First time with a rotary - frustration, reflection and admiration

Well said Hondaman. Take for instance some of the detailers at your local car markets. I've seen training of 1 panel of a car to a 16 year old kid with improper products and technique.....then they expect profection?

A great example of what not to do is stated in EBVcivicSI's (Joe's) thread on the Cady he just re-did from what the dealership provided. Click Here As an off the lot purchase (brand new) the Porter/detailer used a wool pad and a rotary. :nono
 
Nick, since you're pretty good with cutting machines, let me ask you a question: I mentioned elsewhere that over the weekend I tackled my sister's scratch on her 2003 Honda Odyssey minivan. About a 14" scratch across the driver-side door and the sliding door.

I did PC passes at Speed 6, Orange SONUS (light cutting) pad with SSR 1, 2, and then 2.5. Then 2 MF towel by hand rubbing attempts with Meguiars Scratch X and then I did a MF handrub with 2.5 and then 1 more PC run with 2.5. The PC runs lasted about 20 seconds; the by-hand rubs lasted 30-45 seconds. It faded alot, but it's still visible if you're right on top.

Poorboy suggested I want to be careful that some scratches are too deep. I understand; I felt the scratch and it was borderline as to whether or not I could "feel" it or not...so it was probably borderline as to how deep it was (I think it was a shopping cart in a parking lot, FWIW).

Question: I'm going to order SSR 3.0 and give it 1 or 2 passes with the PC at Speed 6. If it's still there, that's it. It's a leased car, and it looks better not worse, so even if my steps above led me to cut into the "clearcoat" or paint (I doubt it, FWIW) my sister's not going to bother me about it. It's not a Ferrari -- :)

Besides, it DOES look better, esp. with the EX-P over the whole thing. I just want your opinion if SSR 3.0 after all that is likely to do anything -- I assume I can't really do too much damage with the PC.
 
Definitely give SSR3 a whirl. I've used it a number of times with great results. Even with the PC, your not going to damage the paint like you "could" with a rotary, even with applied pressure.

I did a similar scratch removal on a 2001 VW Beetle. It should still be listed on here if you do a search. The methods I had to use were "unconventional", but the results came out great.

You've got the name of the game though, if you can totally fix it, hide it. Play around with some combos to see if you can make it less visible.
 
The scratch was easily visible to my sister from 10-15 feet away....she had to be about 2-3 feet away to see it after I did all those runs and then covered it with EX-P.

I don't know when she got the scratch, but these salesmen are telling people not to wax/detail their cars for like the first 6-months because "it's got clearocat." My brother was told that when he bought his Accord and he also got a scratch (our sister's son and his bike -- !!) and both scratches on both Honda's might have been lessened if there were 1-2 coats of sealant on these cars.

These things are what led me to ask about detailing from a DC member here when I bought my new car (of course, another Honda!). You need protection on a vehicle and why these salesman and car dealers are telling folks not to do anything is asinine. Yes, the cars are better with clearcoat than just exposed paint -- but clearcoat covered by some layers is even better. My sisters car was just starting to get some white nicks on her hood because she had little protection there. I had the same nicks on my Saturn at it's end, but by then I didn't care since it was 10 years old and the car's low hood got hundreds of these little nicks all over the front. Looked like the moon with all the craters!
 
Your thread has given me some confidence. I'm getting better all the time with my makita rotary. Want to master it since I am going to be starting my own business soon. Do as much as I can by hand but will break out the rotary if necessary.

These are the things I learnt from just watching classic car restoration on how to channel the other week

Don't apply a vice like grip to the handle (my first mistake)
Mist the foam pad and surface with water before buffing (4 for pad, 2 for surface)
Keep the pad totally flat on most panels
On door panels - hold the buffer in the centre instead of the handle (makes doing those panels easier)
1100-1650 RPM in most cases is all that is needed
Overlap each pass slightly

Unfortunately I had to begin practicing with the rotary with a lambswool pad and really liked using it on the old car's around the place.
Now with Meg's Mirror glaze and EDGE 2000 foam pads, I am really enjoying using the rotary. Will be working on my mates 1983 Toyota Corolla sedan with the foam pads I will experiment with PPG single cut 1500 grit, Menzerna Power Gloss 1000 grit, 3M P II Rubbing, Farecla G3, G10, Malco Rejuvinator, Poorboys SSR 2.5, SSR 3 and Menzerna Ip/Fp

Should come up good, it's dark grey now instead of white but I'll make it polar white by the time I'm finished with it.

P.S. you'll know straight away if you burn the paint- you will smell it immediately.
 
Nickc0844 said:
The main thing is time for sure. I apprenticed at a body shop to "learn" the knowledge, but applying them by myself without them there was a different story. The more and more you use it, the better you'll get. It certainly wasn't like a PC where you basically got the hang of it after a few panels :D
Click to expand...

Thanks for the encouragement. I did a few panels tonight, and again was near giving up. It just takes such a long time for me to do each panel :(
 
FWIW, mistakes can be made at any time.

I have burned rubber trim twice with a PC this year (once on my wifes car) and have have no mistakes with the rotary and this is the first year I've been using it.
 
I am, I do not regret it. The DeWalt I tried in the past was heavier and louder with no extra positive features.
 
Is there any "value" to polishing minor defects with a rotary at a speed of under 1000rpm? Maybe this could be "safer" for those very anxious about it but have practiced a bit already and want to do "a good car" with it?
 
Bill D said:
If you want, get an infrared therometer and point it at the paint 100 degrees plus is starting to get into potential danger territory IIRC
Click to expand...
Sounds like a great idea, it should be very interesting. I'll use it this evening and see what temperature I'm reaching.

SVR said:
Keep the pad totally flat on most panels
On door panels - hold the buffer in the centre instead of the handle (makes doing those panels easier)
1100-1650 RPM in most cases is all that is needed
Overlap each pass slightly
Click to expand...

I'm working at a slight angle on all panels!? I tried holding the rotary totally flat but didn't get the feeling of control I wanted.

Door panels have been causing me the biggest problems - feeling awkward. I'll try holding it in the centre. Thanks!

The Chee said:
Are you guys all using Makita?
Click to expand...
I'm using a rotary from "FLEX Powertools". Their website looks really chep, but IMHO the tools are of the finest quality.

I'm not sure if they are available in the US...
 
I have the Makita 9227C X3 Polisher & Light Sander and I love the variable speed option on it .. I use it on my own car and all my friends and clients vehicles regardless of the age of the car.. I practiced (still practicing) on my truck and have not yet messed any sections up... I found the following article very informative.. I changed a few of my techniques after reading this and I feel more confident every time I use my Rotary. I feel if given the proper time and patience, using the rotary pays off in the long run... which might not be that long for some. Keep at it and have some fun..........

Become A Buffing Pro and Buff Away Your Paint Blemishes

TC
:brick
 
That is a very good article. Keep in mind they are referring to a repainted vehicle.
Many of the principles apply, but factory finishes are a lot more difficult to remove wet sanding scratches from.
 
Yes Chee, I too am using the Makita rotary. I made my choice after trying out the Dewalt and Chicago ones as well; to me, the Makita just worked better for me.
 
Now I'm finally done. The car turned out alright - most of all I'm proud do have used a rotary without inflicting to much damage to the car ;)

One problem: Polish (Menzerna PowerGloss) is "high-lighting" blemishes (ie chips )on the hood. What to do?
 
The chip repair can be a big project itself. Typically will require good factory touch paint and clear ,( could also try one of those paint scratch pens) wetsandpaper and Mother Chip Repair ( Langka) following up with a light polish.

If you're lucky to have black, I've read some accounts of some filling in extremely tiny, pin hole shaped chips with a black Sharpie permanent marker. I'm sure that require religious refilling though.
 
Since getting back into detailing (I've loved doing it since I was a teenager) I will probably be doing my in-laws vehicle. It isn't in horrible condition, but it's got some definite issues, which would tempt me to consider using a rotary.

However, I think I will take the safe route and stay with my PC and use a cutting pad.

You guys that have the Rotary down get my respect! :wow
 
Like Nick, I learned under the good eye and demonstration of an experienced detailer. We used a DeWalt rotary which is quite heavy but a solid piece of gear.

We had a used 4 year old Camry which needed a deeper polish. Using DACP we got superb results. You have to move slow and keep the rotary as flat as possible and really watch for creases in the body panels. We used Megs pads.
 
Bill D said:
If you want, get an infrared therometer and point it at the paint 100 degrees plus is starting to get into potential danger territory IIRC
Click to expand...

I'm new to the rotary as well, but is 100 degrees really too hot? I would think it has to get alot hotter than that to cause problems.

Just for a reference point I decided to check my car. It's 76 and sunny outside at the moment. I just checked the hood of my car (sitting in the sun) with an IR thermo and its at 130 degrees. I know its been alot hotter than that at other times and never had any problems with the paint. :dunno
 
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