Menzerna Power Finish?

D

Desertfox66

New member
A friend asked me if I could help with his '97 Chevy Truck. He parks outside and tree sap is <strong class='bbc'>coating[/b] his vehicle. I've already clayed the truck to remove the existing surface contaminants and followed that up with two passes of PI 2 and the yellow cutting pad on the 7424. The problem is that the tree sap appears to have deeply pitted the paint.

Any and all suggestions are greatly appeciated.
 
First, use the 30X magnifier and you will most likely find that the clear is also cracked, plus the pits.



The allowable removable amount of clear is .3 (3/10th) of a mil of clearcoat.



The pits are deeper than that or you could not readily notice them.



Sounds like the only real repair is a trip to the bodyshop.



:eek:
 
My jetta suffered a similar problem with acid rain pitting at the dealership. I could notice the pits under multiple forms of lightning and I consulted professionals to determine what to do next. I learned that some of my pits were over .3 mil deep and could not be removed without sacrificing the integrity of the clear coat. Cutting the paint with a rotary would only remove the more shallow pits and minimize the appearance of the deeper ones. For my car, the risk of the rotary vs the minimal benefit helped me decide to try and 'hide' the issue rather than remove it. I treated the car for the acid and alkaline problems and then coated with AIO (7424), 5 coats of SG, and 2 coats of Blitz. The pits are very hard to see now:).



I would try and evaluate the damage before cutting with FI2 or any of the other abrasives recommended around here. That will also help set expectations regarding the results.



Steve
 
I kinda thought that might be the case, thanks Ron for the input.



I told my friend the bad news. We're going to try to make it as presentable as possible since he can't afford a new paint job right now.
 
During the first 15 minutes of the two day PrepExcellence Trainning course at Automotive International, we introduce the students to the 4 basics of all professions.



Education

Knowledge

Diagnoistic Skills

Process/Procedure



Without these, we are all just peeing into the wind.



These are the processes that all professionals go through on the way to enlightenment, Grasshopper.



Ketch







:eek:
 
.3 mils eh? that's qutie a bit when you think of toolmakers terms. Thats eleven thousandths of an inch. .011. A strain of hair is only 2 thou. .002. How thick is the clear normally??:confused:
 
Will vary by plant, model and material, but from a low on horizontal surface of 1.5 to 2 mil. Some apply an additional, but it does not provide additional protection, only depth of gloss.

Due to the clear being a polymer resin/catalized coating, only the top .5 mil has density and that is where the UV blockers are concentrated.

If you wish to see all the information on clears and various levels of the entire paint system, visit www.autoint.com and click onto Tech Tips section. Lots of tech photos with text to surf through.

Ketch

:up
 
Ron,



As part of a professional's keys to enlightenment, you might also add this adage, which we passed down in our medical training.



1. Watch One

2. Do One

3. Teach One



In other words, if you really want to know something, try teaching it to someone else.
 
After almost 50 years of doing this stuff, I am still amazed how much I learn by teaching.



It creates questions in one's mind, as you go through the teaching of the processes.



Like, why didn't I see that if this was done here, it would change what happens there.



But, unless one follows the first four basics, they never get to the higher level of diagnoistic abilities, just keep waiting for someone else to give them a "simple" answer.



I sometimes think that this attitude is due to the advertising community. "Just give them enough to make them want to spend money, don't question the whys or the whatfors."



As I have seen alot of, most don't want facts, they want easy , let them off the hook answers, that don't make them think.



Just a couple of thoughts.



Ketch



:eek:
 
Todd states this a good polish particularly for light colors. Why for light colors as opposed to dark? Todd, or anyone? :)
 
All polishes leave some degree (fineness) of marring. This one leaves marring that might become visible as hazing on darker colors. It's a tradeoff for the amount of cut you get. On darker colors, you may need a finer finishing polish that probably also doesn't provide as much cut. In that case, you may be looking at two steps to remove the same type of swirls/scratches/imperfections.
 
wfedwar said:
All polishes leave some degree (fineness) of marring. This one leaves marring that might become visible as hazing on darker colors. It's a tradeoff for the amount of cut you get. On darker colors, you may need a finer finishing polish that probably also doesn't provide as much cut. In that case, you may be looking at two steps to remove the same type of swirls/scratches/imperfections.
Click to expand...
Thanks. :)
 
07 z-oh-6 said:
Todd states this a good polish particularly for light colors. Why for light colors as opposed to dark? Todd, or anyone? :)
Click to expand...

Power Finish is a good polish, but it isn't my favorite polish in the Menzerna line up and I don't use it very often.

The reason is that it has less cut then SIP yet doesn't finish as well as 106fa. On light colored cars (because they reflect less light) the difference in finish quality isn't very evident. So it can be used as a 'one step' polish on a light colored car, particularly with a DA, and create a finish that is near perfect.

However on a dark colored car you will likely still have a very very very fine microhaze. If you want a better finish then usually a follow up with 106fa/85rd/FPII is warranted. So that locks you into a two step system.

If you are going to use a two step system then why not use something more aggressive in the first step (to remove more defects) such as SIP, then finish with a dedicated finishing polish. Unless you are working with near perfect paint and do not need anything more aggressive then Power Finish (you need the exact amount of cut PF delievers) but then you could always use SIP on a finer pad and achieve less aggressive results.

I think Power Finish is a great product in it's niche, as a pretty powerful one step polish that still produces a very nice finish. I do believe that I get a better finish when I follow up with a dedicated final polish.
 
wfedwar said:
All polishes leave some degree (fineness) of marring. This one leaves marring that might become visible as hazing on darker colors. It's a tradeoff for the amount of cut you get. On darker colors, you may need a finer finishing polish that probably also doesn't provide as much cut. In that case, you may be looking at two steps to remove the same type of swirls/scratches/imperfections.
Click to expand...
:iagree:


This is what I was trying to say before words got in my way. :notworthy:
 
So lets say I used SIP with an orange pad on a light colored vehicle with soft paint. If I used a white pad on the same vehicle with power finish, SIP/orange would give me more cut, yet finish nearly the same? This would be using a Flex 3401.
 
07 z-oh-6 said:
So lets say I used SIP with an orange pad on a light colored vehicle with soft paint. If I used a white pad on the same vehicle with power finish, SIP/orange would give me more cut, yet finish nearly the same? This would be using a Flex 3401.
Click to expand...

SIP would give you more cut but Power Finish would leave you a better finish. However, I think in both cases (for the 'best' finish possible) a final polish would still improve the finish.

If you used SIP/Orange or PF/White first, then went to a final polish like 85rd, you would have the same final finish. (This is assuming that 85rd removes the slightly deeper marks that SIP/Orange would leave behind, which it has always done for me).

But SIP/Orange would have removed more of the deeper defects (if you had them).

 
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