PB S&W vs. QEW

G

GrussGott

New member
As a noob in the Midwest I needed a wash solution so I've been using QEW, but I decided the best way to use it was to spray it on and wipe it off with a mitt.

Then I got a 16oz bottle of Poorboy's Spray & Wipe and decided a competition was in order. The test vehicle had been QEW'd 2 days before and has 3 coats of UPP and 1 UGE on. For the towel I used one of Excel Detail's Elite 1616 ultra plush towels (BTW, highly recommended!!). I used the nappy side for primary dirt removal, and the smooth side for secondary buffing.

The S&W smelled nice and, of course, just sprayed on. Removal with the MF was easy and most of dirt came off on the first pass. I followed up with the opposite side of the towel for dry off. I used half the towel for one side of the car and the other half for the other side.

So what about scratches? After the towel was thoroughly dirty I shook it out and did an area I knew to be scratch-free. No problems. Either the UPP or MF or S&W or the combo prevented them, but I was quite surprised.

That's the technique, but what about the product? It works, but it did leave a film I had to go back and buff off. No biggie there :D

My only concern is the price. I used about 1/8 - 1/4 of the 16oz bottle for the car. At the current Premium Auto Care price that's ok, but at the normal price I'm not sure if I'd use it over QEW.

QEW was my standby before S&W. I mix one cap into a 32oz spray bottle which is double strength. That said, it's much more watery than S&W and didn't give me the confidence that S&W did. In my experience, however, it works the same and I feel like I have an unlimited amount with just one 16oz bottle since I'm only using a capful or two per wash.

My conclusion is that at the gallon price of $30 plus $5 shipping for S&W it's probably worth it, but that QEW sure does go a long way. Some may say that QEW will scratch without a bucket, etc., but not in my tests - could be the UPP though :)
 
If you are worried about the amount of S&W you use washing your car, try diluting it 3/1. The added water makes it evap a little slower if you are using it on warm days also.

For a normal sized sedan, you shouldn't be using any more than about 4oz of liquid to clean it....unless it is super cruddy.
 
Secret Chimp said:
For a normal sized sedan, you shouldn't be using any more than about 4oz of liquid to clean it....unless it is super cruddy.
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At the PB gallon price that still makes it ~$1.10 per wash which still seems a bit high to me compared to QEW which is ~¢0.20 per wash. There's no doubt that S&W is an awesome product, and I really like it, but I wonder is it 5X better than QEW?

I'm on the fence - if I could get it for $30 shipped per gallon then I'd be sold.
 
First you must realize you did it on a white car...shows little as far as scratches go...QEW is not meant to be put in a spray bottle and many people have tried it before you and have realized you are not comparing two similar products. Yes QEW is a cheaper product, but meant to be done with two buckets of warm water not via a spray bottle. I'm glad it works for you with a white car, but those before you who tried it with dark colors did not find equal results:) You will also find some that add S&W to their QEW buckets to add more lubrication.
 
GrussGott said:
At the PB gallon price that still makes it ~$1.10 per wash which still seems a bit high to me compared to QEW which is ~¢0.20 per wash. There's no doubt that S&W is an awesome product, and I really like it, but I wonder is it 5X better than QEW?
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If the QEW spray is working for you, no. If you happen to end up with a scratch from the QEW spray, that $1.10 will look like a real bargain.:)
GrussGott said:
I'm on the fence - if I could get it for $30 shipped per gallon then I'd be sold.
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That's an easy one. Buy $125 total of supplies or order the 5 Gallon container. Free shipping either way.

FWIW, it would only be $6.95 for shipping a gallon and with gas the price it is, you would probably spend half that going to Wal*Mart and still wouldn't have any S&W.:)

Charles
 
Poorboy said:
First you must realize you did it on a white car...shows little as far as scratches go...QEW is not meant to be put in a spray bottle
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:flamed

There's no doubt that S&W is an awesome product. :bow That being said, if we're being academic about this ...

I use both 2 500watt halogen lights and 7 dual 48" T-12 fluorescent shop lights. Believe me - they show all the scratches! :cool The lack of scratches is probably due to the underlying lubricity of the UPP, UGE, and Excel MF. Plain ole water may have shown the same result.

The academic question is, though, does S&W have 5 times more lubricity than QEW? That is, since we're focusing on scratches, will S&W offer 5 times more protection against them than QEW?

In my test, they both offered enough protection to prevent scratches - at what point they diverge we'd need a test to find out. A simple test could use water as a control and you'd increase the dirt level in a controlled way until removal induced scratches. If things are as you say, water will fail quickly, followed by QEW, and then S&W.

I be interested in knowing if those are indeed the results. In the meantime I salute S&W! :beer
 
GrussGott said:
:flamed

The academic question is, though, does S&W have 5 times more lubricity than QEW? That is, since we're focusing on scratches, will S&W offer 5 times more protection against them than QEW?
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It wouldn't need to offer 5x more lubricity. If only 2x more was necessary to avoid scratches that could make it worth 5x the price. :bigups

Cory
 
ccreamer said:
It wouldn't need to offer 5x more lubricity. If only 2x more was necessary to avoid scratches that could make it worth 5x the price.
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You're right - if it had 2X more then it could be worth it. I wonder if it does? :dunno
 
Like Steve said, QEW is not meant to be used in a spray bottle and S&W isn't meant to be used in a "2 Bucket Method". QEW is a superior wash than S&W, when you use it AS DIRECTED. That said, it's not a fair comparison. If you want to compare S&W to another product in a bottle, I suggest that you try Adam's Detail Spray. It works the same way S&W does. Some say it doesn't clean as well as S&W while others say it does. Some say that it is more like Poorboys' S&G. That's the fun part is finding out what works for you. Personally, I like all 3 that I mentioned above. If you haven't tried S&G or Adam's Detail Spray, you might want to put them on your list for your next order.
 
All I can say is I've used S&W for quite a while now along with some of my customer's. I personally used it on my BLACK Z71 Tahoe when it was dirty enough that I probably should'nt have and have had no problem's .

Good towel's and a gentle touch = no problem !!
 
I use QEW with the bucket method, followed by a light mist of S&W. Great combo. If my car is very dirty and, for some reason, I cannot wash with a hose, I will pre-treat the surface with a capful of QEW in a spraybottle just to get the dirt loosened prior to the QEW-bucket wash.
 
ACE said:
I use QEW with the bucket method, followed by a light mist of S&W. Great combo. If my car is very dirty and, for some reason, I cannot wash with a hose, I will pre-treat the surface with a capful of QEW in a spraybottle just to get the dirt loosened prior to the QEW-bucket wash.
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I tend do it the other way around, using S&W to soften up the dirt, then
follow up with the QEW.
 
Keep in mind that you are discussing two products that do a job in entirely different ways. You could probably argue the merits and advantages of them for days.

The things that have influenced my use:

QEW is a low water use product that doesn't leave an excess of water to worry about cleaning up when you are finished. That is good.

S&W is a no water use product that doesn't leave anything to worry about cleaning up when you are finished. IMO, that is better.

My vehicles haven't been QEW'd for a couple of years because of the ease of use of S&W. No buckets, just a spray bottle and a couple of MF towels.

I do go to the spray wash to knock off heavy dirt accumulations before using either QEW or S&W.

Choosing is no problem for me. S&W. :bigups :bigups :bigups

I do still bucket wash in the summer.

Charles
 
CharlesW said:
Keep in mind that you are discussing two products that do a job in entirely different ways. You could probably argue the merits and advantages of them for days.
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Yes, QEW was designed as a low water wash, but what I am/was hoping to find out is, can it be used as a spray & wipe? If so, is it equal, better, or worse than S&W?

Of course all of the religious Poorboy's users will not be able to objectively do the comparison, but I was hoping to hear from some others that have tried this or are willing to try it.

The engineer in me says we could do coefficient of friction tests on both products along with detergent ability tests (that is, test the ability of the product to encapsulate dirt and then lubricate its removal).

I'd like to be able to scientifically compare products rather than straying into the evagelistic anecdotal realm. What would be really nice is if Poorboy's did this test for us and declared their product superior for quantitative reasons. :)
 
GrussGott said:
I'd like to be able to scientifically compare products rather than straying into the evagelistic anecdotal realm. What would be really nice is if Poorboy's did this test for us and declared their product superior for quantitative reasons. :)
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Sorry we don't test our products against other products. We develop our products to do a job and meet my standards. Spray and Wipe was originally designed for use by Show vehicles and Street Rods, basically vehicles with exceptional finishes. Many of these people I have been dealing with for 20+ years hate the idea of using any water that can seep into areas they can't wipe or dry immediately. QEW on the other hand, was developed to be used on RV's where a couple buckets of water and the non-availability of car washes was the main idea. Being able to clean a RV at a campsite, and being cost effective at the same time. When you are on the road with your show vehicle staying at motels, and parking on show fields, there is only room for spray bottles not buckets. Thus as stated before you are comparing product made to be used in different ways. If you choose to deviate from the intended ways of using them, then you have to do your own testing:)
 
Poorboy said:
Sorry we don't test our products against other products. We develop our products to do a job and meet my standards.
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Fair enough! The great thing is to be able to talk directly to the source so thank you very much for your input.

The motivator for this thread is because people in winter climates need a way to wash their vechicles that uses little or no water but can cut through the salt and sand while keeping scratches to a minimum. In short, I can't bucket wash because it's too cold, but I want to wash! :jump

In that sense neither S&W nor QEW were designed with this purpose in mind. Any chance Poorboy's will consider designing a product to help us midwesters keep our cars looking great all winter long? :mohawk

That being said is there any type of technical data you would be willing to share about S&W and/or S&G? The reason is not to compare with other products, but just to get an idea of your design philsophy and why the products do what they do.

For example, you've done a great job explaining why you developed S&W, but was it designed to:

1.) Dissolve grease and dirt?
2.) Encapsulate dirt to enable frictionless removal thus preventing scratches?
3.) Provide dust/dirt repellants and/or protection?

Thanks!
 
GrussGott said:
In that sense neither S&W nor QEW were designed with this purpose in mind. Any chance Poorboy's will consider designing a product to help us midwesters keep our cars looking great all winter long? :mohawk
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From what I was explained to by my chemist is that you are looking for a miracle:lol If temperatures are below freezing, the only thing that won't freeze is some sort of alchohol, alchohol also strips off wax...so unless the temperature is above freezing nothing would really be a great solution. Above freezing temperatures, any of the products being discussed or a bucket wash can be used.

For example, you've done a great job explaining why you developed S&W, but was it designed to:

1.) Dissolve grease and dirt?
2.) Encapsulate dirt to enable frictionless removal thus preventing scratches?
3.) Provide dust/dirt repellants and/or protection?

Thanks!
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I think you already knew those answers:lmfao

except no protection in Spray and Wipe , where there is a small amount in S&G:)
 
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