Is there an Autopia "abrasive scale"?

I

imported_Faceman

New member
Hi,



Is there such a thing as an Autopia Abrasive Scale? Something that lists different products from different manufacturers in order due to their abrasiveness.



Meguairs and 3M seems to have some kind of scale for their own brands, but does anyone know how they compare?



If no such scale exists, how difficult would it be, using the huge amount of knowledge and experience on this board, to create and maintain an up-to-date Abrasive Scale?



Perhaps it could run on a scale, say, from 1 to 20, for example, with 20 being the highest. Perhaps pad selection handicaps could also be included, ie DACP on a yellow pad might be rated 12, but when used on a white pad, only come in as a 9.



Smaller manufacturers products, as well as the big boys, would hopefully find their way in too, for example Poorboys Pro Polish and SSR's and Menzerna.



Would this be a good idea, or am I being a bit thick?



Cheers,



Face
 
there is a thread somewhere on here which lists almost all the main polishes from most to least abrasive. You'll have to do a search for it, I forgot the url.
 
It's been attempted, but I don't believe an inclusive list of all products have been rated.



http://www.autopia.org/forums/showt...ND levels AND swirl AND removers&pagenumber=3









COMPOUNDS, POLISHES AND GLAZES SORTED BY CUTTING ABILITY



10 – MOST AGGRESSIVE - COMPOUNDS

3M SUPER DUTY RUBBING COMPOND HEAVY CUT 39004

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL DIAMOND CUT COMPOUND 2.0 VERY HEAVY CUT #85



8

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL COMPUND POWER CLEANER HEAVY CUT #84

3M PERFECT-IT III EXTRA CUT RUBBING COMPOUND 05936

MEGUAIR’S MIRROR GLAZE HEAVY CUT CLEANER #4



7

3M IMPERIAL MICRO FINISHING COMPOUND MEDIUM CUT 39001

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE MEDIUM-CUT CLEANER #1

3M PERFECT-IT III RUBBING COMPOUND 05933



6

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL DUAL ACTION CLEANER POLISH MEDIUM CUT #83



5

3M PERFECT-IT II RUBBING COMPOUND FINE CUT 39002

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE FINE-CUT CLEANER #2

3M ONE STEP CLEANER WAX, MEDIUM OXIDATION REMOVER 39066

MENZERNA INTENSIVE POLISH

3M PERFECT-IT SWIRL MARK REMOVER DARK CARS 39009

3M PERFECT-IT SWIRL MARK REMOVER LIGHT CARS 39109

MEGUIAR’S MEDALLION PAINT CLEANER #97

MEGUIAR’S SCRATCH-X #108



4 - POLISHES

MEGUIAR’S BODY SCRUB A10

MEGUIAR’S DEEP CRYSTAL PAINT CLEANER #30

MEGUIER’S QUICK DETAILER #66

MEGUIER’S SPEED GLAZE #80

BLACK FIRE DEEP GLOSS POLISH



3

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL SWIRL FREE POLISH LIGHT CUT #82

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE SWIRL REMOVER #9

3M FINESSE-IT II MACHINE POLISH 39003

3M FINESSE-IT II FINISHING MATERIAL 05928

MENZERNA FINAL POLISH



2 - GLAZES

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL HAND POLISH VERY LIGHT CUT #81

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE MACHINE GLAZE #3

3M PERFECT-IT III TRIZACT MACHINE GLAZE 05930

3M PERFECT-IT III MACHINE GLAZE 05937

3M IMPERIAL MACHINE GLAZE 05991

3M ONE STEP CLEANER WAX, LIGHT OXIDATION REMOVER 39006



1

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE SHOW CAR GLAZE #7

3M PERFECT-IT III FINISHING GLAZE 05941

3M IMPERIAL HAND GLAZE 39007

BLACKFIRE ALL FINISH PAINT PROTECTION
 
We could refine it even more by increasing the scale to perhaps 1 to 15 or 1 to 20. Then it might be slightly more accurate for polishes with slight differences in cut. Or would that make it more hassle than it worth?



Cheers,



Face
 
That list is a nightmare. I wouldn't depend on it for anything except determining the diffs between the most and least aggressive products.



Just look at Meg's DACP and #2 ranking to see what I mean. And Blackfire polish more aggressive than Meg's Body Scrub??



Please......someone.....anyone.....delete all traces of that list before someone gets hurt.
 
bretfraz said:
That list is a nightmare. I wouldn't depend on it for anything except determining the diffs between the most and least aggressive products.



Just look at Meg's DACP and #2 ranking to see what I mean. And Blackfire polish more aggressive than Meg's Body Scrub??



Please......someone.....anyone.....delete all traces of that list before someone gets hurt.
Click to expand...



bretfraz,



Sorry for reposting that list. I didn't realize it was so inaccurate, it wasn't contested in the original thread.



Personally, I don't own a rotary so I'm not going to be trying anything past DACP.



I also would like to see an inclusive list of popular products including Meg's, 1z, PBs, Menzerna, etc...
 
Not only that, but two products can have the same "abrasiveness" but work very differently, depending on the manner each breaks down. Menzernas are different from Meguiars.



Tom
 
NHBFAN said:
bretfraz,



Sorry for reposting that list. I didn't realize it was so inaccurate, it wasn't contested in the original thread.



Personally, I don't own a rotary so I'm not going to be trying anything past DACP.



I also would like to see an inclusive list of popular products including Meg's, 1z, PBs, Menzerna, etc...
Click to expand...



It's not your fault. Thinking back some of us should have questioned the accuracy of the original post so that it wouldn't get "validated" by others. Someone took a shot at it and missed. Its very difficult to compare polishes since there are so many variables.



My concern is that a newbie/lurker will read that post, consider it Autopia Gospel and make a mistake based on it, then blame the community on some other forum. Or even worse, repost it someplace with some statement like, "this comes straight from the detailing experts at Autopia.org and is the chart they use to determine comparitive abrasiveness".



Accurately comparing and charting polishes would be a huge undertaking. That's why so many of the veterans here don't just toss out blanket recommendations of polishes. I know many of the less experienced Autopians want a simple-to-use chart to compare polishes but it's just not easy to do. A casual attempt at a comparison chart hurts more than it helps.
 
I totally disagree with Bret that this list is useless. So what if there is an error of plus or minus 1 or two? Nobody is going to "hurt" themselves by using this list, unless you put diamond cut down at number 3 or something. There are a lot of variables that affect how much cutting action a particular polish will have, but this list is supposed to be indicative of how much cutting to expect when a product is "used as directed". Best thing to do at this point is to add some disclaimers, and maybe a comment or two next to some of the products (such as Meg's #2 for rotary only).



I believe this list is immesely useful to newbies and even pro detailers if they are interested in trying out something new. I know it would have saved me hours worth of searching, especially since this forum doesn't have a particularily good search engine.
 
COMPOUNDS, POLISHES AND GLAZES SORTED BY CUTTING ABILITY



Disclaimer:

Cutting action can differ significantly based on application (e.g. hand use vs. rotary). This list is an approximate indication of the cutting ability of polishes based on the circumstance they are most likely to be used under. Products are ranked by cutting ability, not filling ability. Consider the error to be plus or minus one ranking. This list is propagated by a rouge group of Autopians and should not be seen as general consensus of the community as a whole. Comments are welcome for additions or corrections to the list.



10 – MOST AGGRESSIVE - COMPOUNDS

3M SUPER DUTY RUBBING COMPOND HEAVY CUT 39004

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL DIAMOND CUT COMPOUND 2.0 VERY HEAVY CUT #85



8

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL COMPUND POWER CLEANER HEAVY CUT #84

3M PERFECT-IT III EXTRA CUT RUBBING COMPOUND 05936

MEGUAIR’S MIRROR GLAZE HEAVY CUT CLEANER #4



7

3M IMPERIAL MICRO FINISHING COMPOUND MEDIUM CUT 39001

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE MEDIUM-CUT CLEANER #1

POORBOY'S SSR3



6

3M PERFECT-IT II RUBBING COMPOUND FINE CUT 39002

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL DUAL ACTION CLEANER POLISH MEDIUM CUT #83

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE FINE-CUT CLEANER #2 (rotary only)

3M PERFECT-IT III RUBBING COMPOUND 05933



5 (Removes scratches you can't quite feel)

3M FINESSE-IT II MACHINE POLISH 39003

3M FINESSE-IT II FINISHING MATERIAL 05928 (same as

3M ONE STEP CLEANER WAX, MEDIUM OXIDATION REMOVER 39066



MENZERNA INTENSIVE POLISH





4 - POLISHES

3M PERFECT-IT III MACHINE GLAZE 05937

MEGUIER’S QUICK DETAILER #66

MEGUIER’S SPEED GLAZE #80

3M PERFECT-IT SWIRL MARK REMOVER DARK CARS 39009

3M PERFECT-IT SWIRL MARK REMOVER LIGHT CARS 39109

MEGUIAR’S MEDALLION PAINT CLEANER #97

MEGUIAR’S SCRATCH-X #108



3

MEGUIAR’S BODY SCRUB A10

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL SWIRL FREE POLISH LIGHT CUT #82

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE SWIRL REMOVER #9

POORBOY'S SSR1



2 - GLAZE/POLISH (takes out the smallest scratches)

3M PERFECT-IT III TRIZACT MACHINE GLAZE 05930

3M IMPERIAL MACHINE GLAZE 05991

3M ONE STEP CLEANER WAX, LIGHT OXIDATION REMOVER 39006

MENZERNA FINAL POLISH

KLASSE ALL-IN-ONE

MEGUIAR’S DEEP CRYSTAL PAINT CLEANER #30



1 (No cutting action, filling only)

MEGUIAR’S BODY SHOP PROFESSIONAL HAND POLISH #81

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE MACHINE GLAZE #3

MEGUIAR’S MIRROR GLAZE SHOW CAR GLAZE #7

3M PERFECT-IT III FINISHING GLAZE 05941

3M IMPERIAL HAND GLAZE 39007

BLACK FIRE DEEP GLOSS POLISH
 
Beanbag- Yeah, that's a LOT better :xyxthumbs



Move the 3M PI-III RC 05933 down to "6". It's pretty mild stuff, milder, IMO, than the 39002 (I've used the two in direct comparisons on single stage).
 
I think it would be a great idea if we put together a list of all the products that are mentioned on here and kind of put a description together on them. Instead of it being a thread, it can be a link on the home page. It would have the abrasiveness of the product, if it is a cleaner how it does its cleaning Chemical or Abrasive, if it contains fillers or not etc.... As new products come out it could then just get added to the list. I think a list like this would help out a lot when people are trying to get information on a product. And instead of always trying to do a search to get the information, all you would have to do is click on the link to get it.
 
SR77 said:
I think it would be a great idea if we put together a list of all the products that are mentioned on here and kind of put a description together on them. Instead of it being a thread, it can be a link on the home page. It would have the abrasiveness of the product, if it is a cleaner how it does its cleaning Chemical or Abrasive, if it contains fillers or not etc.... As new products come out it could then just get added to the list. I think a list like this would help out a lot when people are trying to get information on a product. And instead of always trying to do a search to get the information, all you would have to do is click on the link to get it.
Click to expand...



It's a good idea but the problem is that, with very few exceptions, we really don't know what's in a product to derive these kind of conclusions. So much of what's discussed here is hypothesis over fact.



Take Klasse AIO for instance. Some here believe it offers long term protection and some believe the protection is minimal. Others think it has abrasives yet others still feel it has none. No one to my knowledge has ever seen an MSDS let alone an ingredients list of AIO. So how does this popular product get categorized?



And as for MSDS's, we've had the founder of this very community tell us that they can't be relied on to tell us what comprises a particular product. Mfr reps have supported this position.



If any kind of list is to be compiled, its gotta start with hard facts about products.
 
bretfraz said:


If any kind of list is to be compiled, its gotta start with hard facts about products.
Click to expand...



Considering the dearth of "hard facts" in the detailing world, I think giving something an abrasive rating based on user experience is a pretty good way to go about it
 
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