klasse vs. zaino (yawn)

S

svanderbilt

New member
i had been a visitor of the autopia forums in it's various forms for 3 years or so. not until a few months ago there was NO fighting about which product was better.



talk about beating a dead horse. now it's zaino vs. klasse on a daily basis. and now they're trying to be cute by attacking klasse in a roundabout way. i'm sure we appreciate the surely unbiased research on klasse from a handful of zaino users, but it's just so damn old now. sheeting/beading, half a bottle of dawn to remove klasse. it's strange that this product (klasse) has been made for over a decade now or more, and it's just within the last few months (less than 6) that people have been having problems with it. i've been using klasse for years with no problems.



i guess this is where the terms "zaino zombies" and "zaino zealots" have come from. who really cares in the end? why don't you zaino guys give up your crusade, and let the products sell themselves. that's what klasse has been doing for years, with no website, no contact info, and no agents posting propaganda about the competition on detailing boards.



it doesn't even matter what you use, anyway. it's all in the skill of the detailer, and the time put into the car. the products are only a portion of the equation. when you get up to the quality of mothers/meguiars/klasse/zaino/3m/wizards/one grand, etc, it's all essentially irrelevant.



instead of making every damn thread a product dispute, why not talk about techniques, or anything else for christs sake. does one have to mention "zaino" in every post? are you getting paid by the "z"?



it's a shame that just a few kiddies had to come over here and pee in our pool; it was so nice for years before that.
 
Although the amount of Zaino "propoganda" on this board is pretty high, I would have to say the same thing about Klasse! Both products obviously have their "camps" and some people here use almost a "salesman's" attitude to get their point across.



It is too bad. But, instead of leaving the forum or just lurking, why not try and resurrect the board to its old standards?
 
in all honesty, alot of the klasse rhetoric is being done in self-defense. one can only be kicked in the groin so many times before it's time to kick back.



as for the board and it's "old standards", i don't know whose quote this is; you can never go home again.



i just feel sorry for those who didn't have the chance to experience the fun and camaraderie that was the autopia of yesteryear.
 
Well, it is too bad that people need to defend the products they use..but this is human nature.



But, on a more positive note, I enjoy this forum and am still learning plenty every day! True, like 50% of the threads are Klasse vs. Zaino (to some extent), which can be quite :o , but there still seems to be quite a good amount of valuable opinion and factual exchange on detailing.



So, again, maybe you can change the flavor of the board?! Start posting...especially advanced topics!
 
It's getting to the point that I'm almost afraid to admit I like a product. Sorry... I doubt that anybody here boosting any product has any financial gain to be made at all, at least to speak of. I know I don't. Many of these threads that you mention start out by somebody basically saying "Hey, I'm thinking of doing X but was wondering..." I for one would love somebody to send me a message like "You were right - I love it! Thanks..." That, I think, is 95% of the motivation.



Anyway, this is just for fun so don't flame me!



Hey everybody! For great results: You need to prepare your paint. There are so many ways to do that, I really don't want to slight any one of them so I won't mention any. Then, wash your car with (deleted). Dry using (deleted) and be careful not to wipe in (deleted) directions... Then apply some sealant or wax stuff, it matters not what. Make sure you do it right, or it won't work for some mysterious reason - but we really don't want to go into all of that. Then, wipe it off using a (deleted) and QD at (deleted) intervals, using a (deleted).

:)
 
I always said that I would not post anything negative on this website, but now that the genie is out of the bottle, I have to put in my 2 cents.

I have been frequenting this site less of late, and it is because of some of the tactics some folks have been using on this site.

I also am quite tired of the high pressure sales tacitic of some members. If a product doesn't work for you, DON'T USE IT!

Never mind the multiple posts that beat a product in the ground. If it doesn't work for you, say so, tell us why, and move on!

None of this negativity is good for the members of this forum, and surely isn't a positive for the new members.

I will in the future continue to learn from all our family on the Forum, and continue to try and help all the newbies on the site.

So let everyone have their say, and let's get on with the fun of detailing our vehicles and sharing our information. For me enuf' said!



Welcome back Beau, I'm damn glad that you have decided to rejoin us! Enjoy!
 
I have been a daily reader of this board since I found it in June of this year. It is a great source for information and people willing to help, advise and support of others who have an interest in keeping their cars in prime condition. I hope any negative posts or coments does cause anyone to leave or not contribute their knowledge and experience. I am a novice in this field so I do not post much but I enjoy reading the advice given to others so as to improve my detailing ablities. Thanks to all those who do post for the benefit of others.



Thank you
 
Welcome back beau:) , im sory to so clearly see your animosity towards the board but it isnt all that bad. Yes we have some people whose porogative is to simply shootdown/promote (inderectly in some cases) klasse or zaino ect. Is it boring and tedious, yes, earth shattering, no. I did get a fleeting glimpse of what the "old" forum was like, and it was sure more closely knit. If you read the thread about you(where's beau), you can clearly see that there are some great people here, including ye old Autopia Philosiphers from your time who have hung in and still imput some great thoughts. We still have some intelegent posts (in the case of Ron.K, allmost too intelegent;) ), and some of the newbies are great guys (and gals). Yes, it would be bad if this forum turned into simply productX vs, product Z., but i would rather have that than X vs. the entire forum. So all in all, welcome back, and i hope you decide to post here again about detailing cars, blitz wax, like the good old days, but not just have to be the Autopia police. :) -Brad Hayward
 
stop it. To tell you the truth, I don't think most of us would be here unless you wanted OPINIONATED reviews and experiences. Generic technique advice

does not interest me. OPINIONS matter to me and others, and the board bears this out by the amount of responses to "Opinionated" reviews and comments. I want to know how people "Feel" about a

product, honestly. Sometimes it gets to be a little much, so I just ignore "propaganda" and move on, just like if you don't like TV, turn it off. Some people have alterior motives and sell stuff (which is not bad also) so you have to be smart enough to see through that also. I love hearing about Klasse AND Zaino and love the comparo's. They are both very good products so your bound to have a high level of support and competition for BOTH products. I use First Finish so I'm out of the loop for now!
 
There were 1305 topics that came up when the term Klasse was put in the search engine. There were 943 topics that came up when the word Zaino was put in the search engine.



I guess if a newbie comes here and asks for suggestions on what products to use it is ok to suggest Klasse but not Zaino. If you are a Klasse user than you are an OK person but if you are a Zaino user you are a Zaino Zombie or Zaino Zealot.



And if you are a Zaino user you must have some financial interest...why else would you use it?
 
Easy now, this is turning into a klasse zaino debate. What beau is really saying echos what Aristotle (or someone) said a long time ago p[robably more elequently though. he said that a fool; wasn't someone who didn't know alot, but someone who refused to learn. Someone who tricked themselves into believing that they know everything there is to know. In fact, he would walk up to famous "learned" nobles in the middle of their speech and quiz them, when they awnsered wrong, he would mock them (good guy). Its very easy to trick yourself into beleiving that the product makes the man or that klasse is the best product out there or that zaino is better. Why. I saw a pic of a liquid glass'ed bimmer that looked better than most the klassed and zainod car i have seen. Frankly wax is what keeps my sane. With all of this high tech polymer discussions about curing and crosslinking, i just love to open a tin of wax and rub it on. Something so organic and simple about it...
 
I feel the same way that Bill Does, im frequening this site less and less, cuz frankly its starting to bore me. Im getting sick of all the attacks against all the products and the advertising of prdoducts....im probably not innocent but its getting out of control.



I hate to say it, but I've learned enough to work circles around many professional detailers, if I dissapear today then I'll still have all the knowledge to make any car shine, and keep it shining for a long time, with or without autopia. :(
 
Okay... I've read enough.



Everyone please read the Forum Rules & Etiquette on the home page. These are hard rules. No tollerance.



I'm going to start inviting people to leave. In the history of this community, only three people have been banned and asked to leave. However, it has come to the point where a few people are making the community unfriendly.



This community is a result of a lot of hard work. I won't allow a few people to change the face of what we have.



To make policing the community fun, if you feel a member is breaking the rules (in fact or spirit), send me an email and I will create a Vote Poll (do they stay or do they go... Autopia Survivor).



Let it be know to all that it is a privilige to be here, not a right. No one has the right to ruin our community by pushing products, bashing others or being abrasive.



Zero tollerance!



DavidB
 
Beau, welcome back. I hope you decide to stay. Your knowledge is invaluable to the community. I sincerely hope that the "old boys network" dosen't abandon this forum. But I have a sick feeling in my stomach that suggests the erosion of our community has begun. Two insightful people have been awol for the last little while(Don, and Ron K). I hope it's not permanent. The loss of either one would be a significant blow to autopia.



Maybe the mods need to start deleting some of the more redundant and rediculous threads in order to clean up the place. I admit I've been guilty of posting some redundant things.



Take it easy everyone.
 
BTW welcome back beau....its good to have an old familiar face back on the board again.



David, here's my .02 cents....make a new forum for SENIOR members only, ie. you need 100 (or however many posts) to be able to post (all can read). This way you can have an advanced forum and a beginner's forum thus keeping the old and the new separate and eliminating some of the conflicts that are going on now, cuz frankly this place is becoming the total reverse of what it used to be.
 
you're on to something. But don't do it by the number of posts. I still consider myself an inexperienced newbie, and based on your criteria, I'd be part of the senior forum. I don't belong in the senior forum. And alot of people who joined here after me have 3 and 4 times the amount of posts that I do. And quite frankly, none of these people belong in the senior forum either.



The senior froum should be for all of the "old boys" and experienced people(Richard, Don, Beau, David, Brad, Jason, Ron, DK, Tim etc) Anybody who joined after a certain date should not be allowed into the senior forum until they are approved by a majority of the senior members.



Membership criteria should be based on the persons displayed knowledge, thoughtfulness, politeness, attention to detail, and the quality of their posts, not quantity.



There are way too many flamers on this board. And I'll admit, I've lost my cool on a couple of occasions. Occasions I do regret.



DavidB, what do you think of this idea? Does it have any merit in your eyes?
 
Bill, I agree with you and the SR status rating, its kinda like just because you have a Driver's Liscense, doesnt mean you know how to drive a car (well).

If you have to do it after a certian date, then by all means do so, or vote people in. All I know is that i used to love to read and post here, now i feel as if im wasting my time. I think that whatever is going to be done needs to be done soon, cuz its only getting worse.

BTW, if we're doing it by date were making an exception for Beau!
 
As I am new to this, I enjoy the debate. I been through a series of products now, and damn... there are good things to say about them all.



I just wish I'd have gotten through all the debates before spending all the money on products that I may have to give away!



I don't think you can go wrong with most any of the advice given, Klasse or Zaino or whatever. The neat thing about the debate is that people point out the advantages and disadvantages for the different stratagies.



Thanks to all who shared!
 
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