How many mobile units are using containment mats?

ajbarnes,



Thanks for that input:up



We are in a catch 22 really. Water runoff, because of roads, can no longer seep into the soil but rather it washes or runs off so much faster now. Rain water picks up and removes first top soil, which contains fertilizers and chemicals, and then gas and oil from the streets themselves and then dumps all this into storm drains. We need roads though because if we ran on just dirt roads then ground erosion would worsen.



What needs to be done is proper landscaping in urban areas. We need areas where water run off can be slowed down.



Anthony
 
NY detailer said:
I just did a search for some water matts. The cost anywhere from $750 and up for the size i would need.



I would need to go out and buy a larger van to carry it. I would still need to dispose of the water somewhere.



Just looked at all my specs on products that wash off the vehicle, they are all green friendly.



To be honest with you, I have never seen a detailer use a water recovery matt.
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NY detailer,



Many of these mats are constructed of second grade junk and usually fall apart after a few uses. I mean there are some good ones out there but they are big and bulky and usually start around $1000.



If it came down to it I would purchase a water mat BUT I also think it fair if mobile detailers were given a tax rebate or incentive for conforming to the regulations or is that asking too much?



Anthony
 
www.dcs1.com is a good site with lots of articles. One stated that if you use more than 2 gallons you are not in compliance. There have been other detailers on forums that have seen fines go out to competitors. I do know that when I get the mat I'm going to ask the city for an endorsement, or contract for their city vehicles. I doubt they are reclaiming the water in their own car wash bays in local parking lots!

Rob at Roadwarrior bought a mat and likes it. Some cheaper ones at 450 don't have berms which are imperitive. Either way, each city will enforce it at some point. The industry leaders like Bud A. are seeing it across the country (he now stocks a mat). Detail Companies don't supply mats unless they see something coming in the near future.

I agree with many points about home washing vs. mobile units where you are putting out 2-3 gallons per min. vs. about 12. However, the EPA isn't going to change the law for detailers.

I wish I had more time but UCSB is on ESPN!



Rob
 
ShineShop said:
The water may dry up but the soap residues remain and will be washed into the storm sewers the next rainfall (unless of course you use no soaps or cleaners).
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I know AJ beat me to it, but for emphasis.....



This is from the Protect All website:



Clean Water Act and Ground Water Pollution -- Washing without rinsing greatly reduces the discharge of pollutants into storm drains, sewers and the ground water preventing run-off contamination into rivers, lakes, bays and oceans. Quick & Easy Wash helps both commercial and industrial users comply with the discharge guidelines established by the Clean Water Act and the Environmental Protection Agency.



QEW is a very benign product and since you use less than 2 gallons of water, no containment mat is needed.



I think as a fixed location detailer, somewhere in the back of your mind a containment mat is a way to help equalize costs between fixed location and mobile detailers. ;) :lol



Like Anthony, I don't buy it for a second that runoff from car washing is a major enviromental hazard. Engine oil leaks, coolant leaks, rubber from tires, etc all get flushed down the storm drains every time it rains. Since that is a far greater percentage of hazardous runoff than car washing can ever hope to be, maybe the focus should be there first.
 
I decided awhile ago to stop complaining about reclaiming water and to comply to the law. The time it takes is figured into my prices. Now I roll up on a job, wash reclaim and count the money. It feels good not having to worry about gettin gcaught.



I don't use the "mat". I tried it once and it is a MAJOR PAIN!!!!



I went with the vacuboom (do an internet search if you don't know what it is) and it works out great.



I bring the waste water home and drain into the sewer system that I had extended from my bathroom to were I park my van.
 
Joe,



What length is your vacuboom? I know they aren't cheap, but look easier than the mat by far! Is it necessary to be on a slope so the water runs to the boom?

Thanks,

Rob
 
I have never seen or used a water matt.



My question is this.

The water matt sucks in all the water.

What do you do with the water that is in the matt? Do you ring it out somewhere how do you dispose of it?
 
The mat can be 20-30 mils thick. I know of another that is 40 mil and used for military use, but some people use it for detailing. The water does not soak into the mat at all. Some of it will evaporate naturally, but the rest is to be sucked into a tank, or wet/dry vac and disposed of properly. I would talk to a local self-serve about dumping it into their separaters for a small fee, or hooking up something at home to the sewer line. When I get going in June, I'm going to ask the city for an endorsement of some kind. Since they are enforcing locally and no one is complying yet, I am going to tell them: "Look, a mat or boom is going to cost me over 1k. If I'm going to comply with the EPA and city codes when no one else is, then I should get some support from the city as a "clean detailer". Perhaps I can get an account doing the city's vehicles. I bet they wash their own in the city parking lots and don't contain their run-off water.

Anyway, I'm going to research this further with my local city and see if I can hook up some contracted work prior to buying the mat, or boom.



Rob
 
Scottwax said:
I know AJ beat me to it, but for emphasis.....



This is from the Protect All website:



Clean Water Act and Ground Water Pollution -- Washing without rinsing greatly reduces the discharge of pollutants into storm drains, sewers and the ground water preventing run-off contamination into rivers, lakes, bays and oceans. Quick & Easy Wash helps both commercial and industrial users comply with the discharge guidelines established by the Clean Water Act and the Environmental Protection Agency.



QEW is a very benign product and since you use less than 2 gallons of water, no containment mat is needed.



I think as a fixed location detailer, somewhere in the back of your mind a containment mat is a way to help equalize costs between fixed location and mobile detailers. ;) :lol



Like Anthony, I don't buy it for a second that runoff from car washing is a major enviromental hazard. Engine oil leaks, coolant leaks, rubber from tires, etc all get flushed down the storm drains every time it rains. Since that is a far greater percentage of hazardous runoff than car washing can ever hope to be, maybe the focus should be there first.
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Maybe it's just me and the fact that I live so close to the world's largest supply of freshwater but I am not going to play fast and loose with the environment. I live in a northern climate Scott and mobile detailing here is nil, nada or insignificant. I could care less about who "competes" against me whether they are mobile or fixed location. I do believe the law applies to EVERYONE however and most of the arguments I have been hearing here are all major copp outs because it is going to 1. make mobile detailing harder by having to haul out a mat for every wash and then dispose of the waste properly 2. less profitable due to increased time and the cost of purchasing the mat and possibly to dispose of the water.

I have read the facts and moreover SEEN the evidence firsthand in our lakes. The foaming I have seen at the waters edge is NOT from something natural. I know the difference between the two and thick, soapy residues are not natural thanks very much.

You are either going to be a part of the solution or part of the problem. Try as you will to justify what you are doing it's still wrong. The Exxon Valdez dumped oil into the ocean, factories pump pollution into the air and any other source of pollution doesn't nullify the fact that runoff from washing cars is still polluting. Just saying well "this is insignificant compared to what these guys are doing" is self serving and a copp out.

I said it before - I don't care if anyone here decides to reclaim or not. However, it is coming and you will need to get with the program or face the music as the guys in L.A. are right now.
 
ShineShop said:
Maybe it's just me and the fact that I live so close to the world's largest supply of freshwater but I am not going to play fast and loose with the environment. I live in a northern climate Scott and mobile detailing here is nil, nada or insignificant. I could care less about who "competes" against me whether they are mobile or fixed location. I do believe the law applies to EVERYONE however and most of the arguments I have been hearing here are all major copp outs because it is going to 1. make mobile detailing harder by having to haul out a mat for every wash and then dispose of the waste properly 2. less profitable due to increased time and the cost of purchasing the mat and possibly to dispose of the water.

I have read the facts and moreover SEEN the evidence firsthand in our lakes. The foaming I have seen at the waters edge is NOT from something natural. I know the difference between the two and thick, soapy residues are not natural thanks very much.

You are either going to be a part of the solution or part of the problem. Try as you will to justify what you are doing it's still wrong. The Exxon Valdez dumped oil into the ocean, factories pump pollution into the air and any other source of pollution doesn't nullify the fact that runoff from washing cars is still polluting. Just saying well "this is insignificant compared to what these guys are doing" is self serving and a copp out.

I said it before - I don't care if anyone here decides to reclaim or not. However, it is coming and you will need to get with the program or face the music as the guys in L.A. are right now.
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Lighten up. The ;) :lol smilies means I was joking about the competition.



My point is why go after 5% of the problem instead of first trying to solve the other 95%? I am in compliance anyway since I use less than 2 gallons of water for a wash.
 
Scottwax said:
Lighten up. The ;) :lol smilies means I was joking about the competition.



My point is why go after 5% of the problem instead of first trying to solve the other 95%? I am in compliance anyway since I use less than 2 gallons of water for a wash.
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I'm not mad at ya buddy! :) The point I am trying to make is that everyone is by law required to get with the program and after all - we are talking about something important here right? Clean, safe water supply is the most important thing we have next to clean air. We all have to do our part and who cares about the other 95% of polluters? That's irrelevant. Let's worry about us and set a good example for everyone else.
 
I agree we should all do our part and by using QEW, I am completely in compliance. I just wish the EPA would go after other sources of groundwater contamination with the same zeal.
 
Scottwax said:
I agree we should all do our part and by using QEW, I am completely in compliance. I just wish the EPA would go after other sources of groundwater contamination with the same zeal.
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That's exactly my feeling in a nutshell.
 
Wash_Me said:
Containment mats don't work for mobile detailers because I have try them. If your on a slope the water runs over the edge of the mat, there not safe to walk on and there heavy. If the EPA is going to enforce the clean water act they need to help the business owner to find a better way and profitable way of contain wash water. I think the EPA should enforce the clean water act for everyone not just a few. During the summer months they chip seal the roads here with a nice layer of oil and gravel, I know this runs off into the Boise river but they do every year.



I hear Rightlook.com has a trailer that you can drive the car onto and the wash water drain down into a tank. Not sure what the cost is but it sounds better than a containment mat.
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How about $20,000!
 
My vacuboom has four sections. I never measured it but I think it is 20 feet long. Anywhere you wash is going to have some kind of slope to it even if it is not noticeable at first. If your having problems withthe water running in all directions move the vehicle.



Usually water will run in one or two directions. If not it will puddel on the ground for you to vac up.



After the detail, we remove the vehicle from the spot where we washed it and and pressure wash the ground into the vacuboom to make sure we don't leave any "funk" on the ground.
 
Thanks! I think the 20 ft. is about the most expensive...over 2k? You are right about the water. Most parking lots must be graded so that water does not puddle because that causes problems. I appreciate you sharing about the boom because I was going for the mat at first. I am also curious as to how well QEW works as I've seen Scott Wax use it and have good results. I am still hesitant because I have that ol' feeling that I will scratch a dirty car without being able to rinse first.



Rob
 
I just got a talking to from the water quality inspestor today. By luck there was no storm drains where I was washing and he was not going to give me hard time about discharging wash water on the ground. I guess I better look into the vacuboom before I get run out of town. He did say that small amounts of vehicle wash water can be disposed onto grass or landscaped areas.
 
Ok, here is a perfect example of the people who make the laws. I emailed them on monday, today is friday and got no answer, jsut a stupid little automated message with a reference #.



SO if they dont get back to me, then what am i going to do.....



I checked that link above, it looks like a generic link, not an epa link. It had good info, but if it's not from the source, i need more info.



That link also said...

"The only time this is not true is if the storm sewer system itself discharges to a sewage treatment plant, in which case, the sewer system is called a combined sewer. "



I think NYC has a water sewer plant, but i am not sure.
 
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