I tried this Z-pc, z2pro, Natty's w/ NO ZFX

Just a thought.

My C5 will run quite well, if I keep my foot out of it, using 87 or 89 octane fuel but I choose to use the GM "recommended" 93-94 octane for maximum performance and engine protection. Well worth the extra $300-$400 per year IMO to get everything I paid for during my initial investment. I really see no difference in using Zaino (my protectant of choice) properly to receive its maximally performance, especially at the price of a pizza. :nixweiss
 
blkZ28Conv said:
Just a thought.

My C5 will run quite well, if I keep my foot out of it, using 87 or 89 octane fuel but I choose to use the GM "recommended" 93-94 octane for maximum performance and engine protection. Well worth the extra $300-$400 per year IMO to get everything I paid for during my initial investment. I really see no difference in using Zaino (my protectant of choice) properly to receive its maximally performance, especially at the price of a pizza. :nixweiss
Click to expand...





That's not really a great comparison, because we KNOW it is a fact that using higher octane on performance engines is safer than lower octane. It is proven. Someone bent the rules and found that lower octane is indeed harmful for performance engines in the long run. It has not been proven, however, that Z2 DEPENDS on ZFX to survive its durability period (Sal Zaino is not proof). I bent the rules with Zaino and used it without ZFX. Z2 already proved to me that it works fine without ZFX at 3 months, so what is ZFX going to give me that I already didn't have? I should buy it just because the company says so, without providing concrete evidence that it works? I understand that Sal 'recommends' it with his product, but I'm not buying it. I disliked Zaino even more when I found that it worked just fine without ZFX. I truly believe it is just a marketing scheme to bring in more money. I hate arguing with fellow members on this board, but this has always been a fairly touchy subject with me.



To me, ZFX is like adding a bottle of cheap octane booster to 91 octane. It isn't going to do a whole lot (if anything) for safety or performance. If you want the real thing, you buy race gas. :D



Just as you said, 'keeping your foot out of it' will keep your car safe. My testing of Zaino was not 'keeping my foot out of it' by keeping it in the garage during those 3 months. It was fully exposed to the elements on the driveway everyday, just like it would have been had I used the ZFX.
 
Since we're on the subject...



I recently did my car with 3 coats of Z2Pro (with the ZFX). As much as I like the

idea of doing 2-3 coats in a day, sometimes there just isn't time. Is it possible

to just apply 1 coat of Z2Pro without having to use ZFX? Since there's already

a few layers of Z2Pro with ZFX in it for the base, just using 1 coat Z2Pro by itself

should not be a problem, should it?
 
usdm said:
Since we're on the subject...



I recently did my car with 3 coats of Z2Pro (with the ZFX). As much as I like the

idea of doing 2-3 coats in a day, sometimes there just isn't time. Is it possible

to just apply 1 coat of Z2Pro without having to use ZFX? Since there's already

a few layers of Z2Pro with ZFX in it for the base, just using 1 coat Z2Pro by itself

should not be a problem, should it?
Click to expand...





Yes. Do it all the time. Apply Z2, Z2-PRO or Z5 alone. Allow to fully dry and buff off. The nexus for the adhersion, cross-linking and bonding of subsequent layer of sealant is present. :xyxthumbs
 
If ZFX was less expensive, I don't think there would be so much controversy surrounding it. $20 is a little pricey. If the cost was more reasonable, I think more people would just buy it and not think twice about it.
 
I just got my new bottle of ZFX yesterday. My first bottle lasted 2+ years, and dozens of uses. In reality, it only adds pennies to each application-not a big deal.



Now, when I put the first coat on Z2Pro on my new truck, I was almost out of ZFX, but I added all that I could-maybe 1.5 drops to 1 oz. (for two applications). When I was done, I was extremely disappointed in the appearance-I was going to start looking for something else to use (truck is dark green w/ gold metalflake). First time Z has ever disappointed me-and I hated that it was on my new vehicle! It was cloudy, dull and just didn't look any better than it did bare. 24 hours changed my mind-it looked incredible. Z really does take time to cure-especially with little or no ZFX.
 
$20 in the elite detailing boutique world is nothing. I paid that much for products that quite disappointed me verse their comparison to similiar less "chic" products. I just do not get the pricing problem compared to the added benefits of ZFX usage. Instant cure, multiple layerability, strong matrix formulation and faster drying. Well worth the previous forementioned pennies per usage and the minor task of mixing.



Cobra, hopefully this is a discussion of points of view rather than an arguement.

I do take exception to your theory on why ZFX even exist. $$$

Without proof, which there is not any, this accusation, personal attack and denigrating statement is quite uncalled for. :nono:
 
IF you like ZFX and don't mind spending the $20 that is fine-BUT- there are other products that allow 15 minute layering without having to mix anything.
 
wannafbody said:
IF you like ZFX and don't mind spending the $20 that is fine-BUT- there are other products that allow 15 minute layering without having to mix anything.
Click to expand...





Please name some with manufactures references. No internet myths or 2nd application full coverage usage justication. True layerability, please.
 
Actually, I'd think less about the money if the compound was indeed expensive for Zaino to make and he was just making a fair profit on it. Considering a bottle of Z2 Pro is $15, is Zaino gouging the buyer with ZFX?
 
Finish Kare 2180 and Tropicare TC-3 XP- I appied 3 layers of the Tropicare XP 15 minutes apart with absolutely NO problems. I also think Mothers Reflections Top Coat would layer in 15 minutes but that is a blended sealant.
 
blkZ28Conv said:
Without proof, which there is not any, this accusation, personal attack and denigrating statement is quite uncalled for. :nono:
Click to expand...



I don't ever recall making a personal attack on you. :nixweiss



And I am not sure what 'proof' you are referring to.
 
The personal attack was against Sal and Zaino not me. Something about ZFX only reason for its existence was for $$$ and augment Sal's bottomline.



Quote:

Originally Posted by COBRyan

I truly feel that ZFX is just another means of bringing in more money for Sal, but that is just my opinion.





I know Sal and he works hard to create and constantly improve his very unique system. Good is not good enough for Sal. He is extremely anal about every Z product and extremely proud of his line of products. I know he would not introduce a product that does nothing for his line of products. ZFX was a God send for Zaino users that desired the ability to apply multiple "true" layers of protectant and/or desired a shorter drying time for a single layer. This is especially true after polishing that prior to ZFX required a layer of Z1 and than Z2, Z2-PRO or Z5. The initiation combo (Z1 plus Z polish) was/is time consuming and personally I have found does not match the initial appearance after using ZFX (after Z1 application cures fully it is hard to distinguish any differences).
 
Ok we agree to disagree then. I am glad the product works well for you. I am not asking anyone to follow my steps nor do I care if they do. I am simply stating what worked for me, which obviously does not work for you so I do not expect you to try it.
 
So can anyone prove that they are indeed getting multiple layers in a matter of hours when using ZFX?



Is it proven that multiple layers can NOT be achieved in the same time without using ZFX?
 
blkZ28Conv said:
ZFX was a God send for Zaino users that desired the ability to apply multiple "true" layers of protectant and/or desired a shorter drying time for a single layer.
Click to expand...



That may be, but personally, I could give a flip about applying multiple layers during one detailing session. I also found the other day (at least with Z5) that even on a small car, a thin layer is ready to remove pretty quickly without using ZFX (my sample had dried up over the summer) and looked really good off the bat. Topped with Z8 and it looked even better.



It won't be a durability test though, the car is regularly garaged and driven only about 8000 miles a year. I was mostly just interested in seeing how Z5/Z8 looked on metallic black. :)



Honestly, I think more pros would be more apt to use Zaino if it wasn't for ZFX and Zaino's incompatibility with some polishes (because of the oils). Time is money and if you can get an equally good look (and in the case of Acrylic Jett, similar durability), you aren't going to buy an additional product to mix into the sealant or rewash the car/alcohol wipe down if you don't have to. As an enthusiast though, if you like layering and are happy with the full Zaino system, I wouldn't think of trying to talk you out of it. Definitely a high quality product but just doesn't fit in with my business as well as other products.
 
Scottwax said:
That may be, but personally, I could give a flip about applying multiple layers during one detailing session. I also found the other day (at least with Z5) that even on a small car, a thin layer is ready to remove pretty quickly without using ZFX (my sample had dried up over the summer) and looked really good off the bat. Topped with Z8 and it looked even better.



It won't be a durability test though, the car is regularly garaged and driven only about 8000 miles a year. I was mostly just interested in seeing how Z5/Z8 looked on metallic black. :)



Honestly, I think more pros would be more apt to use Zaino if it wasn't for ZFX and Zaino's incompatibility with some polishes (because of the oils). Time is money and if you can get an equally good look (and in the case of Acrylic Jett, similar durability), you aren't going to buy an additional product to mix into the sealant or rewash the car/alcohol wipe down if you don't have to. As an enthusiast though, if you like layering and are happy with the full Zaino system, I wouldn't think of trying to talk you out of it. Definitely a high quality product but just doesn't fit in with my business as well as other products.
Click to expand...



Very nicely said Scott :up
 
Scottwax said:
That may be, but personally, I could give a flip about applying multiple layers during one detailing session. I also found the other day (at least with Z5) that even on a small car, a thin layer is ready to remove pretty quickly without using ZFX (my sample had dried up over the summer) and looked really good off the bat. Topped with Z8 and it looked even better.



It won't be a durability test though, the car is regularly garaged and driven only about 8000 miles a year. I was mostly just interested in seeing how Z5/Z8 looked on metallic black. :)



Honestly, I think more pros would be more apt to use Zaino if it wasn't for ZFX and Zaino's incompatibility with some polishes (because of the oils). Time is money and if you can get an equally good look (and in the case of Acrylic Jett, similar durability), you aren't going to buy an additional product to mix into the sealant or rewash the car/alcohol wipe down if you don't have to. As an enthusiast though, if you like layering and are happy with the full Zaino system, I wouldn't think of trying to talk you out of it. Definitely a high quality product but just doesn't fit in with my business as well as other products.
Click to expand...



As Bryan stated, well put. :bow



That is why Zaino (Sal) focuses on the car fanatic and does not sell in bulk sizes.

Yes, time is money and Sal saw the importance of time even for the fanatic hobbist detailer and created, after much investment, ZFX.





I detail for profit once a month and fun on the side and my clients do not expect anything less than Zaino after experiencing their first dose and the longevity of that "just waxed" appearance and the money spent for me to do their car.





The most important part of your true statement is the fact that Zaino "sealant" now competes with other genres of protectants (carnuaba) in appearance. :woot:

This could not be stated several years ago. Now the choice is not what protectant to use for appearance but what system meets my needs. :xyxthumbs
 
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