Dawn Detergent

carpetyd said:
Uh, okay so most of the Pebble Beach winners SAY they use Mequiars & most of the big street guys agree. I know some that do not use certain products, but say they do for obvious reasons.



What happened to the other guys that use other products and were winners at Pebble Beach? Nobody is telling you what products to use, so why would anyone, I am sure Barry would not, be critical of other cleaning methods, unless of course you profit from these products. Mequiars has some great products, some I use, but what car or paint manufacturer recommends their car wash?



BTW, you would be suprised that a quite a few entrants at the 2006 Radnor Hunt Concours D'Elegance use dawn.
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I love faulty logic. virtually EVERY car maker recommends the use of a good quality CAR WASH soap. Meguiar's car washes fit that description. Automobile manufacturers specifically advise AGAINST using dishwashing soap.



Again, one simple question for you Dawn users:



WHICH AUTOMOBILE OR PAINT MANUFACTURER RECOMMENDS DISHWASHING SOAP? (Hell, even the owners manuals on my '04 Mach1, '05 Subaru Legacy Gt and '05 F250 caution against washing with dishwashing soap.)



I know, I know.... Sal Zaino has unlocked the secrets of paint care. Secrets that even the companies that make the **** are too dumb to uncover.
 
I have used it once on my car when it was brand new (6 years ago) to start the Zaino regimen.



If you keep up the regimen of your product of choice, there will be no need to use Dawn again.



It's not a good idea for continued use because it removes oils that keep rubber and weatherstipping pliable.
 
I think the whole Dawn thing with Zaino is because Dawn does remove greae/oil. These would interfere with proper bonding to the paint. I've noticed that if I'm working on my car and put my greasy hand on the paint :nervous: it usually will not come off with regular car wash soap.

Now, there are products made specificaly for this (paint prep sprays) but I don't think the average person has these handy, therefor the Dawn recommendation.

Do I use Dawn? Not since I was a teenager and washed with dishwashing liquid, and yes, a broom :shocked Car wash removes road grime and dirt better and safer (more lubrication0 than dishwashing liquid, Dawn removes oil and food better.

Disclaimer: I am NOT an expert on the subject nor have I ever entered a Concours event. I am not a professional detailer either. Just my theory/opinion.
 
I'm not one of the people who thinks Dawn is something awful to use on a vehicle and I recall a thread that compared the actual composition of Dawn with some carwash shampoos (they're pretty similar). And the AutoInt "A" product that I use from time to time is a *lot* harsher than Dawn and hasn't hurt anything I've used it on. AND, more significantly, if somebody's happy with what they're using then that's cool with me. BUT:



I find that Dawn has very little lubricity and only marginal encapuslation, two characteristics that I value in a carwash shampoo because of the way they contribute to a marring-free wash. Dawn isn't the easiest product to rinse off completely either, but that's not a bid deal to me. Still, because of the lubricity/encapsulation issues, *functionally speaking*, IMO there are better products available for routine washing and I prefer to use the best product for a given job (and yeah, sometimes that's Dawn, for one reason or another). If somebody doesn't value lubricity or encapsulation, well, OK, that's up to them. But all things being equal, products that do possess the various characteristics that are of value in a [given product category] are better than products that *do not* possess those characteristics.
 
The thread got temporarily hijacked by people who want to see who's pedistal is higher.

My question may be repetitive, but I'm a noob and want things answered for my specific situation.

I mostly agree with 06E90's comments.

I don't have it as part of my regular wash. I use it at the beginning of the year when I haven't put time into my car because of the New England winter. So I usually use Dawn once at the beginning of the season.

I want to know if it is a really bad thing or not so bad.

And from there I think Accumulator answered that well. Now if only I knew what products do the same thing as good but with more lubricity/encapsulation.



And for the record, I've never ever heard of Dawn being used for washing cars as a result of some marketing trick. It just makes sense because it is strong and designed for grease (wax is a hydrocarbon too, like dissolves like). Now I have a clear look to evaluate my paint and come up with a game plan.
 
The thread got temporarily hijacked by people who want to see who's pedistal is higher.
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Welcome to Autopia then, we all like to hold our values and techniques, very high up on a pedistal, thus the varying O P I N I O N S .......
 
a.k.a. Patrick said:
Welcome to Autopia then, we all like to hold our values and techniques, very high up on a pedistal, thus the varying O P I N I O N S .......
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Right, NORMAL ideas, like most here have. Not people saying CONCOURS events are made or broke by using Dawn of all things.....for the love of god....I think I've heard it all now.
 
STG said:
Sal Zaino used Dawn in creating the Zaino mythology. Who except Zaino advises its use on automobile finishes? Why does anyone need to "de-wax" paint prior to claying, polishing or applying waxes with cleaners? NAME ONE AUTOMOBILE MANUFACTURER OR PAINT MANUFACTURER THAT RECOMMENDS DAWN.



The Dawn wash is just one part of a very successful marketing program that involves the consumer in a non conforming special process intended to make products appear more exclusive and desirable. Price imparts a degree of exclusiveness, but it is the consumers investment of time, from Dawn washes to mixing components to applying multiple layers of sealent in a series of invariable steps that creates a loyal following.



Automobile detailing is 99% preperation and skill. The results are highly subjective. I contend that anyone who invests time and money in a particlar system, will see better results in their minds. "Hey, I just spent 10 hours on my paint and I don't want to hear any crap about the other guy's wax being better than the one I used!"



That is exactly why many on this site are defensive about what products they like. That's why Zaino has his followers, Meguiar has his minions (not that Barry would be caught dead being part of a minion - think about it) and other manufacturers have repeat customers



I'm sorry, but I rank Dawn washes with drinking poisoned Kool-Aid in Africa, drinking poisoned Kool-aid in San Diego waiting for the Mother Ship, baracading myself in a farmhouse in Texas, or being on fire for Jesus to keep my job.
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Classic. :chuckle:
 
If Dawn is known to remove wax/sealant from paint surfaces, that would be enough reason for me to never use it on a regular basis. As much as I love my car, I have no desire to seal and wax it every time I wash it. No way.
 
Nimble said:
Right, NORMAL ideas, like most here have. Not people saying CONCOURS events are made or broke by using Dawn of all things.....for the love of god....I think I've heard it all now.
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In response to all who question the use of Dawn. No one ever stated that it was required to win a concours event, I was simply responding to the original post requesting the use of this product. Dawn has been used by individuals who have won concours events & if they are satisfied with it's results then they should continue to use it. This forum is for exchanging ideas about car detailing. I have not been critical of any other products nor do I expect others to be critical of our methods.

BTW, there is a way of increasing the encapsulation of this product, but I won't go there.
 
15951 said:
If Dawn is known to remove wax/sealant from paint surfaces, that would be enough reason for me to never use it on a regular basis. As much as I love my car, I have no desire to seal and wax it every time I wash it. No way.
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Exactly! I can maybe understand someone's logic of using it once or twice a year when they do their full detail, but certainly never on a regular basis.
 
http://autopia.org/forum/detailing-...inks-dawn-removes-wax-car.html?highlight=dawn

I washed, clayed, and waxed (natty's blue) a red audi a few weeks ago. Just over 3 weeks. It had been hosed off a few times and washed a few times.



I started out with normal car wash and nadda, nothing wax was still there. The paint was in bad shape so i knew it was just the wax.



So i mixed up dawn in my foam gun and soaked the car for 5 min. Rewashed with sheepskin. and nothing.



As you can see the beading is still wonderfull.



So i am curious what to use to remove old wax.



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PS the curvature of the car distorts my shape, normally i am twice this fat!

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carpetyd said:
In response to all who question the use of Dawn. No one ever stated that it was required to win a concours event, I was simply responding to the original post requesting the use of this product. Dawn has been used by individuals who have won concours events & if they are satisfied with it's results then they should continue to use it. This forum is for exchanging ideas about car detailing. I have not been critical of any other products nor do I expect others to be critical of our methods.

BTW, there is a way of increasing the encapsulation of this product, but I won't go there.
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Why would you take the time to figure out how to increase the encapsulation potential of Dawn when there are so many fantastic products out there that are specifically made to address this need?



Please don't take this as an attack. I don't care if you wash your car with pig snot if that works for you, but I don't understand reinventing the wheel.
 
15951 said:
Why would you take the time to figure out how to increase the encapsulation potential of Dawn when there are so many fantastic products out there that are specifically made to address this need?



Please don't take this as an attack. I don't care if you wash your car with pig snot if that works for you, but I don't understand reinventing the wheel.
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I have tried all & there is only one other shelf product I would use to wash. Like you said it works for me. Dawn does not remove all sealants.
 
beading happens no matter what if the right mist is applied - wax has some to do with it, but not everything....



why take the time to wash with dawn and worry about it if you are going to polish with abrasives anyway...the abrasives will strip the wax much faster than washing with dawn will...use what you want, but when you start to see the rubber drying out much faster than normal, think twice about what you are using on it...
 
carpetyd said:
In response to all who question the use of Dawn. No one ever stated that it was required to win a concours event, I was simply responding to the original post requesting the use of this product. Dawn has been used by individuals who have won concours events & if they are satisfied with it's results then they should continue to use it. This forum is for exchanging ideas about car detailing. I have not been critical of any other products nor do I expect others to be critical of our methods.

BTW, there is a way of increasing the encapsulation of this product, but I won't go there.
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With all due respect, MOST people couldn't tell the difference between a sealent/wax on a clean car, let alone a different wash product. Plain fact is that, a clean, polished car with a coat of some LSP will look 98% no matter what. It's that last 2% that you guys seem to fret over, no one else cares. To them the damn car looks clean and shiny!
 
BeatDeadHorse.gif




Pre-emptive warning . . . this oft-repeated topic always has the potential to spiral out of control. Please, everyone, remain civil if you choose to participate.



Tort

(moderator)
 
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