Local detailer ditched the PC for SMR work

Tarios

Tarios

Detailing=Artwork
Well a 'friend' that has a decent shop near my home told me that the PC does not remove swirl marks..I was trying to get some info off him-He's a big 3M user and so I wanted to now what he uses etc.

Anyhow..I was watching some of his staff work on a BMW..
They were polishing with a DeWalt rotary - black foam polishing pad and using 3M foam pad glaze 5996 -for dark cars)

Then I see one guy pull out the PC and start applying a pink liquid poilsh-wax..not sure which one.

Is he write..Do I really need to get a rotary to remove fine scratches? Does the PC have the capability to do it as well??

And my real concern is WHY would you polish a car with a rotary??\
I know the 3M line has glazes etc and a lot of shops I have seen, use the rotary to polish-but won't that leave a lot of sawirls, even on low speed..

I want to try a rotary on some old vehciles-or car parts...
I'm really curious to see how it works...
 
Re: Local detailer ditched the PC for SMR

Tarios said:
Well a 'friend' that has a decent shop near my home told me that the PC does not remove swirl marks..I was trying to get some info off him-He's a big 3M user and so I wanted to now what he uses etc.

Anyhow..I was watching some of his staff work on a BMW..
They were polishing with a DeWalt rotary - black foam polishing pad and using 3M foam pad glaze 5996 -for dark cars)

Then I see one guy pull out the PC and start applying a pink liquid poilsh-wax..not sure which one.

Is he write..Do I really need to get a rotary to remove fine scratches? Does the PC have the capability to do it as well??

And my real concern is WHY would you polish a car with a rotary??\
I know the 3M line has glazes etc and a lot of shops I have seen, use the rotary to polish-but won't that leave a lot of sawirls, even on low speed..

I want to try a rotary on some old vehciles-or car parts...
I'm really curious to see how it works...
Click to expand...

A PC can do about as good of a job as a rotory, it's just going to take a lot longer. I use a rotory on everything except fine swirls, mostly using the PC for final polish and wax application. A rotory can put a better gloss on paint I believe. I don't think one is better than the other and any serious detailer should have both.
 
If you are going to get a rotary be careful and get plenty of practice on a car you dont care about. You can really do some paint damage if you dont know what you are doing.
 
To say flat out the PC does not remove swirl marks is incorrect. It can be true in certain situations but it's also not true in others.

The right combination of specific pads and products dpending on the type ( mfr) and condition of the paint all play a role in successfully doing so as does the technique of the operator.
 
I agree with Shotime when he said
I don't think one is better than the other and any serious detailer should have both.
Click to expand...
I own both, and I think the PC compliments my rotary very well. There are just too many areas where the PC is the tool for the job. That's just one mans opinion, good or bad.
 
The Cyclo is a good choice when you want to refrain from the rotary but need more "bite" than the PC.
 
Oh I know about getting practice..
I intend on getting one next year and practicing on some old car panels that I may get from a friends garage or scrap yards..

I know the PC has doen GREAT work for me...that is definite.
However I can't get over my last job..
I did a Toyota 2003 4runner. Dark Grey..
It was scratched from bumper to bumper-roof to tires..Owner doesn't know why or how..
I think it was just due to some bad washing habits and bad waxing skills..
Anyhow..I used the RG lelving compound-it did nothing..
On to the 3M R.C 1500grit swirl remover-this thing (NOT BODY SHOP SAFE) has silic in it..and therefore I don't like using it..but when I do I wear a full filtered face mask..anyhow..this thing made BIG difference but I was still able to see those fine line scratches...

These fine scrtahces and for that matter-I assume all the fine swirls and lines that a PC or a Rotory will remove are ALL on the clear coat..right?

I mean under that is the paint-and we don't really 'compound/buff/polish/wax' the actual paint do we??
What we are perfecting and worikng on, is the clear layer...am correct in thinking that...
 
OI812 said:
I agree with Shotime when he said I own both, and I think the PC compliments my rotary very well. There are just too many areas where the PC is the tool for the job. That's just one mans opinion, good or bad.
Click to expand...

Ok I see what your saying..

Personally I think my local dealer friend there, just tried to disocurage me..I showed him some pics of my latest work-some were actually posted here on DC- and he said something like..
"oh well all black clean cars look good in a pictrure..."
I said "what are you saying, that these jobs aren't good??"
He said "no" but that black is hard to work and that you need a rotory to get the swirls and fine line out...
And that a PC (orbital) won't be enough..

Anyhow..I'm going there next week for some rust proofing and I'll pick his brain a little more ;)
 
Tarios said:
Ok I see what your saying..

Personally I think my local dealer friend there, just tried to disocurage me..I showed him some pics of my latest work-some were actually posted here on DC- and he said something like..
"oh well all black clean cars look good in a pictrure..."
I said "what are you saying, that these jobs aren't good??"
He said "no" but that black is hard to work and that you need a rotory to get the swirls and fine line out...
And that a PC (orbital) won't be enough..

Anyhow..I'm going there next week for some rust proofing and I'll pick his brain a little more ;)
Click to expand...

Sounds like a case of sour grapes to me!

"oh well all black clean cars look good in a pictrure..."

He has a time line to finish his details, on my personal black vehicle I don't. I can produce almost as good a finish with a pc as a rotary. I can get more gloss with a rotary, but scratch removal or marring can be done with both. Just take longer with PC. IMO there is a big difference to being a clean looking black vehicle, as versus a slick or smooth, swirl free finish WITH OUT FILLERS. QUALITY, NOT QUANTITY. I am not a full time detailer, so if it takes me a little longer to produce a better job, then so be it. In the end it is my personal name on the job, not a companies. His reputation is not on the line, and frankly he probably doesn't care.

It is my opinion that you are probably doing a better job then him, maybe not as fast, but better and it is probably pissing him off. Just one man opinion, take it for what it's worth.
 
OI812 said:
Sounds like a case of sour grapes to me!

"oh well all black clean cars look good in a pictrure..."

He has a time line to finish his details, on my personal black vehicle I don't. I can produce almost as good a finish with a pc as a rotary. I can get more gloss with a rotary, but scratch removal or marring can be done with both. Just take longer with PC. IMO there is a big difference to being a clean looking black vehicle, as versus a slick or smooth, swirl free finish WITH OUT FILLERS. QUALITY, NOT QUANTITY. I am not a full time detailer, so if it takes me a little longer to produce a better job, then so be it. In the end it is my personal name on the job, not a companies. His reputation is not on the line, and frankly he probably doesn't care.

It is my opinion that you are probably doing a better job then him, maybe not as fast, but better and it is probably pissing him off. Just one man opinion, take it for what it's worth.
Click to expand...

Well to back you up on your correct hypothesis ;)
Last year I brtought him my black truck-Done only with Zaino-and he really freaked out on it..and that was without half the prep work that I now know I should've done..
I think I have improved quite a ways..and I can honestly feel his hesitance to answer my questions... :duel ;)
but that's really fine..I can understand that too..I am no way going to take any of his customers..he has a full blown shop and all..I'm just starting this as a side line in my own garage, primarily because I like doing it..and secondly I think I do a very good job for the price a charge..
 
Yea, and that is probably pissing him off. Why don't the two of you go to a detailing contest--winner takes all :bigups And yes that comment on the black vehicle did strike a nerve. I work damn hard to keep my black vehicle looking good. It gets notice allot, so when someone make a comment like that it really ticks me off. I need a beer just to calm down :drunk
 
OI812 said:
Yea, and that is probably pissing him off. Why don't the two of you go to a detailing contest--winner takes all :bigups And yes that comment on the black vehicle did strike a nerve. I work damn hard to keep my black vehicle looking good. It gets notice allot, so when someone make a comment like that it really ticks me off. I need a beer just to calm down :drunk
Click to expand...
Well this is one of the pics I had in the mini-album..
100_5861.jpg

I think he just should've said at least said "not bad" you know..
Anyway...thansk for all the tips buds..
 
Bill D said:
To say flat out the PC does not remove swirl marks is incorrect. It can be true in certain situations but it's also not true in others.

The right combination of specific pads and products dpending on the type ( mfr) and condition of the paint all play a role in successfully doing so as does the technique of the operator.
Click to expand...


:yeah

Go here to see all the swirls I didn't remove with my PC:)
 
blkyukon said:
Go here to see all the swirls I didn't remove with my PC:)
Click to expand...

Very nice work! Too bad there's no product list with the pics.

That red Miata is the one you used PB's ProPolish on?
 
Big Leegr said:
Very nice work! Too bad there's no product list with the pics.

That red Miata is the one you used PB's ProPolish on?
Click to expand...


Thanks!

Yeah, I usually use only use those pictures for people that want to see my work, but I've changed the layout and I'll be adding mopre pictues and products used.


Yes, that is the same Miata
 
May I remind everyone that this is the *Professional* Detailers Forum.

Comments to date have been just a little naive... oh, rookies are welcome, but some of the blanket statements being made here are just simply naive.

The PC is important and valuable, the rotary is necessary for deeper imperfections... knowing what to use, and when...

ah, that's a Pro...

Jim
 
blkyukon said:
:yeah

Go here to see all the swirls I didn't remove with my PC:)
Click to expand...


He he I said the PC can do so *depending* on a number of factors, no, its not a guarantee I also haven't been able to remove them with a PC in situations but there are also times I have. The alcohol/Prep All wipe confirmed this.

The pros at Meguiars for example do not frown upon the PC in attempt to remove defects. I hope its understood its not meant that it is a replacement/substitute for a rotary.
 
jimmybuffit said:
May I remind everyone that this is the *Professional* Detailers Forum.

Comments to date have been just a little naive... oh, rookies are welcome, but some of the blanket statements being made here are just simply naive.

The PC is important and valuable, the rotary is necessary for deeper imperfections... knowing what to use, and when...

ah, that's a Pro...

Jim
Click to expand...


hear, hear.
 
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