your country better”. What would have happened if that was done to the Irish. There was no food to go back to. The Irish were treated worse than the blacks and the Chinese. Immigrants should have some sympathy for immigrants. Pay it forward.

4. Illegal immigration has slowed without building a wall. NAFTA made it profitable for companies to build things in Mexico thus slowing the economic reasons for immigration.

5.. The US has supported some pretty bad governments in Central America. Puppet presidents in El Salvador backed by the CIA have made it one of the most dangerous countries in the world. I’ve been there. You don’t go out after dark, not for fear of gangs but for fear the police will lock you up never to be seen again. We trained their Death Squads at FT Benning, GA. I was going through officer candidate school in the 80’s and asked what was going on. Our policies are directly responsible for terrorizing the population of El Salvador. Iran-Contra War we supported Nicaragua with weapons, money, and training destabilizing that area. There are STILL ongoing missions to remove active land mines in Nicaragua and Honduras. I supported Special Forces operations in that area. Children are still being maimed bu US land mines.

6. The people in the Social Security Office did not look at you or talk to you because they are afraid of you. They don’t know who to trust. It happens to me all the time with my wife’s friends. I asked the same question. How would you feel if you lived somewhere and lived in fear your whole life?

7. I can only speak for my neck of the woods, but the immigrants around here are driving the worst pieces of junk they can keep running. Luckily they will work on their own vehicles (and sometimes mine). No BMWs, Mercs, or Audi’s around here.

8. The Berlin Wall was put up to separate people. Trumps wall will separate people. Why are we not building a wall in Canada? Canadians are taking jobs from US workers in all kind of fields. Could it be because they are predominantly white and they are more acceptable? I don’t have the immigration figures from Canada, but I imagine it’s easier to get a Green Card in Canada to come work in the US so they don’t have to come here illegally. Trump has said he wants more immigrants from predominantly white countries. We need immigrants, just not brown or black ones.

9. While I was in Honduras I would continually run into church groups coming to “help” the Hondurans. It was disgusting. Most used it as a vacation. They stayed in the best hotels, hit the beaches, and ran with the local hookers. They would bring toys for the children that were starving to death. I mean containers full of toys. The parents sold the toys for food as soon as the Christians left (I use Christians loosely). I would tell these groups that the people needed food, clothes, and medicine. The clothes that were sent were from drives where people would donate their old clothes. You dont need coats, suits, ties, long sleeve shirts (you get the idea) in a tropical climate. The clothes would be molded and mildued in a matter of days. I gave up trying to assist any Christian endeavor due to pure stupidity. Please stop sending bibles in English to Spanish speakers. I did work with Doctors Without Borders and Doctors without Frontiers and found some very dedicated people. I asked them why they weren’t in Appliachia helping out Americans, malpractice suits was the number one answer.

10. Did you know we use tax dollars to build schools and roads in Central America? Yep. Build roads to nowhere and schools where there are no children. The schools are torn apart as soon as the Engineers leave. Why can’t US Army Engineers build schools and roads in the US? It’s against the law. Unfair competition or some BS voted on by Congress. This subject I could talk about for days.

I probably missed something. I have avoided this thread for awhile as it brings up some bad memories of my time in the military. Everyone has different views based on their own life experiences. I do agree our immigration policies need to change. Illegal is illegal and I have no problem enforcing laws but let them make sense. I still don’t understand the Cuban thing where we take them in just to mess with dead Castro. Change that law. I think Obama tried. I’ve always heard that things get worse before they get better....

 

[rlmccarty2000]

I’ve stayed away from this political thread for a few weeks, but I just have to ask a simple question in light of all the new convictions of Trump’s closest advisors. Would Americans still have elected Trump if they knew of his affairs with hookers and then paying them off to hide the facts? Even having said hookers sign non disclosure agreements to keep them quiet. Just on these facts alone should we have our nations security in the hands of person of such low(no) moral standards? It should disgust and shame us as a nation. No wonder his wife doesn’t want to have anything to do with him. Any other woman would have him in divorce court before he could take his next breath.

 

[rlmccarty2000]

This is kind of a follow up to my last post in August but something defining happened today. Trump’s lawyer/Fixer got 36 months jail time and made this statement: “Recently the president tweeted a statement calling me weak and it was correct, but for a much different reason than he was implying. It was because time and time again I felt it was my duty to cover up his dirty deeds,” I don’t feel a comment on this statement is necessary, but I will say Trump should take some responsibility for his part in getting someone sent to jail. The Presidential pardon thing will probably be on the table, but it should not. A person should not be above the law.

 

[rlmccarty2000]

I have disagreed with Trump on most of his policies, but if he follows through with pulling US troops out of Syria and Afghanistan he should get the Nobel Peace Prize and possibly another 4 years. Our defense spending has been out of control for a very long time. We don’t need to be the world’s police force. Pulling out our troops is a positive step forward, now pull them out of every country and let those countries police theirselves. Let’s spend our tax dollars on infrastructure repair, our infrastructure.

Im tired of going to the VA hospital and seeing young people without all their body parts or psychologically screwed up. I’ve got two sons in the Army now and would like them to come home whole.

I still don’t want a wall or troops on our borders.

 

[jrock645]

I have disagreed with Trump on most of his policies, but if he follows through with pulling US troops out of Syria and Afghanistan he should get the Nobel Peace Prize and possibly another 4 years. Our defense spending has been out of control for a very long time. We don’t need to be the world’s police force. Pulling out our troops is a positive step forward, now pull them out of every country and let those countries police theirselves. Let’s spend our tax dollars on infrastructure repair, our infrastructure.

Im tired of going to the VA hospital and seeing young people without all their body parts or psychologically screwed up. I’ve got two sons in the Army now and would like them to come home whole.

I still don’t want a wall or troops on our borders.

Yet every media outlet is roasting him right now. They all lament the same things you do, or have over the years, yet call this a bad decision.

They all called him out for making bad public comments about the intelligence community. The same intelligence community that royally screwed up the info to go into Iraq with.

Its amazing to me how the media can so blindly push the narrative they want regardless of facts, and even if current events actually support their overall agenda.

 

[Anthony O.]

I’ve stayed away from this political thread for a few weeks, but I just have to ask a simple question in light of all the new convictions of Trump’s closest advisors. Would Americans still have elected Trump if they knew of his affairs with hookers and then paying them off to hide the facts? Even having said hookers sign non disclosure agreements to keep them quiet. Just on these facts alone should we have our nations security in the hands of person of such low(no) moral standards? It should disgust and shame us as a nation. No wonder his wife doesn’t want to have anything to do with him. Any other woman would have him in divorce court before he could take his next breath.

I`ll play.

Speaking of Presidents and their affairs. Would you also hold Bill Clinton to the same fire? Or President Kennedy? You may want to do a study on Presidents and their extra curricular activities. As far as we know, Trump has not had any extra marital affairs while in office.

Also, do you really believe Trump is the ONLY President or presidential candidate to have someone sign a "non-disclosure"? May want to look into that one also.

Lastly, just what inside info are you privy to that suggests Melania "doesn’t want to have anything to do with him." ? Has she announced this or stated it somewhere in a book or interview? Oh, perhaps it was how the media makes a big deal out of their holding hands or odd ways of affection? I will admit that it`s a rather odd couple BUT if we judge Obama and his wife by the same standard then why did they take separate vacations, even fly in separate planes? It`s because one of them couldn`t stand the other, right?

So again, using your standard just about every President, in fact just about every darn politician has the security of our nation in their "low moral standard hands!"

Anthony

 

[Anthony O.]

I have disagreed with Trump on most of his policies, but if he follows through with pulling US troops out of Syria and Afghanistan he should get the Nobel Peace Prize and possibly another 4 years. Our defense spending has been out of control for a very long time. We don’t need to be the world’s police force. Pulling out our troops is a positive step forward, now pull them out of every country and let those countries police theirselves. Let’s spend our tax dollars on infrastructure repair, our infrastructure.

Im tired of going to the VA hospital and seeing young people without all their body parts or psychologically screwed up. I’ve got two sons in the Army now and would like them to come home whole.

I still don’t want a wall or troops on our borders.

Americans visiting our nations White House will notice it has walls, fences and fancy ropes that are there to tell people `You can`t go past this". When I got lunch today there was between me and the workers and kitchen a counter "wall/barrier". In my bank they have a big barrier plus ballistic glass between myself and the tellers. I am not to go past that. Around Six Flags Over Texas I can`t just walk in there and expect them to give me a free day plus food and drink. They got this huge barrier between the outside people and those people that have paid to be there. Since I have not paid to go into the park I should not be expected to be let it.

A wall is not "immoral" nor can it be "moral" for it has no personhood. It is not aware, has no thought process. The actions of those on either side of the wall will be judged moral or immoral, but who is right or wrong? The people seeking America do so for a better life, at least most do. Others are running from trouble or to trouble. Americans want to control who comes in, not eliminate immigration completely.

The most fundamental question to be asked in this and it`s not being asked is this: "Why are people desperate to leave their country?" It`s NOT because America has all the answers but more so because their country SUCKS! It`s corrupt in all forms from the city police to the government and then there`s the drug cartels. They would not want to leave their country if the corruption would be done away with. So all these caravans coming up here, waving their homeland flags, need to march their butts back and start a revolution and take back their country. Funny how you never see a caravan of Americans wanting to cross over into the Hondura`s or Bolivia. I wonder why that is?

Cross into North Korea. What happens? Most likely you get meet with a bullet. Is that wrong of North Korea? NO! It`s their country, it`s their border. You would be seen as an invader. If Israel did away with her wall, what would happen? Would they all get together and sing by the campfire? I would like to see that but reality says, Hamas, Iranians, Syrians, Egyptians and everyone else within 1000 miles wants them driven into the sea and forgotten as a people.

We need borders defined, Without borders, protected borders, we are just asking for trouble.

Anthony

 

[Fishroes]

I’m not into politics at all but in this day and time you do need to filter out who comes in our country
I also think the men and women running our country act like children because they can’t have their way
Last but not least, the effort some people put into digging up trash on the president and trying to make him look bad, if they put that effort into fixing some of the problems in our country, would be a step in the right direction. Putting up a wall he’s trying to protect everyone and their families. What is wrong with that.

 

[rlmccarty2000]

Americans visiting our nations White House will notice it has walls, fences and fancy ropes that are there to tell people `You can`t go past this". When I got lunch today there was between me and the workers and kitchen a counter "wall/barrier". In my bank they have a big barrier plus ballistic glass between myself and the tellers. I am not to go past that. Around Six Flags Over Texas I can`t just walk in there and expect them to give me a free day plus food and drink. They got this huge barrier between the outside people and those people that have paid to be there. Since I have not paid to go into the park I should not be expected to be let it.

A wall is not "immoral" nor can it be "moral" for it has no personhood. It is not aware, has no thought process. The actions of those on either side of the wall will be judged moral or immoral, but who is right or wrong? The people seeking America do so for a better life, at least most do. Others are running from trouble or to trouble. Americans want to control who comes in, not eliminate immigration completely.

The most fundamental question to be asked in this and it`s not being asked is this: "Why are people desperate to leave their country?" It`s NOT because America has all the answers but more so because their country SUCKS! It`s corrupt in all forms from the city police to the government and then there`s the drug cartels. They would not want to leave their country if the corruption would be done away with. So all these caravans coming up here, waving their homeland flags, need to march their butts back and start a revolution and take back their country. Funny how you never see a caravan of Americans wanting to cross over into the Hondura`s or Bolivia. I wonder why that is?

Cross into North Korea. What happens? Most likely you get meet with a bullet. Is that wrong of North Korea? NO! It`s their country, it`s their border. You would be seen as an invader. If Israel did away with her wall, what would happen? Would they all get together and sing by the campfire? I would like to see that but reality says, Hamas, Iranians, Syrians, Egyptians and everyone else within 1000 miles wants them driven into the sea and forgotten as a people.

We need borders defined, Without borders, protected borders, we are just asking for trouble.

Anthony

The Native Americans should have taken this view of the European immigrants and they would still have a country of their own. We have a Statue of Liberty and it is inscribed “Bring us you poor and tired huddled masses”. We like to bring in laborers from Mexico to pick our fruit and do our menial labor for low wages, but we don’t want them to become citizens, is that fair?

My people came from Ireland and were treated worse than blacks. We left Ireland because we were starving. People are leaving Honduras because they are starving and being persecuted by gangs. Not a whole lot of difference between thevIrish immigrants and Honduran immigrants.

I lived in Honduras for almost 10 years and there was a large group of Americans living there. We were a little better off and we drove to Honduras. At the time the population of Honduras was around 5 million, what is the population of the US? My three sons were born in Honduras and two of them are serving in the US Army. I guess you would call them invaders too even though they are protecting your way of life. We need immigrants. Just ask Trump who takes care of his hotels and golf courses, immigrants.

Why are brown people considered a threat? Why not build a wall to keep out Canadians too? Be careful, don’t let your sheet fall in front of your eyes.

Don’t let Fox News be your only source of information. Take a trip across Latin America and talk to the people. You might find they are not much different than you.

The wall,is a vanity project. It will not stop or even deter illegal immigration. The $5.7 billion only funds 250 miles out of 2000 miles of the border. Then add in maintenance for the wall. And remember the government will double or triple the budget based on cost overruns. I worked for the government so I know how it goes. Spend the money on port security where 90% of the drugs come in to the US, not on Mexicans with backpacks.

 

[Fishroes]

You have some good points rim. I’m saying let the good ones in and try to keep the bad ones out It doesn’t matter what color their skin is. My mother-in-law is German who came here 40-50 years ago. When they start coming in masses and not being filtered I think that’s not good. I try not to watch any news on tv because a lot of it is not true and they just dwell on bad things happening. Speaking of things not true, the local weather lady pissed me off yesterday. She said yesterday morning it was going to be sunny all day with a high of 42. I had to meet a friend of mine at a dealership, about 40 miles away to get some parts (discounted of course) so I drove my 16 Tundra. I didn’t know they had salted the interstates about 4 or 5 days ago for black ice. The interstate roads were white of course, no biggie, but I get halfway there and it starts sleeting and snowing and continued doing that for 2-3 hours. When I got back home truck is covered in salt. How could they not see even a slight chance of that 6 hours in advance. I wouldn’t have driven my truck if There was even a slight chance of precip. That’s the first time it has gotten salt on it. Paint is protected but not the undercarriage. Maybe I’m being a little too particular. High temperature only got to 33 also

 

[Anthony O.]

The Native Americans should have taken this view of the European immigrants and they would still have a country of their own. We have a Statue of Liberty and it is inscribed “Bring us you poor and tired huddled masses”. We like to bring in laborers from Mexico to pick our fruit and do our menial labor for low wages, but we don’t want them to become citizens, is that fair?

My people came from Ireland and were treated worse than blacks. We left Ireland because we were starving. People are leaving Honduras because they are starving and being persecuted by gangs. Not a whole lot of difference between thevIrish immigrants and Honduran immigrants.

I lived in Honduras for almost 10 years and there was a large group of Americans living there. We were a little better off and we drove to Honduras. At the time the population of Honduras was around 5 million, what is the population of the US? My three sons were born in Honduras and two of them are serving in the US Army. I guess you would call them invaders too even though they are protecting your way of life. We need immigrants. Just ask Trump who takes care of his hotels and golf courses, immigrants.

Why are brown people considered a threat? Why not build a wall to keep out Canadians too? Be careful, don’t let your sheet fall in front of your eyes.

Don’t let Fox News be your only source of information. Take a trip across Latin America and talk to the people. You might find they are not much different than you.

The wall,is a vanity project. It will not stop or even deter illegal immigration. The $5.7 billion only funds 250 miles out of 2000 miles of the border. Then add in maintenance for the wall. And remember the government will double or triple the budget based on cost overruns. I worked for the government so I know how it goes. Spend the money on port security where 90% of the drugs come in to the US, not on Mexicans with backpacks.

First, there is no way that if the Native Americans held off the early settlers that they would still, to this day, have the America`s to themselves. Also, most likely the Vikings touched ground before the settlers. In regards to the Statue of Liberty and the writing upon her, it`s a poem...it`s NOT the United States law on immigration. We have laws that allow and also disallow people to come here. Follow the law, plain and simple.

We bring in immigrants because Americans have taught their kids that they are "above" picking produce or cleaning hotels and toilets. American kids are just too damn lazy and feel they are above jobs like that, lety`s be honest. They all want to be the next Youtube sensation. They are attention whores seeking how many "Likes" and "Followers" they can get. "You want to pay me what to clean what? No! I don`t think so. I am gonna be a star! That`s what Mexicans are for, right?"

My grandmother was full blooded native Indian from the mountains of Mexico.


People all over the world are starving. How many do we allow in, give me a number? Seriously. How many people here in the USA are also starving? Do you know that in Portland Maine they have so many asylum seekers that the city is taking funds and resources away from the actual citizens to house and feed them all. https://www.wsj.com/articles/maines-largest-city-strains-under-asylum-seeker-influx-11548601200




In Texas, my home state, it was discovered that thousands of people were registered to vote ILLEGALLY! I don`t care if they were registered as republican or democrat. Only American citizens should be allowed to vote. Would they allow you to sneak into Mexico and vote in their elections?

You stated: Why are brown people considered a threat? Why not build a wall to keep out Canadians too? Be careful, don’t let your sheet fall in front of your eyes.

You are the racist. You do grasp that I am of these "brown people", right? Again my grandmother is full blood native. I heard her speak in her native tongue. You then step in it further to state that I should not allow my "sheet to fall" in front of my eyes...WTH? Are you suggesting I am a member of the KKK? Or it is that anyone who you disagree with you label right away....."damn racist!" News flash....Mexicans voted for Trump, blacks voted for Trump....oddly enough I DID NOT.

I live in Texas, you can`t build one continuous wall. Yet a wall or barrier can be built in many areas, thus meaning less man power is needed there to patrol which in turns mean we can focus on the areas not covered. As for more drugs being caught in port areas....use some logic and reasoning skills here.

The claim is that because we stop, say 90%, of narcotics at the ports of entry, this then is where we need to concentrate our focus. Yet we have no clue just how much is crossing over in the non port areas. "We confiscated 200lbs of marijuana at port today!" While 500 lbs are walked across elsewhere.

Again, a wall is not racist. Wanting a secure border is not evil. How many people sleep with their doors and windows open or go on vacation and leave their house unlocked? Same concept. You only want people whom you have "invited" to come into your house and you have every right to do so.

Anthony

 

[Coatings=crack]

Americans visiting our nations White House will notice it has walls, fences and fancy ropes that are there to tell people `You can`t go past this". When I got lunch today there was between me and the workers and kitchen a counter "wall/barrier". In my bank they have a big barrier plus ballistic glass between myself and the tellers. I am not to go past that. Around Six Flags Over Texas I can`t just walk in there and expect them to give me a free day plus food and drink. They got this huge barrier between the outside people and those people that have paid to be there. Since I have not paid to go into the park I should not be expected to be let it.

A wall is not "immoral" nor can it be "moral" for it has no personhood. It is not aware, has no thought process. The actions of those on either side of the wall will be judged moral or immoral, but who is right or wrong? The people seeking America do so for a better life, at least most do. Others are running from trouble or to trouble. Americans want to control who comes in, not eliminate immigration completely.

The most fundamental question to be asked in this and it`s not being asked is this: "Why are people desperate to leave their country?" It`s NOT because America has all the answers but more so because their country SUCKS! It`s corrupt in all forms from the city police to the government and then there`s the drug cartels. They would not want to leave their country if the corruption would be done away with. So all these caravans coming up here, waving their homeland flags, need to march their butts back and start a revolution and take back their country. Funny how you never see a caravan of Americans wanting to cross over into the Hondura`s or Bolivia. I wonder why that is?

Cross into North Korea. What happens? Most likely you get meet with a bullet. Is that wrong of North Korea? NO! It`s their country, it`s their border. You would be seen as an invader. If Israel did away with her wall, what would happen? Would they all get together and sing by the campfire? I would like to see that but reality says, Hamas, Iranians, Syrians, Egyptians and everyone else within 1000 miles wants them driven into the sea and forgotten as a people.

We need borders defined, Without borders, protected borders, we are just asking for trouble.

Anthony

Not a fan of the wall but I usually leave politics alone (read this thread don’t normally comment). I just feel the wall will won’t do what people want, especially for the cost. Although a different time and wall.... ask China how well their wall performed. My 2cents anyways. Although I’m not the most informed in politics and my feelings not swayed, this was by far I feel the most respectful and eloquent way of arguing for the wall. I don’t know if you formed this statement is a almalgamation of others or your owned formed thoughts but for an argument for the wall, well spoken.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Anthony O.]

Not a fan of the wall but I usually leave politics alone (read this thread don’t normally comment). I just feel the wall will won’t do what people want, especially for the cost. Although a different time and wall.... ask China how well their wall performed. My 2cents anyways. Although I’m not the most informed in politics and my feelings not swayed, this was by far I feel the most respectful and eloquent way of arguing for the wall. I don’t know if you formed this statement is a almalgamation of others or your owned formed thoughts but for an argument for the wall, well spoken.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This is what`s meant by "America is an idea". It`s also perhaps the longest running experiment. I am not seeking to turn anyone to "my side" but rather to have a intelligent discussion, share thoughts and ideas, debate vigorously and come away with more knowledge...hopefully. Those are all my own thoughts I tried to put down as clearly as possible and thank you for the kind words.

In regards to your statement on the wall and "cost" we would have to look at cost measured not in the initial cost plus maintenance but rather does it save money in the long run. Obviously we have to consider maintenance but does that cost more than providing food, shelters, court costs and programs to assist the illegal aliens?

Let`s look at a hypothetical and let`s say we had a border system in place that cut off illegal crossing 100%. How much money is saved? What is saved far out weighs what that border system would cost in upkeep. Now obviously we cannot keep 100% out but let`s say we can cut illegal crossing down by 50%. It`s been estimated the wall or barrier system would still pay for itself.

What the problem is education level. On average people with low education have low paying jobs and in turn need assistance. This in turn must come from somewhere, so it`s passed onto American citizens. If someone wants to come to America, more power to them. Do it legally. It`s costly and time consuming BUT I have such high respect for the people who do so. It`s a slap in their face when we just allow people to stream in here and provide them with all kinds of stuff.

The reason the border system is so jacked up is because it was never...never addressed by anyone. The only thing ever done was placing band-aides on it every so often. Politicians, on all sides, talk about it when it suits their advancing political career and then when they get whay they want it`s never spoken of again. Politicians in general do not give those who they represent a second thought once in power. Do you know why? Because if they fixed everything they said they would or could who then needs them in power any longer?

Take care,
Anthony

 

[Fishroes]

Well said Anthony. Coatings, I think I might have to get out of this topic, you are using words my high school edgamacation hadn’t run across. Almalgamation. LOL!!

edit: I’ve always thought politicians are crooked as he!l. That’s why I don’t get involved