ShMitt woes!

[jlift]

Bought an all black and a white/yellow Shmitt from Autogeek. Also some poly clay. Got my box Friday. Washed the wheels of my truck with the black Shmitt and put it on my stainless steel working table to dry after wringing it out when I was done. I used the white/yellow Shmitt on the truck. The black one did a pretty good job, although I have a big hand and it was a snug fit. I used Bleche White, a citrus degreaser and chemical guys car wash -- that is, these were the chemicals that the black Shmitt touched. As for the Bleche White, I sprayed it on, and then washed it off with car wash soap from the 3 gallon bucket. Back to the Shmitt drying on the table. It was sunny, the table was warm and I don't know what happened, but I think the Shmitt drying in the sun (about 86 degrees in California) caused the glue around the Shmitt to separate. Kind of bummed about that. Anyone have similar problems with the glue coming off? I think that Aaron from Edge 2000 had some problems with the buff pads and glue a while back? Another glue issue? I will contact Autogeek for a replacement. pics attached.

FIrst time sending pics, so I don't know how to caption. I am pointing at the "good spots" on the Shmitt, then I point to the unglued edges....

 

[jaybs02]

You should try contacting Aaron. He's great, and I'm sure that he will make things right

"J"

 

[cwcad]

Is this your normal practice to place mitts, ww towels, and now the Shmitt pad on a stainless steele table in the hot California sun to dry?

I know from reading the forums that AAron stands behind his products but it strikes me as a little above and beyond to expect something from this particular instance. Do you think that the pad will not work now? Maybe you are afraid of the glue scratching your paint?

I just recieved a yellow and white waffle shmitt pad. Was going to try it out in the coming weeks. I do not think that any pad(Shmitt, PC or rotary) of mine would hold up to that kind of condition. Sorry for your experience but you have shown me want not to do. I thank you for that.

 

[Aaron@IAP]

Hey, not really sure what happenend but of course we will replace the product no questions. Please send it back so we can try to determine what was the cause and also send me an email to my actual email address below with your full shipping address for UPS (cannot be a po box) and we will send out a new one tomorow. This only happenend with the black one right?

Thanks,

Aaron aaron@dedicationtodetail.com
Dedication To Detail, Inc.

 

[joe.p]

I agree with cwcad,those are some extreme conditions to put any item made from foam thru.Is the black mitt actually made to be used with harsh chemicals ,i would think soap and water? citrus degreaser would seem to be the culprit behind the glue dissolving, I'm just a guessing.

 

[JaredPointer]

Just my personal opinion and all, but I don't think Bleche White is too harsh a chemical for use with that thing, or at least it shouldn't be. It's made to clean tires and wheels with, it should stand up to tire and wheel cleaner.

I also don't think that lying it on a table in 86 degree weather is "over-stressing" it either. If it can't handle that, you better not send any of them south of about Virginia.

I'm sure that since it's a new product it probably has some kinks to work out, and from what I have seen and heard through the boards, it will get taken care of.

 

[awd330]

I have all 4 varieties of the ShMITT. They are all holding up very well. I've had no problems using a citrus degreaser (Meguiar's Citri-Gel) with my black/black ShMITT.

 

[Mikeyc]

Hmmm . . . interesting. I have the white/yellow ShMitt and it's been nothing but excellent for me. It fits snuggly on my hand as well. So, I just keep in mind not to push my fingers through the foam. I usually forget about it after the first panel I wash, but the ShMitt holds up anyway.

I also don't think that lying it on a table in 86 degree weather is "over-stressing" it either. If it can't handle that, you better not send any of them south of about Virginia.

I don't think it's so much that he left the ShMitt out in 86* weather. I think the point that people are trying to make is that he left it out on a warm/hot day, in the sun, on a metal table. The ShMitt I'm sure saw temperatures MUCH higher than 86* air temperature because of the metal table.

Might as well put the ShMitt in a frying pan on your stove and see if it lasts.

 

[JohnZ3MC]

Am I reading these responses right?
A guy buys a foam mitt in good faith and uses it with normal chemicals we all use on our cars to wash his car like it's intended purpose. He uses nothing weird like pure sulphuric acid or anything, and he dares to leave it to dry on a metal shelf and it comes apart after his FIRST WASH and comments on it.
Two responders reply/suggest that it was his fault for using it in an improper fashion.
I'm still trying to figure out what's improper about what how he used it improperly and I just can't figure it out.
He used normal stuff we all use.
He put it in the sun to dry.
Shame on him for trying the obvious?

From what I can see, he didn't do anything wrong, nothing more than the what the normal car guy would do, he didn't use abnormal products, nor did he use it outside of it's intended purpose - washing a vehicle, nor did he subject it to extremes.

Two of you guys suggested it's his fault for doing something wrong? Shame on you guys for suggesting the original poster was in error, and I say shame on Shmitt for not testing their product for it's intended purpose.

Should it only be used north of 54' 40" where the climate is suitable for it's purpose? Should it not be put on a metal shelf when the sun is shining?
These questions are absolutely ludicrous and Aaron is doing the right thing.
Support the original poster and the company by trying to do the right thing. Don't cast aspersions upon the original poster who did nothing wrong.
-John C.

 

[ashsarna]

Good post JohnZ3MC.
Aaron is doing what a good company does by taking care of the OP. The others questioning the OP usage seems unwarranted based on his procedure. Personally, I thank jlift for posting, as info is always appreciated imo (isn't that one reason why we are on forums? I am).

 

[cwcad]

Am I reading these responses right?
A guy buys a foam mitt in good faith and uses it with normal chemicals we all use on our cars to wash his car like it's intended purpose. He uses nothing weird like pure sulphuric acid or anything, and he dares to leave it to dry on a metal shelf and it comes apart after his FIRST WASH and comments on it.
Two responders reply/suggest that it was his fault for using it in an improper fashion.
I'm still trying to figure out what's improper about what how he used it improperly and I just can't figure it out.
He used normal stuff we all use.
He put it in the sun to dry.
Shame on him for trying the obvious?

From what I can see, he didn't do anything wrong, nothing more than the what the normal car guy would do, he didn't use abnormal products, nor did he use it outside of it's intended purpose - washing a vehicle, nor did he subject it to extremes.

Two of you guys suggested it's his fault for doing something wrong? Shame on you guys for suggesting the original poster was in error, and I say shame on Shmitt for not testing their product for it's intended purpose.

Should it only be used north of 54' 40" where the climate is suitable for it's purpose? Should it not be put on a metal shelf when the sun is shining?
These questions are absolutely ludicrous and Aaron is doing the right thing.
Support the original poster and the company by trying to do the right thing. Don't cast aspersions upon the original poster who did nothing wrong.
-John C.

Hey, I just call them the way I see them.

 

[JaredPointer]

I don't think it's so much that he left the ShMitt out in 86* weather. I think the point that people are trying to make is that he left it out on a warm/hot day, in the sun, on a metal table. The ShMitt I'm sure saw temperatures MUCH higher than 86* air temperature because of the metal table.

Might as well put the ShMitt in a frying pan on your stove and see if it lasts.

C'mon, the table would have been, what, like 100 degrees, maybe??? I don't see where the guy did anything wrong. The mitt shouldn't have came apart, period. I do applaud the Edge co. for the customer service they show their customers, but I do not approve of the fact that anytime a sponsor product fails to perform to the advertisement of what's on the board, it's almost always assumed to be the user's fault, especially right from square one. Sometimes it might just be user error/abuse, but sometimes it might just be that some of the products that are talked about here fail to live up to expectations.

I completely agree with you JohnZ3MC.

 

[The Fuzz]

I do not approve of the fact that anytime a sponsor product fails to perform to the advertisement of what's on the board, it's almost always assumed to be the user's fault, especially right from square one. Sometimes it might just be user error/abuse, but sometimes it might just be that some of the products that are talked about here fail to live up to expectations.

I think I have to agree with you on this one. Keep in mind, this is a member to member issue and not an issue where the owners, admins, mods or even the advertisers themselves are trying to sway public opinon or covering up performance issues.

Detailing involves chemicals and is quite often hot work. Quite often detail shops are sweat shops and tools take abuse. I'm sure that alot of Detail City members that detail as a hobby may not be aware of what a real profesional auto detailing environment is like. They might have an idea of what it should be like, in their opinion, but in the real world detailing is a gritty, grimy, hot and nasty job.

Cleaning wheels is not glamorous and chemicals need to be used. The sun shines and detailers usually don't need to be worrying about building a tent to keep their wash mitt cool and comfy.

So jlift gave this particular Wheel Shmitt more than it could handle, was he asking too much from it? No.

 

[Mikeyc]

C'mon, the table would have been, what, like 100 degrees, maybe??? I don't see where the guy did anything wrong. The mitt shouldn't have came apart, period. I do applaud the Edge co. for the customer service they show their customers, but I do not approve of the fact that anytime a sponsor product fails to perform to the advertisement of what's on the board, it's almost always assumed to be the user's fault, especially right from square one. Sometimes it might just be user error/abuse, but sometimes it might just be that some of the products that are talked about here fail to live up to expectations.

I can't really say what the temperature was around that metal table, but I'm willing to bet it was much higher than 100*. This isn't the same as leaving the ShMitt on shelf somewhere. Leaving it on a metal table will significantly increase the temperature it is exposed to. I recall a thread (possibly in another detailing forum) in which a member used an IR thermometer to measure the surface temperature of multiple cars' panels in a parking lot on a summer day where IIRC the temp was ~90*. Again IIRC the cars all had a surface temperatures up to 200*. IMO, if a surface is too hot to touch then it's not a good idea to be putting your ShMitt on there to dry.

Should the ShMitt be designed to withstand 200* temperatures? Well, I guess that's debatable. However, IMO I don't see why it should be exposed to such high temperatures.

As to the issue of people defending sponsor products, I don't think people are always solely blaming the user. I think when you have a product malfunction you have to consider all possible causes. Generally speaking there are two possible categories for causes of malfunction: user error and manufacturing/design error.

Personally, if I've seen only one single post about a particular product problem the first thing I assume is that it might be user error. So, I look at the process described and see if anything seems like it might have caused the problem. In this case, IMO it seems he may have exposed the product to extreme temperatures. If he had not dried his ShMitt like this then I would have definitely said it was manufacturer error. It still could have been a manufacturing issue, but I think it's possible his process may have caused it as well. I don't think you can really say either way what definitely caused the malfunction. However, I stand by my opinion that the ShMitt drying method described by the OP is not an ideal technique.

As always, Aaron is standing behind his products 110% and is doing the right thing. Personally, I have no business connection with any of the sponsors. Like everyone here I occassionally win a product or get something to try out, but that's it. When a product I have used many times with success malfunctions for someone else, I try to use my experience with the product to assist that person in determining the root of the issue. I would hate to see the OP get a new ShMitt and then leave it on the metal table in the sun to dry and wonder why the glue keeps melting on him simply because no one mentioned it might be the cause of his issue.

 

[jaybs02]

I'm a bit lost on why this is causing such bickering.
A product failed (for whatever reason), the manufacturer is replacing it.
Quality customer service from my standpoint.
I could understand if there was a dispute and nothing was going to be done, but that isn't the case.

I wish very manufacturer and vendor, where of the same caliber as the ones that are here.

JMHO
"J"

 

[JaredPointer]

I'm a bit lost on why this is causing such bickering.
A product failed (for whatever reason), the manufacturer is replacing it.
Quality customer service from my standpoint.
I could understand if there was a dispute and nothing was going to be done, but that isn't the case.

I wish very manufacturer and vendor, where of the same caliber as the ones that are here.

JMHO
"J"

You're right. :::In a panic calling to see if I can get a climate/humidity controlled storage warehouse to store any and all detailing supplies since I'm not sure any of them are designed to withstand normal usage:::

 

[Mikeyc]

You're right. :::In a panic calling to see if I can get a climate/humidity controlled storage warehouse to store any and all detailing supplies since I'm not sure any of them are designed to withstand normal usage:::

Hmmm . . . that actually reminds me. I have to take in my detailing supplies from the garage. It's starting to get below freezing at night. But extreme temperature exposure shouldn't be a problem right? :lol:

Sorry about that I couldn't resist.

Anyway, I don't think this thread reached the point of bickering. It was still within the bounds of an intelligent conversation IMO. There's always some level of discussion turning into bickering on a forum. It's just the nature of internet discussion I guess.

We'll never know for sure what caused the OP's problem. Jays is right though the important thing is that he got a replacement product and in the end no harm was done.

 

[Aaron@IAP]

Hey Guys, Group Hug Please?

You are all right! We did alot of testing with the ShMitts but truth be told real world experience is where we will find out what the product can withstand. We do use a hot melt type of adhesive and on the metal table reflecting the sun could definatly exceed 120F. Ever feel your car hood on a sunny day, you could fry an egg! That being said we totally feel that the product should withstand a whole array of situations and if there is a problem we did not initially detect, well its a chance to improve the product. I appreciate that many people here don't just jump to the conclusion that the product sucks and its the manufacturers fault in making a bad product, and I also appreciate that the customer is always right and the product did in fact fail under some circumstance that needs to be looked into and if needed improved upon. Point is, we will not leave the customer out in the cold, we will replace any and all defective products and work to make them better all the time. I only hope that Jack will continue to use the ShMiTT and find that it is a fantastic new tool that we hope everyone will try and love.

 

[shadybreal]

I think the products are outstanding. They help speed up the wash process and eliminate some of the micro-marring risks. It also helps that the CEO is so understanding, and will make things right if you have a defective product.

Bradley

 

[jlift]

Hey Guys, Group Hug Please?

You are all right! We did alot of testing with the ShMitts but truth be told real world experience is where we will find out what the product can withstand. We do use a hot melt type of adhesive and on the metal table reflecting the sun could definatly exceed 120F. Ever feel your car hood on a sunny day, you could fry an egg! That being said we totally feel that the product should withstand a whole array of situations and if there is a problem we did not initially detect, well its a chance to improve the product. I appreciate that many people here don't just jump to the conclusion that the product sucks and its the manufacturers fault in making a bad product, and I also appreciate that the customer is always right and the product did in fact fail under some circumstance that needs to be looked into and if needed improved upon. Point is, we will not leave the customer out in the cold, we will replace any and all defective products and work to make them better all the time. I only hope that Jack will continue to use the ShMiTT and find that it is a fantastic new tool that we hope everyone will try and love.

Thanks again, Aaron. I did email you per your input and I know that you will take care of this just as you took care of my 7424 adapter upgrade. I did not mean get people upset with each other's opinions. Well, looks like I'll be getting a new Shmitt. Thanks again Aaron for "getting your Shmitt together." couldn't resist....:yay