Static Cling???

S

screeby

New member
As a "newb" to the detailing world, I am wondering if anyone has looked at different wax's or sealant's that don't attract as much dust, pollen and so on. I finished part of my first vehicle this weekend, I knew I would have time for the whole pick up so I did a couple panels and will attack it again.



ANYWAYS... I finished with Meguiar's Ultimate Wax. I have applied this wax by hand to another vehicle, the pick up was applied by machine. Regardless I have seen that pollen, dirt, dust and so on seem to stick or attract much... faster? I suppose would be the word. Now, on the hand applied vehicle, water beads great, the look is deep, washes well. No complaints. Just dirty VERY fast. Nothing a simple ONR GDM wouldn't fix in 20 minutes, just don't wanna wash every 3 days :)



SO. Are there any finishes that don't do this as fast? And I should say, Opti-Coat is probably out for me right now. I am not confident enough to do my self, and no one in the area applies it as far as I know.



Any ideas?
 
Should not make any difference how the application was done, once the carrier solvents flash off, the wax starts to set. Question, what are the colors of the vehicles?

Has the temperatures been warmer in your area?

Do they set outside in the same areas?

Lot of things to consider.
 
There are good scientific reasons why this tends to happen - basically, many of this type of product are electrical insulators. This means that any charge which is created (which can result from any number of sources) is insulated/isolated from the surrounding area, it is static and cannot move away. This then attracts material with an opposite charge, in this case, dust. There are quite a few products which claim to be anti-static, but just like those claiming to be 'self-cleaning', the truth is often that the marketing person doesn't really know what they are talking about!



As Ron, says, application isn't likely to make a difference. I cannot make suggestions on alternative products as this wouldn't be something that commonly troubles us in the UK (it tends to rain, rain will disipate any charge).
 
Rubbing a paint surface with a Microfiber towel (Polyester /Polyamide) will induce a static charge. Using a quick detailer after polishing will help to neutralize any static electricity build up, water is a natural static neutralizer Quick detailers are mostly water plus ingredients that provide lubrication, gloss, slickness, shine and in some cases, protection



Use a 1:20 Optimum No-Rinse (ONR) / distilled water solution in a fine mist spray bottle. The surfactants it contains encapsulate and trap dry surface dust, pollen or light dirt particles making them virtually non-abrasive and it can be used without causing scratches. Apply with a long nap micro fibre towel using very little surface pressure, dusting with long strokes in one direction only
 
Yes but, to me, the problem comes because the interaction with the environment will result in the build up of charge. It will happen by just leaving your vehicle outside or by driving it. So effectively the above would mean that the user has to pretty much wash the vehicle repeatedly to avoid the problem. You are into the industry in the US, who out there makes paint sealants which claim to be antistatic? Which of those have actually carried out any measurements to prove it?
 
What products would you be comparing UW to? In my experience it is certainly no dust magnet compared to some oil rich waxes and QDs.
 
In reply to a couple of the responses.



-I wasn't implying that different application methods caused this as much as the fact I have applied it to both of my vehicles and received the same result



-The wife's Edge is maroon, my pick up is black (yes, I know (: that isn't helping). They sit outside at work, a couple blocks apart from each other. I live in NW Iowa, weather has been moderate for this part of the country.



- I'm not saying I know what the answer is as far what product to use, I'm asking a question, does anyone else fight this. If not, what ya using?



- I am trying to avoid the washing every three days to keep a vehicle looking sharp and crisp.



Not upset by any of the answers, just replying
 
It is just a fact of life, especially with dark colors like black. Even the best anti-static products only help marginally when compared to really bad products.
 
The original patent for anti static products for automotive products, including polishes, sealants, waxes and mold release products was Finish Kare(aprox 1991-92) when Floyd was still alive.

He never enforced violations of the patent and several companies jumped on the band wagon, seems to have died down these days.
 
Ron Ketcham said:
The original patent for anti static products for automotive products, including polishes, sealants, waxes and mold release products was Finish Kare(aprox 1991-92) when Floyd was still alive.

He never enforced violations of the patent and several companies jumped on the band wagon, seems to have died down these days.
Click to expand...



Has it actually died? I have never seen the patent but am familiar with a number of approaches to deal with this particular problem. I suspect some of the products on the market do tackle it, just are not really jumping up and down to say so. The problem is that there are a number of brands who advertise every possible characteristic and we all know they are telling pork pies, so I think some of the more advanced products just don't bother with such marketing anymore.
 
Patents are funny things. The products did what they said they would, however, the "lasting" effect was fairly short term. Was just an ingrediant added to the products.

Where is was "widely" accepted was the FRP industry for mold prep.

As you are aware, in the sanding, polishing and applying release agents a lot of static is generated.
 
I gave my black car a quick polish a few weeks ago and I'm sporting No protection. Will do a full correction when I have time. But I am liking the look and sheeting action. $4 bucks at the spot free coin op and good to go. Drip dry for a few minutes, wipe the back window and go. A few water spots from the dust bowl I live in. But it is only minor compared to a waxed surface. And no touching paint so far.
 
Ron Ketcham said:
Patents are funny things. The products did what they said they would, however, the "lasting" effect was fairly short term. Was just an ingrediant added to the products.

Where is was "widely" accepted was the FRP industry for mold prep.

As you are aware, in the sanding, polishing and applying release agents a lot of static is generated.
Click to expand...



This is my problem with patents. They knock together a bunch of generic ingredients in a generic way and try to say the result is unique to them. If we were to pay attention to every last one, you simply couldn't make a new product without breach a patent. More than that, the big multinational chemical companies wouldn't have many customers because, in some cases, their products have supposedly had their primary use patented by someone so in theory no one else would want that product because they would have to pay the patent owner to use it.



On topic again and probably a question you are best placed to answer, Ron. Why don't we get these tests done and results made public by all these supposed expert brands? Simple fact is that it is not difficult to do gloss and haze tests to confirm a product enhances appearance. It is not hard to do tests to show how many wash cycles a product survives. It is not difficult to do tests to do tests to show coating thickness (and I don't mean with a PTG). It is not even difficult to do tests to measure surface conductivity and tendency for static cling. My experience in the UK is that the 'brands' are rarely experts and it boils down to them being detailers who have started rebranding someone else's products (which are often valeting type products which have been on the market for dozens of years). As such they are just not anything close to expert (beyond knowing how to market to their chosen customers!) and I feel that the lack of genuine information is indicative of this - I doubt many would even know what the tests are, much less how to go about doing them. What are your feelings here?
 
As you are aware, anyone can "test and present their findings". That's the real problem, there is no realization by the detailing community of "Valid and accepted scientific test protocals".

Many of those who have a clue, just blow them off if they don't validate their opinion or brand.

Another issue is "cost for valid protocal testing by a certified independant lab", which can run into several thousands of dollars, pounds, lira, peso's etc. Most of these "car care companies" do not want consumers to be aware that the products they market are just rebranded and would rather spend the testing funds on additional advertising propaganda.

In my work with the vehicle manufacturers, providing product, it was often necessary for us to pay for the independant certified lab testing of a product in order to get the business. Not bad, as orders of a product from a Ford, GM, etc are a bit larger than one from a marketer in Florida.

Just filling their distribution warehouses and then the dealership shelves is a ton of product and the sales costs is on their end, not ours.

That said, there are times that the vehicle manufacturer is willing to pay for the testing out of their pocket due to time constraints, etc.

Hyundai and the ETR kit is an example. They had in excess of 40,000 new vehicles with serious trim discoloring due to the process their port subcontractor used to remove the shipping coating.

The company had already achieved a winning track record with two other manufacturers and it's use, had done a Stage 1 test protocal.

Hyundia wanted the full blown testing done.

It would have cost AI close to $9,000 to have the testing done, in order to sell aprox $12,000 in product. I didn't see a "win" in those numbers, so told them "You are the one with the $2 million dollar concern, not me, you pick a lab, you pay the lab and if the results meet your requirements, I'll be happy to ship product.

They had already exhausted all the "black trim renewer" products and none met the criteria, but did have the various TSB's from other companies for the ETR and it's abilities so they paid for the testing.

Since they paid for the testing, AI can not publish it, same with many of the Ford, Chrysler, etc test results we have, confidential information.

I did bring a couple of binders of test results with me when I retired, just for reference, but can not "share" them due to the legal issues. I will give a slight look into this "test" world though. The Chrysler Master Shield Paint Sealant testing, done every two years comprises 11 pages of test data and results, required 48 test panels, using Dupont, PPG and BASF OEM base/clear systems and one PPG refinish base/clear system. Then the acid testing, the xeon gas exposure, on and on.

So, that's why you don't see these boutique companies showing valid, documented, accepted testing protocal results-they aren't even aware that such exist for the most part and since they buy ready made standard products from a blender, most do not even know the chemistry of the product.
 
To be honest, the data need not even be independent. Just a bit of evidence that the suppliers have the slightest idea about what they are talking would help. I do rely on resellers for my own living but I spend a lot of time talking to and explaining the products and I do feel that they are better placed than many when it comes to transmitting facts to the end users. Perhaps it is jealousy but it bugs the life out of me when some suppliers will give the impression to the general public that they are experts and then turn round and (knowingly or otherwise) provide information which is not just inaccurate, but often total nonsense.



OK, I'll chime off on this one before we digress further!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top