Make sure you're seated before viewing

I'd hold off on the rotary, especially if you've never used a PC (or are scared of the PC)...I've been using a PC since about 1997, and was trained on the Rotary from 1991 - 1994 (many years of practice)....that said, I *rarely* use the rotary, simply because it's too easy to make a mistake.



I'd rather spend extra time with the PC knowing there's a high safety margin than trying to whip through it with the rotary...the PC (from my experience, as well as many other's experiences) can accomplish about 95% of what the rotary can. It just takes a little longer, and you have to use the right products and correct pads (much like the rotary).



The rotary is to detailing as the Gatling Gun is to sharpshooting. In the proper hands, the Gatling could probably "split a hair", but in reality it's much too easy to go wild and mow down the entire neighborhood.
 
Brad,



WOW! Those are some real nasty swirls BUT all is not lost my friend.



First, since your car is black I would not use the PC nor the Cyclo with cutting pads because they won't help all that much. The PC and the Cyclo are great for final polishing and waxing but if you use an abrasive cleaner with the cutting pads then you will remove some of the linear scratches yet only introduce fine circular scratches, much like what you have in your picture.



Many may disagree with my above prognosis but that's cool. If I were doing your car I would use a rotary with a polishing pad (cutting pad ONLY if the polishing pad fails) and a leveler at 1800 rpm's. This first step would take hours but it would dramatically reduce those swirls. From there I would then use another polishing pad with Light Cut at 1500 rpm's, finishing pad with Menzerna Final Polish at 1000 rpm's, then either the PC or the Cyclo with Final Polish.



Too bad I am here in South Texas and you are up North. If you ever come out this way let me know.



Anthony



PS- If the weather is good, God willing, I am suppossed to do a black Ferrari tomorrow and I'll take some before and after pics. The swirls on the Ferrari are not horrible but they aren't pretty either.
 
geekysteve said:
I'd hold off on the rotary, especially if you've never used a PC (or are scared of the PC)...I've been using a PC since about 1997, and was trained on the Rotary from 1991 - 1994 (many years of practice)....that said, I *rarely* use the rotary, simply because it's too easy to make a mistake.



I'd rather spend extra time with the PC knowing there's a high safety margin than trying to whip through it with the rotary...the PC (from my experience, as well as many other's experiences) can accomplish about 95% of what the rotary can. It just takes a little longer, and you have to use the right products and correct pads (much like the rotary).



The rotary is to detailing as the Gatling Gun is to sharpshooting. In the proper hands, the Gatling could probably "split a hair", but in reality it's much too easy to go wild and mow down the entire neighborhood.
Click to expand...



Exactly what I was going to say only Geezer said it better. I don't know why the PC gets a bad wrap. You can do nearly everything a rotary can do with a PC except melt your paint off and create hologram swirls. ;) They are pretty safe tools. I took the swirls off a car this week that were at least as bad as those. At least. With the right products anything is possible. It may take some Diamond Cut to get you started and then graduate down through a couple abrasive levels to get them all out but I wouldn't ever say its an impossible job for a PC.
 
This looked pretty nasty before we started, terrible water damage and alot of swirls.

It had been repainted and generally looked a bit rough.



Applied PC knowledge + AIO etc ....



All Jngrbrds's own work !



:xyxthumbs



blackmerc.jpg
 
Holy cow! :eek: :scared :shocked



No wonder Acrylicwerks didn't fix that! No "one step" miracle product could be aggressive enough to fix it.



Just my guess, but it seems that pic was taken at very close range. I think the "waves" may be some orange peel effect? :nixweiss



You need to get over your fear of the PC and start polishing! I can't imagine the PC causing that sort of damage unless you somehow went with a hideously aggressive combo and then had a seizure while you did it or something. :D
 
Brad,



One of the first vehicles I ever detailed after I got my PC had similar swirls, and cleaned up wonderfully with one pass of 3M Finesse-It II and a cutting pad (click the link to the thread with before/after pics): http://www.autopia.org/forums/showthread.php?threadid=3776&highlight=supercrew



We followed it up with one coat of Z5. No glazes, no fillers, no rotary. I think too many people discount what the PC is really capable of when used with more agressive products and pads; it just takes a much longer time to achieve the same result as compared to a rotary (the same reason why it's much safer).



I'm going to reiterate what 4DSC said; grab a PC and go to it!



Tort
 
Actually, Acrylicwerks should have fixed the damage according to them by removing the "dead" paint as Mark calls it.



I really appreciate all of the input. Now I need to get motivated and start to work on it. I have a scar revision surgery next week so while I'm in pain I will get everything together that I need so that I can begin work on the problem. I will take pictures and post updates.



Thanks again.

Brad
 
Smoker said:
I've used a PC to take out some pretty nasty marks, including uber-swirls, buffing marks from some loony with a rotary and a wool pad and fairly bad scratches.



You just have to be brave, use a cutting pad and something agressive like Diamond Cut.



Because a PC doesnt generate the heat that a rotary does, the abrasive actions of these products are stepped down quite a bit.



Hence I was asking if I moved up to rotary work, I would prolly have to rethink my abrasives usage.



I would certainly give it a go with a PC and some Diamond Cut, I've yet to cause any damage with that combination.



Did a maroon 2000 Intrepid with that today in fact.



Came out nice!
Click to expand...



PC and diamond cut can cause damage. You can cause damage with your hand motion and diamond cut. I would not recomend diamond cut until you feel good using the pc
 
Hello all.



Just to clarify, that photo is a closeup of the area of paint that runs down the driver's side of the car. It is between the back seat driver's side window and the rear glass. It is about 6 - 8 inches wide I would guess and tapers as it reaches the roof.



Brad
 
BradNC said:
Hello all.



Just to clarify, that photo is a closeup of the area of paint that runs down the driver's side of the car. It is between the back seat driver's side window and the rear glass. It is about 6 - 8 inches wide I would guess and tapers as it reaches the roof.



Brad
Click to expand...



You mean it is the sail in the 1/4 panel. It runs from the 1/4 panel up into the roof and then to the front windshield..



That is one of the most difficult areas to remove swirls. The sun always hits that area and it is already on an angle so it stands out more.
 
NY detailer said:
PC and diamond cut can cause damage. You can cause damage with your hand motion and diamond cut. I would not recomend diamond cut until you feel good using the pc
Click to expand...



I guess that makes me 'pretty good' with a PC then.



Cheers!





:xyxthumbs
 
They are all over the car where I used the PC and cyclo. Perhaps I didn't let the product work enough before stopping.



Brad
 
This is a picture of a black Ferrari front fender. I was suppossed to detail it today but rain the better part of this morning made that a wash out.



So later in the afternoon I headed over to see the Ferrari and ended up washing several cars, which is a good thing:up



I did not have the time to fully detail it but I did do a small portion of the front fender. Now the swirls in the paint are light when compared to Brad's but I just wanted to show real quick what can be done.



The AFTER pic is just after an application of a leveler and a polishing pad at 1800 rpms.



I did not have time to polish it out further but one can see a dramatic improvement (I hope) with just the first step. 2 or 3 passes on Brads car and I am confident the results would be the same.
 
Hey Brad!

Your PM box is full. I did try and send another one to you. Here is the PM:



"Brad,



Why don't you try a spot where the swirls are the worst, and try the PC on #5 with DACP and really work it in. See what happens. If it does not come out, a rotary is the next step. To me, I am pretty sure, though hard to tell from a picture, that you can remove those swirls with a rotary if you can't with the PC!! :)

Try the PC on Sat. and then let me know." Just PM me!



Tim
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top