Splain something about swirls to me

C

CroMag

New member
As one who is naturally compulsive about swirls on my own vehicles, I of course notice a lot of cars that have them as well. However, something about these cars always jumps out at me that I have not been able to come up with an answer to and is frustrating the h#ll out of me.



Swirls always seem to develop in the same pattern regardless of where they are located on the vehicle - a bunch of tight, symmetrical, convex swirls - kind of like ripples in a pond. Now given that swirls are largely due to poor washing technique that rubs abrasives into the paint, why don't they develop in a more random pattern?



People don't always wash in a symmetrical, circular pattern on every panel - you would think that swirls would look more like a pile of spaghetti, or that you would see vertical or horizontal scratches, but they never look like that. Maybe I am missing the obvious, but why do swirls look the way they do?



Please help so that I can move on with my life and contemplate other mindless things....
 
I think the swirls are actually random, but because the light source is usually a point, rather than diffuse, it reflects in a specific way.
 
Pretty much what Mike stated above.



I call these halo-scratches because as the light catches the edges of these random scratches they appear to be circular patterns but in reality they are just thousands of random scratches.



Anthony
 
Playing around with the lighting can help illustrate this. A friend of mine gets linear marring from washing, but in many lighting conditions it looks anything *but* linear. Get the light right and sure enough, it's a bunch of straight scratches.
 
mine are a little random too if i move the light or look at it at a diferent angle. however, on the streets the swirls on other cars show up in circular patterns.
 
Picture snippet....

Swirl-Lines.jpg
 
gopedhead said:
mine are a little random too if i move the light or look at it at a diferent angle. however, on the streets the swirls on other cars show up in circular patterns.
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Swirls arent circular, on your car or any other car.
 
Coupe said:
Swirls arent circular, on your car or any other car.
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shoudl they be called swirls? swirls illustrate a circular pattern? dont they?



it's kinda contradictory how we all use teh term in that way.
 
gopedhead said:
shoudl they be called swirls? swirls illustrate a circular pattern? dont they?



it's kinda contradictory how we all use teh term in that way.
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Not really becuase the way our eyes see the scratches, they appear to be circular.
 
Accumulator said:
"Swirls" gets used in all sorts of ways...to a purist, a "swirlmark" is something caused by a rotary buffer.
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exactly! :xyxthumbs



what many consider swirls are really only wash scratches that appear circular because of the sun...



a true swirl is only left by a high speed buffer on the leading edge of the backing palte that makes contact with the surface, and these are very distinct because it'll actually be a straight line but within that line is a bunch of 1/4 circle scratches...
 
so the use of "swirl" to illustarte the bad car wash technique is indeed incorrect. but it's an easy way for us to use this term adn understand it instantly.
 
It's been about 6 months since I last polished and I am now starting to see the beginnings of swirls. They're just small, short,random scratches. I would say on average they're about 2"-3" apart so they don't have that characteristic 'swirl' look yet, but I know if I don't polish soon, the gaps between them will slowly fill in and I will have 'swirls'.
 
This whole "what's a swirlmark?" subject is why I always say "marring". IMO it makes for a good umbrella-term for all kinds of scratches/gouges in the paint. From the lightest holograms to the deepest scratch...if it's something that calls for mechanical abrasion I call it marring. I've been hearing "marring" to describe surface defects in one context or another my entire life.



I bet 99% of the stuff we talk about polishing out is wash-induced marring of one kind or another.
 
Accumulator said:
...to a purist, a "swirlmark" is something caused by a rotary buffer.
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I completely disagree.



from Webster:
swirl



Main Entry: 1swirl

Pronunciation: 'sw&r(-&)l

Function: verb

Etymology: Middle English

intransitive verb

1 a : to move with an eddying or whirling motion <swirling water> b : to pass in whirling confusion

2 : to have a twist or convolution

transitive verb : to cause to swirl <swirled her drink>

- swirl·ing·ly /'sw&r-li[ng]-lE/ adverb



Main Entry: 2swirl

Function: noun

1 a : a whirling mass or motion : EDDY b : whirling confusion <a swirl of events>

2 : a twisting shape, mark, or pattern

3 : an act or instance of swirling
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I would argue that swirls are any marring in the form of “a twisting shape, mark, or pattern� and are induced by "eddying or whirling motion.�



I agree that “halo� or “cobweb� effect is not specifically swirling because it’s a visual effect, an illusion, not the actual pattern of marring.



A rotating buffer pad can certainly cause swirl shaped marring but so can a person's hands. Most people rub cars in circular motions. Using scratchy towels or abrasive products will leave swirl shaped patterns in larger, arm or wrist length arcs.



Since everybody touches their cars but only a percentage of people ever take theirs to hack buffer jockeys the vast majority of swirl patterned marring I see is caused by hand.





PC.
 
the Other PC- I should've explained what I meant better...rather than saying "to a purist" I should've said something like:



A lot of old-school detailers believe that, in a detailing context, "swirlmarks" are a specific type of marring that's caused by a rotary buffer.



I only say this because I've seen posts to that effect (and had people say it in person). Some folks are very picky about what they consider the term to mean and I've been [severely criticized] for not following that definition.



FWIW, I agree with *your* posted definition (hard to argue with the dictionary, huh?). Stuff was "swirling" long before we started polishing cars with rotaries ;)
 
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