light "wash" induced scratches, do I really need compound?

I

imported_Brock

New member
Howdy all,



New car brings me back to this awesome forum and I have a couple of questions.



Car is an '07 BMW 328i, Jet Black. Love black cars but lots of work....haha

After it's first bath at home and Klasse AIO I notice it has a bunch of scratches which look like they're from a poor washing pattern(dealer wax must have filler to cover those). I think the dealer uses some crappy brushes to wash the cars(sad on a nice, new car).

I really hate to polish my brand new car already but I want to get it looking new before I seal and wax again. I ordered new wash/dry/buffing towels to keep further scratches to a minimum.



Anyway, my question is if I need to order a compound or not. I just picked up a PC 7335 and this will be my first use of an orbital. Previously, by hand, I noticed how ineffective polish/swirl removal is. Usually left more of a haze even if the scratches were lessened.

So, I'm odering Optimum polish and some pads. I'm wondering if that will be sufficient to get the scratches out? Like using an orange pad if a blue doesn't get all the scratches out. Or if I'll really need to get a compound like OC or OHC to get 'em all out.



You can't feel the scratches and they don't appear to be very deep. You can only see them in sunlight or under my garage florescents and viewing the paint close up from an angle. You have to be within a foot or so and look at the paint at a steep angle to see the scratches(I'd take pictures but my cam sucks).



Most people wouldn't notice the scratches and wouldn't do anything about them but it bugs me on a nice new black car. I know I have a rough road ahead of me keeping it looking great and I want to get off to the right start.



Also, another question is about polishing the fenders. I've read a lot about orbital technique and have a decent grasp but I'm wondering what's the safest bet on round surfaces like fenders? I know you're supposed to keep the pad as flat as possible, which is hard to do on a fender. Any tips?



Sorry for the long post. Any advice is much appreciated.
 
I doubt OP will really move defects on miserable black BMW paint. About polishing the fenders, it's only really with a rotary do you have to keep the pad flat, with a PC you can tilt or angle it and it won't do any damage. And I have found that OP on a polishing pad leaves noticable micromarring on this paint, so you should pick up some FPII(Menzerna) as well.
 
If the swirls are really minimal I would try hand polish. An 07 car would not need orbital, IMO. I could be wrong.
 
i would really hope it didn't need buffing since the car is so new but the scratches really bother me. The problem I've had with hand polishing before is it leaves the paint hazy. From what I've read this is usually due to the compound not breaking down into finer particles.



OP really leaves micromarring? what about if you finish up with OP on a green pad? they make it sound like OP is a great final polish before your LSP....

I don't mind using two products, one to get scratches out and a second to remove marks from that. I just don't want to buy a ton of different products or abuse my car more than I need to.



Thanks
 
Dont feel like your the only one with swirls on a new car...lots of people get it (mostly from the dealer washing it). I wouldn't get so worried about it but then again I'm not sure how bad it is. If the swirls are spaced within a third of an inch of each other, not a big deal, but if they are within a few milimeters of each other than that needs some work. If I were you, I wouldn't touch anything on the car until you feel you have enough knowledge to do it right. This board is a GREAT place, everyone like to help. I dont have much to offer you on the right method to remove the swirls, as I'm new too, but keep browsing (I know its tedious), but you feel really good when you know what you're doing.



BTW, I would strongly advise against buffing a brand new car (with a machine)...It's really unneccessary.
 
BMW335i said:
Dont feel like your the only one with swirls on a new car...lots of people get it (mostly from the dealer washing it). I wouldn't get so worried about it but then again I'm not sure how bad it is. If the swirls are spaced within a third of an inch of each other, not a big deal, but if they are within a few milimeters of each other than that needs some work. If I were you, I wouldn't touch anything on the car until you feel you have enough knowledge to do it right. This board is a GREAT place, everyone like to help. I dont have much to offer you on the right method to remove the swirls, as I'm new too, but keep browsing (I know its tedious), but you feel really good when you know what you're doing.



BTW, I would strongly advise against buffing a brand new car (with a machine)...It's really unneccessary.
Click to expand...





I feel like this is an understatment, every black car I see and dark cars also have swirls. Unless you are a detailer of course :)
 
They aren't really light swirl marks either. I was back out in the garage again and I can actually see some of the scratches straight on.

I need to get a good halogen spot for detailing, that's for sure. It's been really dark and rainy here for the last couple weeks.

It's not just like regular swirls from washing, I'd expect that. The scratches aren't super close together like accumulated swirls but some are very heavy. I think the stupid car washers at the dealer use those washing brushes with bristles.



I don't know, maybe I'm being anal and I should just leave them alone...naw, that won't happen.



I appreciate the advice so far. Anyone have experience with this on a new car?
 
I have some Meguiars #9 I suppose I could try also. I still think I'd use that with the orbital rather than by hand.

If I ordered OC or OHC as a backup and tried #9 first, would #9 be a good replacement for OP?



Thanks
 
BMW335i said:
BTW, I would strongly advise against buffing a brand new car (with a machine)...It's really unneccessary.
Click to expand...



I completely disagree. The age of the car has nothing to do with the condition of its paint, and if you have swirls, the only way to get rid of them would be to buff them out. Particularly on the harder BMW clear, trying to polish swirls out without a machine would be an exercise in futility.



Buffing with a PC is completely safe. With the 6.5" and bigger pads, it's practically impossible to cause finish damage. Start with your lightest polish and a polishing pad and go at it, move up in agressiveness if you need to. You'll be happy you did.
 
BMW335i said:
BTW, I would strongly advise against buffing a brand new car (with a machine)...It's really unneccessary.
Click to expand...



Why not? Seriously, give me one good reason why we shouldn't buff out a new car if it has defects. Even if the defects were very mild, a mild finishing polish will burnish the paint to a higher gloss than it was before, with out removing hardly any clear. I buffed out(pretty agressively, I may add) a 2 month old BMW that had nasty defects, and is there anything wrong with that?



Anyways, in my experience, BMW black is really finiky in that it is hard to correct defects, yet hard to finish out without micromarring. Also, this paint marrs very easily, even the softest MFs will marr it. I hate working BMW black with a passion, just terrible paint.



Yes, OP *will* leave micromarring, noticable in direct sun and under halogens. I would say get the entire Optimum polish range, and some Menzerna for finishing out. I would first try OP on a cutting pad, and step it up from there.
 
BMW335i said:
If the swirls are really minimal I would try hand polish. An 07 car would not need orbital, IMO. I could be wrong.
Click to expand...

HAND POLISH ARE YOU NUTS...... I just used my dewalt high speed on a 06 Roles Royce And the guy just paid $225k for it a week before. I have never done anything by hand. One) it takes to long. and two) its to much effort for little results. Learn how to use the tools and creat hot looking rides. Just my 2 cents worth.........LOL
 
Bigpoppa may I suggest that you go to http://www.1car-detailing-training.com

He put together the training program used by BMW of North America. he also help formulate the Optimum polish and compound. thats all he uses I fly over 3000 miles for his two day class and it was the best $$$ i have ever spent. I made up the cost in the trip in new accounts and dealerships pay me Full retail because the cars look that good. just check him out!!
 
Mr Magic, am I correct to guess that means Optimum works well with BMW paint?



Bigpoppa, thank you for the suggestions. I might go with OP and Menzerna. I don't have unlimited funds at the moment so I'd like to keep it down to buying two products right now(in addition to the PC, towels and pads I'm buying).



Anything else besides Menzerna that would be a good polish to remove micro marring on my car after polishing? I'd hate to get rid of the scratches only to be stuck with micromarring. That's what happened the last time I tried polishing a car(black VW). Got the scratches lessened but left the paint hazy. This was by hand though.



I just want my paint to look better than it does now, don't want to introduce more defects.



Thanks all!
 
Brock, I worked on a 2002 white 325i with the worse looking scratches you can imagine. They were only in the clear coat however - just looked like someone cleaned bird poop off with a brillo pad. At the time, all I had was a PC, a wool pad, Meg's #84 and a lot of determination. I had to hold the PC over the scratches with the it screaming on 6 with about 25-35 pounds of force - and I held it there for a minute. OK, before the masters come out screaming - I did this with the owners permission, he was ready to have the car repainted and told me to go for it. Well, it worked. I have to say the #84 with the oil of Olay or whatever Meg's adds to it worked good. Now that I have Makita rotary, I would have used a LC yellow pad and a lot less pressure. Never used Menzerna or OP and I'm not that big of a Meg's fan, but I was impressed with that #84.
 
one more question. is it absolutely a no-no to use the same pad with more than one product? I would thoroughly clean first, of course.

I want to make sure I have what I need but I have to be frugal as well.
 
Thanks June bug. I was considering the Meguiar's route as well. I'd heard that DACP and some of the 80 series worked pretty well.

I've used lots of Meguiars in the past and been pretty happy.



I'd just read how well the Optimum products work and how easy they are to use.



If Meguiars products really work that would be great, I can obtain those locally.

Either way, I just want whatever will work best. Rather buy it once than keep trying new stuff all the time.
 
You may need something stronger than OP. And yes, Menzerna is the only product I have found that does some mild correction(removes haze and light swirling from other products), yet still finishes down perfect on this paint. I am sure there are others, but that is what I have had sucess with.
 
Pick up some OC and FPII, when using OC on a polishing pad, it isn't all that agressive, and when you step it up to a cutting pad it should correct the paint. FPII has a bit less cut than OP, but finishes down better, IMO. If it were me, I would get OC and FPII, and be done with it.
 
Mr. Magic said:
HAND POLISH ARE YOU NUTS...... I just used my dewalt high speed on a 06 Roles Royce And the guy just paid $225k for it a week before. I have never done anything by hand. One) it takes to long. and two) its to much effort for little results. Learn how to use the tools and creat hot looking rides. Just my 2 cents worth.........LOL
Click to expand...



Relax, I said I was new here and just look at my post count. I was TRYING to give the best advice I could but apparently I need to do some more researching.



Not many people are confident enough with using a POWER TOOL on a brand new car...
 
Thanks for all the feedback.

I wouldn't even consider trying out a rotary on my new car for the first time but from what I've learned the PC appears to be a relatively safe tool.



I think I'll order some pads and try picking some polishing products.
 
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