How often to change fluids?

As a guy who is by training an aircraft tech and is just a nut about maintenance as my detailing I do it all myself.



With that said, 3k oil changes with a good synthetic are really overkill, I have had oil analysis done that show even with 10K on the oil it has plenty of life left.



Its hard to resist the marketing and old world thinking from the past. But unless you do a very short commute and the oil never gets a chance to reach operating temps, your really just throwing money away with that interval.



Bobistheoilguy.com is a great resource, seriously intelligent people who will prove to you that the 3K oil change, especially with synthetics is not only bad for the environment and your wallet, it also doesn't do much for your car. Its just been ingrained into our psyche for so long that its hard to resist. Mobil 1 even has a research paper saying too frequent changes are actually BAD, its hard to believe they would tell you not to buy their product more often but its true and can be found at Bobistheoilguy.



I will admit that I sometimes change mine more often than needed but 3K is just way too often, the cost to benefit ratio is just not there. When you think of it when was the last time you junked a car due to a lubrication issue, your suspension and electrical system will kill the car long before these modern engines will have oil issues, a few models do need frequent changes, VW's in particular but your Honda... not at all. In fact Honda doesn't even recommend you replace the filter with each change but every other change. I do change the filter every time, for the price and the deals I get at Autozone its silly not too.



I would go grab yourself some Castrol Syntec, they have it in Honda Spec 5/20 or my choice 0/30, my results have shown it to be a top notch product, it meets BMW specs ( The 0/30 that is) and my oil analysis have been fantastic, even the ones with 10K+ on the oil. My BMW interval is 15 K and when I look inside its like a new motor.....



Regarding your tranny, its really a big issue with Honda's that their fluid be used, if you read the forums its something all the knowledgeable people will stress, they have had issues with Honda automatics and the Honda brand really does make a difference. You only get 3 quarts out and its like 4.99 a quart at any Honda dealer, well worth the price



Your heart is in the right place, I know its hard to say im going to let the oil stay there longer., if its dirty that's a good thing, its doing its job. The real dirt is in the filter, the color change is not causing wear... its just changing color... dont sweat it.



For sure join Bobistheoilguy.com, great group of people and you will learn so much you will be amazed.



Fuel Injection cleaning is a dealer/jiffy lube up sell that I would run from. Buy a good brand of fuel, Shell, Chevron, see http://www.toptiergas.com/



If you really want to, add a bottle of Techron the week before your next oil change, this way anything cleaned will be removed with the oil. Also any fuel system cleaner seems to thin the oil so many recommend this way rather than with the oil change as most people do... I get Techron for either half price or buy one get one free at Pep Boys or AUtozone its always got a rebate or deal going for it. I have 6 bottles here right now I got at half off, stockpile it when its on sale ( Like now)



Its hard but this is the way to maintain a modern car, save the money for a water pump change and timing belt change, the Oil is good for a lot longer than you think. If you do short trips, every day then you may continue to change more frequently than needed but even then I would at least go to 5 K. Even then the guys in the know will say its overkill, serious overkill.



Save your money for some new detailing products!
 
Save your money for some new detailing products![/QUOTE]





I could not have said it any better :2thumbs: we most also consider that these frequesnt oil changes are using up oil at a faster rate and make us more oil dependant. increasing OCI'S will also help on our natural resources. guess what I could not understand is that everybody takes such good care of the outside, why not spend the $20 to keep tabs on the ( very expensive) inside? if I had not seen my intake leak I would be spending some serious cash on a new motor. to each their own I guess :cooleek:
 
FalconGuy, I agree with you up to a point...but my garage queen that has a factory 5K/10K interval...I have only put 3500 miles in the last 15 months...so I'm not going to let it go more than 5K between changes (and it is under warranty, anyway). I change my mother's oil for her, she has a new GM with the oil life monitor. I changed the oil at 1K (I am never sorry I do this when I see all the metal/etc. come out on that first change), and it looks like the OLM is going to ask for a change at about 6K (all short trips). However, Buick sent her a letter saying regardless of the OLM reading, you must change the oil once a year or you will void the warranty. Before this car she had an ('88) Olds which was perhaps the first GM car to have the OLM, and it would typically call for a change at between 2-4K, IIRC.
 
Completely agree with you, if your not driving that much at least once a year, irregardless of mileage. BMW gives 15K intervals and pays for all maintenance for 4 years 50K but they will change oil once a year even if you dont make 15K.



I always assume people are driving more than 5K a year but many dont, for those I would say do it every 6 months, like me, your just doing it with less miles. I just think 3 months 3K is crazy for a daily driver, providing your not doing a 3 mile commute and not getting up to temp regularly. You can look at the underside of your oil cap and see if moisture is present, its a gauge to see if the oil is getting up to temp. If you have a car with an oil temp gauge its surprising how much longer the oil takes to get to temp versus the water/coolant temp which comes up rather quickly. Also many temp gauges are buffered to show normal temps in a wide range of temps so people dont complain that my engine runs hot on hills or stoplights, I hate gauges that lie.



Luckily I can put my BMW into test mode with the trip reset button and a sequence of buttons and read actual numbers, almost like having a code reader plugged in while driving. I also use Egineuity software that allows my laptop to read all the sensors and see faults, even those that are waiting for more events to display the check engine light, some need 4 events ( Like a misfire) before the light comes on.



I have a filter insert in the BMW so you see the element, never noticed a single piece of metal. I use a tool you can buy at any tool shop around airports to cut open the Honda filter, never see anything there either, even the first change. I guess Im lucky... A can opener can be used in a pinch..



I have seen tons on metal on new $75,000 aircraft engines, that ran for many many years so go figure. I wouldn't worry if I saw metal, its gotta happen. This is why my mpg keeps getting better with the Bimmer.....



I swear with that Castrol the Honda runs completely different, starts like its warm even in 10 degrees, I highly recommend It. You can really only find the 0w30 at Autozone though, its made in Germany and has a cult following on Bobistheoilguy.com



Give it a try for your garage queen, its a very thick 30 weight so dont let the numbers scare you.
 
Very well put, FalconGuy.



I've never had to use an injector cleaner for my '95 Honda Civic. It ran 152,000kms before I sold it after 9 years of ownership. The new owner hasn't had any fuel economy issues yet so I guess the injectors are still fine. :D Under my watch, that car used regular dino oil and I had it changed pretty regularly.
 
Thanks for the info guys? Actually, I only work about 3 miles away from my home so I really don't put a tremendous amount of miles on my car. My wife has an SUV so we try to take my car anytime we go out but even with that I barely get 2k in 3 months. So does that mean I would only change my oil every 6-7 months? I like the fact that I'll save money I'll just have to keep reminding myself that my car will be ok.



As far as gas goes, I use Shell exclusively. I use to use the cheapest gas available but one of my wife's co-worker use to work for Shell and she said that there's definitely a difference in gas. She also said that you need to be careful which Shell station you go to. There are a few that use inferior gas to increase profits. When I bought my car the salesman said I just need to put regular gas in but once a month I should fill up with the premium grade? Is this correct?



Also, does everyone here use Blackstone for their oil analysis?
 
FalconGuy said:
I have a filter insert in the BMW so you see the element, never noticed a single piece of metal. I use a tool you can buy at any tool shop around airports to cut open the Honda filter, never see anything there either, even the first change.



I swear with that Castrol the Honda runs completely different, starts like its warm even in 10 degrees, I highly recommend It. You can really only find the 0w30 at Autozone though, its made in Germany and has a cult following on Bobistheoilguy
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I'm talking about the flake and casting slag that comes out of the bottom of the oil pan on the first change, it likely is too heavy to easily make it to the pickup and then to the filter. I used to run the 0W-30 M1 before they gave up marketing it and it became almost impossible to find. I didn't realize they had the German Castrol at Autozone, I may have to check it out.
 
So when you guys do coolant changes or transmission fluid changes, do you go all out and get everything out?



I ask because I'm nearing 40k miles and the only thing I've changed is the oil and the coolant once (wasn't even a good job since the new coolant color mixed with the old), but I know I'm overdue for fuel filter, spark plugs, brake fluid and transmission fluid (at least according to service manuals, word of mouth, general paranoia). It is rather overwhelming to think that I have to drain 14 qts of transmission fluid to effectively get out all the nasty stuff, and then the pain of bleeding brakes and needing a competent partner to pump the pedal. I'm almost considering going to the local stealership to have them do all the work since I've found it a PITA to take all the old fluids to some auto store and convince the guy to take it all off my hands and ignore the 'allotted amount per person' rule.
 
Zoom, usually you only get half the fluid out of an auto trans. The mfrs. know that when they spec the interval. You usually drop the pan, whatever fluid comes out comes out, you change the filter, and fill 'er back up. I had a '73 Mercury that had a drain plug in the torque converter, and I took that out and that got more, but still not all the fluid out. But I haven't heard of a converter drain plug in a long time.



I think the brake fluid is important, you will notice how much darker it gets over time, and it absorbs water, through the hoses, even, which will rust the insides of your cylinders. And yes, it's a huge pain, there have been some threads here about the one-man bleeders. A tip is to suck the fluid out of the master cylinder first, so you don't have to pump that dirty fluid through, just don't suck it dry, or you'll get a bunch of air in the system. I think I have cut open every fuel filter I have ever changed, and I never saw anything in them. Most of them are such a pain, I usually don't change them as often as ur supposed to.



Around here, the municipalities accept used oil, don't they do that where you live? At the recycling center? Here they take oil, antifreeze, batteries, tires, etc.
 
Autozone will take any old fluids, no questions asked, even when I had 10 gallons of oil....



Maybe I buy enough there for them not to want to tick me off?



I say get an oil extractor, I do power steering fluid, auto tranny and engine oil, within an hour, all in a white shirt. I also get a bit of brake fluid each time, keeping it somewhat cleaner between flushes.



Best 40 bucks I ever spent.
 
FalconGuy said:
Autozone will take any old fluids, no questions asked, even when I had 10 gallons of oil....



Maybe I buy enough there for them not to want to tick me off?



I say get an oil extractor, I do power steering fluid, auto tranny and engine oil, within an hour, all in a white shirt. I also get a bit of brake fluid each time, keeping it somewhat cleaner between flushes.



Best 40 bucks I ever spent.
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Advanced auto also takes used oil in my area. we all need to do our part and dispose of properly. I am hoping that no matter what we feel is the correct oil, filter, OCI etc.. we all agree to recycle instead of the alternative. :nono
 
Absolutely, just get the fluid warm so it flows easily, then its a matter of putting the extractor in the dipstick hole and standing back and waiting. The hard part is putting the fluid back in, I found the Honda Dipstick hole was so small it literally took and hour to put the fluid (3 Qt's) back in.



Then I did a simple search and found that at the base of the dipstick, on the tranny bell housing there was a threaded screw I could have removed that would have opened up a 1 inch round hold to refill, live and learn. Now I can do a partial change, you only get 3 quarts out during each oil change, total cost 15 bucks, and 15 minutes of my time. My neighbor is a gadget freak, like most of us. The first time he watched me do my fluid changes with the extractor he just sat there amazed, power steering, brake, tranny and engine oil all at once and so simple a kid could do it.



Best part, honestly not a drop spilled, not ONE. My only regret was not getting the model that lets you pump out the old fluid, on mine you just tilt and pour out the old. I find here its easy to make a mess after a spill. I would spend the extra 20 bucks for that feature, in fact I am going to buy one now after all this talking about it.......... It pumps the oil out the same tube you used to extract and you can watch the process closer than just poring into a funnel and hoping you dont overfill.



Thanks to Bill D for his positive posts that made me buy one, I really do think its the best gadget I ever bought, I change fluids 3X more often just because its so easy.



I only wish my BMW had a dipstick for the auto tranny..... since it doesn't I cant change the fluid. The new year, 2006 and up don't even have a dipstick for engine oil, cant imagine what they were thinking there,...... Oil sensors are a known issue on the previous models, at least you could reassure yourself that all was well by looking at the dipstick and seeing that you do in fact have oil. Now you just trust the electronics, for what the price of a 5 dollar dipstick?



This is just one of the reasons I wont be buying the new BMW model, I just hate the direction they are going, just trust us seems to be the motto. Plus the styling isn't to my tastes. Also I don't have 40 K sitting around........
 
flatstick said:
Advanced auto also takes used oil in my area. we all need to do our part and dispose of properly. I am hoping that no matter what we feel is the correct oil, filter, OCI etc.. we all agree to recycle instead of the alternative. :nono
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Unfortunately, many people prefer to dump their oil down the storm sewers or down the toilet. :down
 
White95Max said:
Unfortunately, many people prefer to dump their oil down the storm sewers or down the toilet. :down
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Now that is just plain sad. well maybe some of these people will get snagged and get what is coming to them. :grrr
 
I guess I'll go to Autozone from now on for fluids. I normally go to Wal Mart (maximum of 10qts) and last time went to O'Reillys (5 gallon max per address).
 
In NJ at least any shop that does NJ state Vehicle Inspections is also required to accept used motor oil, I don't know if there is a limit though. When I worked on cars in High School we would find the oil dropped of at our door in the morning, no one ever brought any in during normal hours. Didn't seem to bother the owner, he used the oil to heat the garage. Always wondered if that would be a good way to heat my garage but I doubt it...... Never did see what he had to do to that oil to make it usable as fuel but the garage was always heated?





Every city and County here also accept used oil, so there is no excuse for dumping it anywhere.



My only problem is I refuse to use my car to drop it off, so I use my girls, hey you never know it might spill. Even though I put all the oil in a large laundry type bucket (20 gallons or so) just in case it does leak.



Kinda funny story, my Mom was dying of cancer over the summer, that's why I said kinda... Tough time so anything that was not sad we laughed about just because we were so used to being sad or crying.





At that time we had a lot of guests visiting so our garage was full of beer/soda, since we had at times 20 people staying at the house.



I used the empty 2 liter Coke bottles to store used oil. One day after my mom's death I stopped by to see my dad as he was of course devastated.



I looked in his fridge since I knew he wouldn't be doing any shopping and I would have to get things for him. In the corner of the fridge I see a 2 liter coke bottle full to the very top, that caught my eye as they never fill them to the top.



You guessed it, he had picked up one of the bottles I stored in his garage and must have thought it was left over coke and put it in his fridge. Thank god he isn't a cola drinker. I would hope the smell and color would have stopped him or anyone else from drinking any but you never know.



Now I take any label off the bottle so there can never be any confusion, figured I would pass this along as many of us probably store oil this way. If the label cant be removed I use a marker to label it USED MOTOR OIL.
 
FalconGuy said:
Now I take any label off the bottle so there can never be any confusion, figured I would pass this along as many of us probably store oil this way. If the label cant be removed I use a marker to label it USED MOTOR OIL.
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I store my used oil in laundry jugs. The plastic is thick, and the caps tighten very securely. I don't worry about taking them in my car, but nevertheless, I put the jugs into a cardboard box and put the jugs in there...just in case the outside of the jugs got a bit oily.
 
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