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Should the government bail-out include domestic automakers?
- Thread starter tibbsonaphone
- Start date
Deep Gloss Auto Salon
New member
Len_A said:Hope things turn around soon or we're all going to have lots of company (those of us out of work).
Thanks Len!
Danase said:No snow at 4:00 this morning and then like 6 inches at 7:00! The drive home is going to be fun! Got behind a young lady in a Cadillac this morning doing about 20 mph and get next to her and see her on her cell phone. Glad my ride is 5 minutes! LOL
Holy crap, is it nasty out. Are you getting the sleet mixed with the snow? I was going to go out and at least shovel a path for my dog Sisko to go take care of business - just as I'm going out, the wind gusts pick up and the sleet came down for about six or seven minutes!! Sisko took one look at it, and then looked up at me, and went back in the living room and got back in his dog bed. Like "No way I'm going in that, Lenny! I'll hold it for a little longer!" He finally went out five mintutes later, and the snow is up past his chest (he's an eighteen pound Shih Tzu, so he's already low to the ground.
Len_A said:Holy crap, is it nasty out. Are you getting the sleet mixed with the snow? I was going to go out and at least shovel a path for my dog Sisko to go take care of business - just as I'm going out, the wind gusts pick up and the sleet came down for about six or seven minutes!! Sisko took one look at it, and then looked up at me, and went back in the living room and got back in his dog bed. Like "No way I'm going in that, Lenny! I'll hold it for a little longer!" He finally went out five mintutes later, and the snow is up past his chest (he's an eighteen pound Shih Tzu, so he's already low to the ground.
Yeah, the sleet was bad as I was leaving this morning. The wind is bad too all the snow blowing off the roof sucked.
I just saw that. Looks like he's announcing loans.
Danase said:Yeah, the sleet was bad as I was leaving this morning. The wind is bad too all the snow blowing off the roof sucked.
I just saw that. Looks like he's announcing loans.
I hope it's loans.
You got much work to do today? I imagine with this weather, it's got to be slow.
Looks like $17.4 billion in short term loans. Even Bush is acknowledging that a Chapter 11 Bankruptcy filling would not work under current circumstances, and that customers would be scared off from an automaker under C11. Looks like enough short term loans to get them enough time to do a restructuring plan outside of bankruptcy court (like was done for Chrysler in 1979), and punt it to the incoming Obama administration.
Deep Gloss Auto Salon
New member
UPDATED: 12/19/08 9:07 a.m. ET
WASHINGTON -- President Bush today announced emergency federal loans to prevent the collapse of General Motors and Chrysler LLC.
The announcement of the unprecedented action came at 9 a.m. from the White House.
White House intervention became necessary after Congress last week rejected legislation to provide $14 billion in loans – with the promise of more aid to come next year.
Administration officials repeatedly said this week that, under normal circumstances, they would want companies to reorganize under federal bankruptcy law but that these are not normal times.
GM and Chrysler have warned they could run out of cash within weeks as U.S. auto sales drop levels not seen since the early 1980s.
Ford Motor Co. said it does not face a similar crisis but wants access to a federal line of credit in case market conditions worsen or one of its rivals fails.
The Detroit 3 CEOs told Congress in hearings Dec. 4 and 5 that they need at least $34 billion from the federal government to weather the economic downturn.
WASHINGTON -- President Bush today announced emergency federal loans to prevent the collapse of General Motors and Chrysler LLC.
The announcement of the unprecedented action came at 9 a.m. from the White House.
White House intervention became necessary after Congress last week rejected legislation to provide $14 billion in loans – with the promise of more aid to come next year.
Administration officials repeatedly said this week that, under normal circumstances, they would want companies to reorganize under federal bankruptcy law but that these are not normal times.
GM and Chrysler have warned they could run out of cash within weeks as U.S. auto sales drop levels not seen since the early 1980s.
Ford Motor Co. said it does not face a similar crisis but wants access to a federal line of credit in case market conditions worsen or one of its rivals fails.
The Detroit 3 CEOs told Congress in hearings Dec. 4 and 5 that they need at least $34 billion from the federal government to weather the economic downturn.
Len_A said:I hope it's loans.
You got much work to do today? I imagine with this weather, it's got to be slow.
I work two jobs. My full time day job and my full time ecommerce job. LOL I'm never slow.
Yep, loans. I wonder if the stocks are going up right now?
Deep Gloss Auto Salon
New member
Bush says say government will give automakers $17.4B in loans
WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Bush administration came to the rescue of the deeply troubled U.S. auto industry Friday, offering $17.4 billion in loans in exchange for concessions from carmakers and their workers.
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"Allowing the auto companies to collapse is not a responsible course of action," President Bush said. Bankruptcy, He said that a bankruptcy was unlikely to work for the auto industry at this time and would deal "an unacceptably painful blow to hardworking Americans" across the economy.
One official said $13.4 billion of the money would be available this month and next, $9.4 billion for General Motors Corp. and $4 billion for Chrysler LLC. Both companies have said they soon might be unable to pay their bills without federal help. Ford Motor Co. has said it does not need immediate help.
Bush said the rescue package demanded concessions similar to those outlined in a bailout plan that was approved by the House but rejected by the Senate a week ago. It would give the automakers three months to come up with restructuring plans to become viable companies.
If they fail to produce a plan by March 31, the automakers will be required to repay the loans, which they would find very difficult.
"The time to make hard decisions to become viable is now, or the only option will be bankruptcy," Bush said. "The automakers and unions must understand what is at stake and make hard decisions necessary to reform."
Bush's plan is designed to keep the auto industry running in the short term, passing the longer-range problem on to the incoming administration of President-elect Barack Obama.
WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Bush administration came to the rescue of the deeply troubled U.S. auto industry Friday, offering $17.4 billion in loans in exchange for concessions from carmakers and their workers.
ADVERTISEMENT
"Allowing the auto companies to collapse is not a responsible course of action," President Bush said. Bankruptcy, He said that a bankruptcy was unlikely to work for the auto industry at this time and would deal "an unacceptably painful blow to hardworking Americans" across the economy.
One official said $13.4 billion of the money would be available this month and next, $9.4 billion for General Motors Corp. and $4 billion for Chrysler LLC. Both companies have said they soon might be unable to pay their bills without federal help. Ford Motor Co. has said it does not need immediate help.
Bush said the rescue package demanded concessions similar to those outlined in a bailout plan that was approved by the House but rejected by the Senate a week ago. It would give the automakers three months to come up with restructuring plans to become viable companies.
If they fail to produce a plan by March 31, the automakers will be required to repay the loans, which they would find very difficult.
"The time to make hard decisions to become viable is now, or the only option will be bankruptcy," Bush said. "The automakers and unions must understand what is at stake and make hard decisions necessary to reform."
Bush's plan is designed to keep the auto industry running in the short term, passing the longer-range problem on to the incoming administration of President-elect Barack Obama.
What's you full time day job? Not detailing?Danase said:I work two jobs. My full time day job and my full time ecommerce job. LOL I'm never slow.
Yep, loans. I wonder if the stocks are going up right now?
GM was up three minutes after Bush started talking, in pre-opening trading, and now is up $ .59 a share. $4.16 a share as of a minute ago. Ford is up $ .24 a share at $3.06 a share. Ford is not a part of this loan program, and issued a statement that their liquidity situation is better than GM's and Chrysler's, but anything that keeps a competitor from going under helps Ford by cushioning the finances of the suppliers.
This is a bridge to a bridge - reality is that this is punted to the Obama administration when they take over.
Len_A said:What's you full time day job? Not detailing?
GM was up three minutes after Bush started talking, in pre-opening trading, and now is up $ .59 a share. $4.16 a share as of a minute ago. Ford is up $ .24 a share at $3.06 a share. Ford is not a part of this loan program, and issued a statement that their liquidity situation is better than GM's and Chrysler's, but anything that keeps a competitor from going under helps Ford by cushioning the finances of the suppliers.
This is a bridge to a bridge - reality is that this is punted to the Obama administration when they take over.
I can't say on a public forum. LOL I do a lot of CAD design work and Civil Engineering.
I just hope this helps them. The economy is a scary thing in our parts.
Danase said:I can't say on a public forum. LOL I do a lot of CAD design work and Civil Engineering.
I just hope this helps them. The economy is a scary thing in our parts.
Understood and acknowledged!!
Scary is an understatement. I hope things start turning around here in our area.
Len_A said:Understood and acknowledged!!
Scary is an understatement. I hope things start turning around here in our area.
You and me both! I'm surprised we haven't had a huge jump in crimes lately. Usually when the economy gets this bad robberies and stuff really sky rocket.
Len_A said:I was going to go out and at least shovel a path for my dog Sisko to go take care of business - just as I'm going out, the wind gusts pick up and the sleet came down for about six or seven minutes!! Sisko took one look at it, and then looked up at me, and went back in the living room and got back in his dog bed. Like "No way I'm going in that, Lenny! I'll hold it for a little longer!" He finally went out five mintutes later, and the snow is up past his chest (he's an eighteen pound Shih Tzu, so he's already low to the ground.
:chuckle: That's hilarious. I have an 18 lb Shih-Tzu as well, named Odie. I've been having trouble with him going out to do his business lately too. However, in our case up here its been the extreme cold that is the problem. We've had a lot of days of -25 Celcius lately. (that's -13 F).
Shih-Tzus are great, aren't they. :hifive:
MotorCity said:...WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Bush administration came to the rescue of the deeply troubled U.S. auto industry Friday, offering $17.4 billion in loans in exchange for concessions from carmakers and their workers.
...
Bush said the rescue package demanded concessions similar to those outlined in a bailout plan that was approved by the House but rejected by the Senate a week ago. It would give the automakers three months to come up with restructuring plans to become viable companies.
If they fail to produce a plan by March 31, the automakers will be required to repay the loans, which they would find very difficult.
"The time to make hard decisions to become viable is now, or the only option will be bankruptcy," Bush said. "The automakers and unions must understand what is at stake and make hard decisions necessary to reform."
Bush's plan is designed to keep the auto industry running in the short term, passing the longer-range problem on to the incoming administration of President-elect Barack Obama.
Let's all hope that this is all it takes to get these ships righted.
The highlighted areas concerns me. Why do they need even 3 weeks (3 days or 3 hours for that matter) to provide a plan? If they haven't already formulated a detailed plan by now the resident management teams should be dismissed immediately. A small businessman would be required to present a business plan to his banker before securing a loan. My thoughts are that within those 90 days x portion of the plan(s) should be implemented and within 90 more days a complete report should be provided showing verifiable progress. A periodic reporting period should then be followed. These people (GM/Chrysler/Cerberus management) need to be on a short leash until they can prove themselves.
Has anything been said about what interest rate will be charged for these loans?
And back to my first statment...How are these loans going to help GM/Chrysler sell more cars when there are so many consumers who are either unwilling or unable to purchase due to their personal financial situations?
How old is yours? Min turned thirteen this past Tuesday. He's in good shape for his age, A little arthritis and the start of a heart murmur, but he dos a two mile walk almost everyday, weather permitting the only hang up. Plays like a rambunctious madman. He's got cataracts too, but sees decent enough to chase his ball around the house when I play with him , which is everyday. He's my best buddy. I can't imagine life without this little guy. Shih Tzu's are the best!:woohoo:Inzane said::chuckle: That's hilarious. I have an 18 lb Shih-Tzu as well, named Odie. I've been having trouble with him going out to do his business lately too. However, in our case up here its been the extreme cold that is the problem. We've had a lot of days of -25 Celcius lately. (that's -13 F).
Shih-Tzus are great, aren't they. :hifive:
Good questions all around. All three Detroit automakers have had well publicized turnaround plans for a while now, so I wonder how much of this is political blustering and how much is real.Mr. Clean said:Let's all hope that this is all it takes to get these ships righted.
The highlighted areas concerns me. Why do they need even 3 weeks (3 days or 3 hours for that matter) to provide a plan? If they haven't already formulated a detailed plan by now the resident management teams should be dismissed immediately. A small businessman would be required to present a business plan to his banker before securing a loan. My thoughts are that within those 90 days x portion of the plan(s) should be implemented and within 90 more days a complete report should be provided showing verifiable progress. A periodic reporting period should then be followed. These people (GM/Chrysler/Cerberus management) need to be on a short leash until they can prove themselves.
Has anything been said about what interest rate will be charged for these loans?
And back to my first statment...How are these loans going to help GM/Chrysler sell more cars when there are so many consumers who are either unwilling or unable to purchase due to their personal financial situations?
I'll go back to what I said before - this is enough to punt this to the next Congress and the Obama administration. I agree with you - they need to be on a short leash until they prove themselves.I have no argument on that.
Good point on car sales - that's a main issue, because better sales obviously mean better cash flow. Things are so bad, I don't know if you heard, but Reuters reported that Toyota is expected to post their first ever world wide loss for a fiscal year. That's how bad sales are.
Len_A said:How old is yours? Min turned thirteen this past Tuesday. He's in good shape for his age, A little arthritis and the start of a heart murmur, but he dos a two mile walk almost everyday, weather permitting the only hang up. Plays like a rambunctious madman. He's got cataracts too, but sees decent enough to chase his ball around the house when I play with him , which is everyday. He's my best buddy. I can't imagine life without this little guy. Shih Tzu's are the best!:woohoo:
Mine turned six in August. And he's my best buddy. So much so that my wife gets kinda jealous sometimes. (I'm a first time dog owner with him too, never had pets growing up.)