Multi Product Paint Detail

[imported_Burlyq]

I had a guinee pig to test three sealants on his outdoor fishing truck. This was a paint detail only, I'm going back tommorow to finish up the trim. First, I owe some people some klasse love so I used AIO and SG on everything except the roof and the tailgate. I used WOWO and interesting enough ran into a problem that turned into a new way for me to use klasse.

When I finished the klasse sections I went back and noticed that I missed that D**M Sg residue. It was a dark rainy day so I put the SG on in the garage, and the scrub has no good garage light. He's forgiven afterall he's the one with the boat. So anyway I didn't have Sonus (my bad), so I used the AIO to take it off and I was pleasantly suprised at what AIO did to the final finish. It took about 15 minutes of elbow grease to get off the hood but it was like butter after. I used to think AIO would wipe off the SG but I know longer think that's the case, if done carefully. From now on I will use AIO over the SG, unless I have Sonus. I used a tad of AIO on a wet sponge, in fact i put AIO with the same sponge the first time. The apl. was wet so I just used a dab and did small sections of the hood.

http://imageevent.com/burlyq/trk?p=5&w=4&c=4&n=0&m=24&s=0&y=1&z=2&l=0



I was curious about Zaino w/o ZFX from the talk lately in the forums so I put one coat of z2 w/o zfx on the roof, and the only surface prep was p21s paint cleanser. I like using ZFX much better and will only try this as an experiment, but it turned out incredible. I used a wet apl. and just wiped the stuff on, let it sit an hour, and wiped off. It was a little messy so I needed Z6 to get extra off. The surface was like glass I really like the p21s/zaino combo. I don't know about durabilty issues but the immediate results were impressive.

Notice the trees on the hood, all klasse.



Anyone want to take a guess on what's on the tailgate?

This stuff is worth mentioning but it's not in the class of klasse or Zaino. Notice the lack of reflection but the deep gloss look. This stuff goes on thicker than anything I've ever tried and if I was going on vacation to salt water or snow states this is the product I would want on my car. It's like a triple coat of collinite. I did no surface prep on tailgate other than wash. That stuff is very forgiving and they say you can put it on top of any sealant, easy on easy off. Goes on anything (paint, windows, headlights, metal) except rubber/abs plastic. Having said that, it's messy, has a powder residue, and is too expensive. Also, if any of you ever try it do not buy their detailer, it's garbage, and wear gloves. He used a flash on the next pic so the reflection is better but not what the product looks like with naked eye.

If I could do something different I would have tried AIO with Zaino on the tailgate. I wish some of my friends didn't like that Glare stuff so much, I had to buy guru tests to talk them out of it, go figure. I would rather use zaino or klasse topped with a nuba. I don't usually mess around but once in a while it's fun to experiment.



EDITED FOR SUNDAY

I went back and did his wifes car to try AIO/Zaino on the brown trim and P21s/Zaino on the tan trim. This time I used ZFX with Z2 on the whole car with no topper. Either p21s or AIO are exellent cleaners to go under Zaino. I applied both cleaners w/o wiping them off with no more than a MF, then went to sealant. I can't say either is better than the other. If you have some imperfections you want covered I'd use the p21s, if you wanted a slightly deeper shine I'd use the AIO. Stoner Tire Spray on the tires.

 

[stevet]

I used to think AIO would wipe off the SG but I know longer think that's the case. From now on I will use AIO over the SG, unless I have Sonus.

[

This is the third thread you have mentioned this and it's total BS.

 

[imported_Burlyq]

This is the third thread you have mentioned this and it's total BS.

I'm not sure what the issue is but this was the case and I was pleased with the results. It is worth trying, and is my preference.

 

[stevet]

I'm not sure what the issue is but this was the case and I was pleased with the results. It is worth trying, and is my preference.

The issue is that there is know way that you applied AIO and didn't remove the SG. AIO is a very good cleaner. It would remove the SG with no problem at all.



AIO + SG + AIO = no SG. Sure the finish was nice, AIO leaves a great finish but there is no way any SG was left on there. I don't understand why you think that AIO didn't remove the SG?

 

[imported_Burlyq]

The issue is that there is know way that you applied AIO and didn't remove the SG. AIO is a very good cleaner. It would remove the SG with no problem at all.



AIO + SG + AIO = no SG. Sure the finish was nice, AIO leaves a great finish but there is no way any SG was left on there. I don't understand why you think that AIO didn't remove the SG?

It took fifteen minutes just to wipe the residue off. I have a soar shoulder to prove it. No way it took SG off with no problem, lol. Trust me the AIO/SG/AIO was MUCH thicker than the first coat of AIO. I too think AIO is a great product, I've re-ordered many times, but this was my finding. Now if you tried it and found something different than say so instead of just conjecture. I thought it would wipe off the SG too, and I have to reapply, But that didn't happen. I don't know what to tell you other than that. I'm going to follow the durabilty because we all know SG is a better protectant that AIO. Perhaps any other comments can have a more positive tone?

 

[jimmybuffit]

I highly recommend that you apply the SG much thinner. It has been said before: Just when you think you are not applying enough... that's about right.



As for the AIO over SG, nah, just doesn't make sense...



Jim

 

[imported_Burlyq]

I highly recommend that you apply the SG much thinner. It has been said before: Just when you think you are not applying enough... that's about right.



Jim

Your right I was trying something new and put the SG on with a damp sponge. I usually spray SG on a MF Apl, it works better. I did the hood first so I had put too much to start, but once I got going the sponge had a good amount of SG for the rest of the truck with little more added. I was experimenting with products and different applications because I was bored this weekend and I had vehicle to mess with.

 

[stevet]

I too think AIO is a great product, I've re-ordered many times, but this was my finding. Now if you tried it and found something different than say so instead of just conjecture. I thought it would wipe off the SG too, and I have to reapply, But that didn't happen. I don't know what to tell you other than that.

Tried AIO? It is my go to paint cleaner when I am going to use a sealant. I have seen it take off major oxidation. I have seen it remove minor marring. I have seen it clean up compounding haze. It's a very good cleaner.



Would you please explain to me how it is possible for a paint cleaner to do the things I stated above but not be aggressive enough to remove a layer of SG.

 

[Accumulator]

... I usually spray SG on a MF Apl, it works better. I did the hood first so I had put too much to start, but once I got going the sponge had a good amount of SG for the rest of the truck with little more added.

I too think you must be using *way* more SG than you need. If what you're doing now works for you, then that's cool with me. But if you want to use SG without any follow-up and/or hard work, just put it on a *lot* thinner.



When I tried the "sprayer" method (using a sprayer that sprayed a very fine mist) it delivered *far* more SG than I'd ever use on the applicator.



I've done *many* SG applications on some fairly large vehicles over quite a few years and my bottle of SG is still almost full. It takes me *far* less than an ounce to do the minivan; I doubt it takes *half* an ounce. There must only be a few ounces out of my bottle of SG after all this time. I put it on so thin you can't see it on the panels.

 

[imported_Larry A]

Ive got a sample from Mosca of AIO and SG. When I first got it I had to try it on my roof just to see what it could do, it came out super . Two weeks later I had the time to do the whole car . When I got to the roof you could see the AIO cutting off the SG. I had to go over the roof twice with AIO to get all the SG off . I used the wowo system on both products.

 

[imported_Burlyq]

I had to go over the roof twice with AIO to get all the SG off . I used the wowo system on both products.

That's what I'm talking about, it will take of SG but not like wiping water of a counter like some people are implying. I've heard of a couple of people using AIO to wipe of SG and never agreed with it before, but now it's an option. Whaddever floats your boat.

 

[sQuashed]

AIO over SG=wasteful !



But hey, Its your money to waste !!

 

[stevet]

Ive got a sample from Mosca of AIO and SG. When I first got it I had to try it on my roof just to see what it could do, it came out super . Two weeks later I had the time to do the whole car . When I got to the roof you could see the AIO cutting off the SG. I had to go over the roof twice with AIO to get all the SG off . I used the wowo system on both products.

There is no doubt that 2 applications of AIO will clean the surface better than 1 application. What burlyq is suggesting is something completley different.



If you read through his posts in this thread and a few other threads he is saying he will use AIO than SG and than AIO again. He thinks by doing this he will have a coat of AIO topped with SG and topped again by AIO. This is not only a waste of product it is a waste of time and makes no sense to me.



Lets say AIO doesn't completely remove the layer of SG (and I seriously doubt this is true) why would you want to goe AIO + SG + AIO? If the extra cleaning power of two applications of AIO is what he is after it would make more sense to go AIO x 2 than SG. I have done this several times with excellent results.

 

[Accumulator]

I played around with this AIO-over-SG thing on the MPV last weekend with results that mirror those of lawerencea's. So in Burleyq's defense I'll say that *very* gentle application of AIO over SG did not seem to fully remove the SG. A little *less* gentle application did seem to remove it.



But having just put more SG on most of the minivan, I just don't see the point either. KSG is (IMO) a very easy to use product if you put it on thinly. The MPV isn't exactly a small vehicle, and I sure didn't have to exert myself to get the SG on/off of it :nixweiss And no, I didn't use anywhere close to even a *half ounce* of SG to do the whole thing (well, I haven't redone the roof yet, still beading fine after *16* months). The amount it took didn't lower the level in the bottle enough for me to be able to discern it. Refining the "regular SG process" so that it's being done correctly seems preferable to adding another process that might have unwanted consequences (effects on the SG durability, expansion of the timeframe for a detail, etc.).



There's sorta a fine line between tweaking a process so it works better for you and finding ways to mitigate the effects of doing something "improperly". Fixing a mistake is good, but I'd rather not make the mistake in the first place. But yeah, whatever floats your boat.

 

[stevet]

I played around with this AIO-over-SG thing on the MPV last weekend with results that mirror those of lawerencea's. So in Burleyq's defense I'll say that *very* gentle application of AIO over SG did not seem to fully remove the SG. A little *less* gentle application did seem to remove it.

According to burlyq he applied so much pessure when applying AIO over SG that his shoulder was sore after wards. This is hardly a gentle application of AIO over SG. There is no way any SG was left on burlyq's car after that kind of effort.



Burlyq is recommending AIO + SG + AIO as a process. This is clearly is not how AIO and SG are intended to be used and goes against any type of detailing common sense.



Accumulator, whould you apply AIO than follow with SG and than follow with AIO as your process for using these products? If so what is your reasoning for doing so? Burlyq is the only person I have ever heard recommend using these products in that manner.



Too me it's the same as applying P21S GEPC than applying P21S Wax and then going over it all with GEPC again. You could use this example with any pre wax/sealant cleaner and LSP. Why would you want to apply a cleaner over your freshly applied LSP. It removes the LSP and makes applying the LSP a useless step.





I can't believe this process is actually being defended.

 

[imported_Burlyq]

According to burlyq he applied so much pessure when applying AIO over SG that his shoulder was sore after wards. This is hardly a gentle application of AIO over SG. There is no way any SG was left on burlyq's car after that kind of effort.



Burlyq is recommending AIO + SG + AIO as a process. This is clearly is not how AIO and SG are intended to be used and goes against any type of detailing common sense.



Accumulator, whould you apply AIO than follow with SG and than follow with AIO as your process for using these products? If so what is your reasoning for doing so? Burlyq is the only person I have ever heard recommend using these products in that manner.



Too me it's the same as applying P21S GEPC than applying P21S Wax and then going over it all with GEPC again. You could use this example with any pre wax/sealant cleaner and LSP. Why would you want to apply a cleaner over your freshly applied LSP. It removes the LSP and makes applying the LSP a useless step.





I can't believe this process is actually being defended.

First- I think why the results worked (in this case) had to do with the heavy amount of SG I used and the light amount of AIO, as opposed to how hard it was to get off. The reason why I even tried it was because of the bahad streaking left by the SG, once again my bad I put too much on. I had heard of people on THIS site who have tried this and it worked for them, so I TRIED IT. I figured I know it wasn't going to harm anything, at worst I'd just have to re-apply sg.

So now 2 people have said AIO wont just remove SG like wiping water off a counter like my new friend Stevet seams to be suggesting. And one thing to mention is that at least one of these people applied SG really "thin." AIO is a obviously will strip any sealant/wax in my experience but you do have to work it, it's not going to do the job of a true polish, it's a good chemical cleaner not an abbrasive. Maybe, Stevet isn't overestimating AIO but underestimating SG, a very durable sealant.

ALL I can say is that I went back and checked the hood over the next two days and the results were amazing. It appears the hood has better coverage than the sides. Bottom line is do what works for you, it's an individual process, and if I get in a bind messing around with SG like that again, I will do it again in a second. I prefer the spraying SG on a MF thinly, then wiping off, because it's less work, but once again the results were there either way.

The whole reason I posted in this forum was because I was messing around with products as opposed to a click-and-brag.

 

[stevet]

First- The reason why I even tried it was because of the bahad streaking left by the SG, once again my bad I put too much on.

I can understand using AIO to remove SG if you applied SG incorrectly and wanted to remove the SG. This makes sense. Where I have a problem is when you say the AIO did not remove the SG. Also you said in another thread that you would now do AIO by machine + SG by hand + AIO by hand. This does not make sense. Even if the AIO didn't remove all the SG (and I believe it did) the process of AIO + SG + AIO is not how these products are supposed to be used. The only reason to apply AIO after SG is to remove the SG. If you believe that you have a layer of AIO topped with SG and then topped again with AIO you are mistaken.

 

[imported_Burlyq]

I can understand using AIO to remove SG if you applied SG incorrectly and wanted to remove the SG. This makes sense. Where I have a problem is when you say the AIO did not remove the SG. Also you said in another thread that you would now do AIO by machine + SG by hand + AIO by hand. This does not make sense. Even if the AIO didn't remove all the SG (and I believe it did) the process of AIO + SG + AIO is not how these products are supposed to be used. The only reason to apply AIO after SG is to remove the SG. If you believe that you have a layer of AIO topped with SG and then topped again with AIO you are mistaken.

You've made your point let's put this one to bed, I'll even give you last word, I'm cool like that.

 

[Accumulator]

Accumulator, whould you apply AIO than follow with SG and than follow with AIO as your process for using these products? If so what is your reasoning for doing so? Burlyq is the only person I have ever heard recommend using these products in that manner...I can't believe this process is actually being defended.

No, *I* wouldn't do that; I do AIO once and then layer SG, no problems. But *if* I were having some insurmountable problem with any product, I'd try different things and I'd probably post about it. So other than repeatedly telling Burlyq he oughta put SG on thinner (and I'm sure he heard me the first time ), I'm willing to just say "whatever works for you" about this whole thing.



I just don't want us to jump down somebody's throat over outside-the-box stuff, we've lost too many valuable members here already this way (anybody remember Nick T.?)...