Dawn - is it harmful or not?

In the entire time I have been at Autopia, this Dawn debate has raged on. However, this thread has been the most civil and useful.



My take on the whole thing? Use Dawn if you want to. Don't if you don't. One of the main reasons I don't use Dawn is that it is not as free rising as car wash. And for paint cleaning, I have 3M SMR, DACP, Mother's pre-wax cleaner, a variety of Meguiar's paint cleaners, and AIO. I really don't see the need for a Dawn wash. If I didn't have any of these, then it might make sense for me to use Dawn.



As for Dawn being harmful or not to hands, I would assert that it's a slightly different situation than a car's trim (after all, that's where most of the concern of using Dawn is, not the clearcoat). The trim on your car does not slough off and grow fresh skin. It also cannot absorb the same amount of moisturizers that we point on our hands. And lastly, it's not an organic entity, which will recover from damage, like our skin, which is the largest organ on our bodies.



I reiterate, use Dawn if you like; don't if you don't, but I don't think we can base it on whether it's safer for your hands of utensils or dishes (after all, our dishes are put in the dishwashers with harsh detergents, and they survive, why don't we use the same detergents on our cars?) :nixweiss
 
I totallly agree. Use what you are comfortable with. I think the consensus is that in a bind DAWN is not going to harm anything. As for the trim, dawn might have a drying effect, similar to using a cleaner like Fantastic on Vinyl seats. What gets me is the same guy that knocks dawn for being too harsh grabs a bottle of solvent based trim dressing and dresses away...only to find the material brown and degrading after a few washes and what do they do???? Apply more dressing.... DOH!!
 
Good point. As long as Dawn isn't used in your regular routine, I don't think anyone should lose any sleep over it.
 
Just to add a bit more perspective, using a product like Dawn before Zaino is a good idea especially if you're not going to polish or clean the paint prior. Not every Zaino (or whatever) customer polishes their paint, and few of them have a clue whether or not the product they're using has cleaning/polishing ability. And who knows what is on their paint now. So recommending Dawn or similar for that first wash is a good idea to help ensure complete bonding. But if you're not using a real polymer sealant, what you wash with probably doesn't matter.
 
been a long time since i visited the board. glad to see this post because i totally forgot which soap it was until I read this post. lol
 
I've never found absolute proof that car wash detergents are inherently paint safe, gentler, or any different chemically than dish washing detergents. Marketing folks make these claims of course, but when reviewing MSDS information, they end up looking pretty much the same.



In using Dawn and other detergent based cleaners on paint and plastic materials in the house I've never observed damage resulting from it. Nor have I been able to find damage on vehicle paint or plastic.



I have observed that Dawn is a more agressive cleaner than many of the car type cleaners, but only marginally so. Mostly this is observed as a mechanic trying to clean up greasy hands. Dawn does a better job of cleaning my filthy greasy grimy hands...maybe. Palmolive is even better than Dawn at cleaning greasy hands, and Marge used to soak customers hands in it (remember that old ad?).



More important seems to be the enthusiasm of the act of washing, and the number of times its performed on a given day. It's just like washing dishes. A cursory swipe of the sponge gives cursory results. An ethusiastic scrubbing, rinse and repeat gives very clean dishes, and a very clean car.



To that end, a very clean car can be rather scary. All the oils and silicones and things that have been done to make aging paint look pretty and shiny are stripped away, and the aged paint, well, it shows its age.



Just some ruminations on thorough cleaning.
 
I think the difference between Dawn and say Meg's Gold Class is that Dawn has a higher concentration of Ethyl Alcohol (somewhere in the neighborhood of 10%) than GC (which is .5%). It's the Ethyl Alcohol that "breaks up grease and takes it out of your way" to quote their advertising.
 
In all the time that I've been on this and other discussion boards, almost all of the comments about the dangers of Dawn are of this variety: "never found absolute proof it causes damage, but..."

I, for one, would really like to see something objective that shows damage with the occasional Dawn use we "Zaino Zealots" suggest. With as much Dawn use as goes on, something factual ought to be out there. Certainly all of us have accidentally applied much stronger chemicals like wheel cleaners, etc on our finish and with reasonable quick rinsing have only rarely seen problems. Today's paints and clearcoats are tough.
 
Maybe this would be a good side study for Geekysteve and the Guru reports, to wash a panel every day with Dawn for a month, and other panels with other car soaps, all panels starting with a standard cleaner wax. Hey, a car wash test!
 
Corey Bit Spank said:
I believe you can't use V2.1 before v3.14597... because if you do the ratio of bad apples to good apples will be disproportional even though the oranges make up for it. Or this is what Sal told me. :o
Click to expand...



AHAHAHAAH :rofl
 
2wheelsx2 said:
Maybe this would be a good side study for Geekysteve and the Guru reports, to wash a panel every day with Dawn for a month, and other panels with other car soaps, all panels starting with a standard cleaner wax. Hey, a car wash test!
Click to expand...



What are the chances of selling all y'all a report like this? :D Steve and I would be happy to do this as long as we can make $$$ at it. :xyxthumbs



Seriously, most car washes are so similar, a test like this would be 10X harder to implement than the glass cleaner test, which was challenging enough to differentiate product performance.



This might be a good project for a select group of Autopians. Develop your own test methodology and post results. Just an idea....
 
I think they were refering to Dawn .. and to see if it is harmful ..



I do know that a single strong Dawn wash won't remove #16.
 
Jesstzn said:
I think they were refering to Dawn .. and to see if it is harmful ..



I do know that a single strong Dawn wash won't remove #16.
Click to expand...
I distinctly remember a thread a long time ago where people were agreeing that it was less than effective on #26 as well.



For prep, I think a Dawn wash isn't necessarily a bad idea, but for stripping wax I wouldn't recommend it because it's just not reliable and consistent for that.
 
Detergents differ typically by how concentrated they are and by their pH. In general the higher the pH (more basic) the stronger the detergent.
 
I really do not see the big deal about a pre-Zaino polish application Dawn wash. :nixweiss. It is Sal's way of making the a surface as carnuaba/oil-free as possible without requiring an expensive specialize product. Many that have never used Zaino complain that its application is so difficult, which it isn't or more complex than other sealants - apply- let dry - buff off. Can you imagine the up-roar if before one should applied Zaino that you clean the finish with a 1:64 solution of a professional de-waxing product. :shocked.

The fact is the majority of vehicle owners use dishwashing detergent to wash their vehicles. Theirs vehicles may not looks as nice as ours :D but neither have I noticed that their clearcoat or paint is falling off, grossly dull or their trim shoot to hell.

Personally, I believe these discussions are indirect shots a Zaino since it is hard to find fault with the product itself. Criticizing the pre-application regimen reflectives negatively on Zaino to the uninformed or novice. :nixweiss

Zaino is not for everyone, but it is an excellent product line with no more of a complicated pre-application process (PREP) than any other sealants. JMHO
 
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