Constant browning of tires...

[Jesstzn]

Sounds to me like you're taking this out of context.



Talking about washing your car prior to adding new layers of wax or sealant, and using a safe and effective product to get your tires clean are not the same thing and should not be construed as "bias".



After reading your comments here and in the thread you provided, it's pretty clear you are as biased (and confused) as anyone here on these subjects.

Rubber is rubber and alkaline is alkaline .. no matter where you put it .. My point is that in one place its a no no to use an alkaline product on rubber .. but in another its fine because it is the "in" product.

 

[imported_BretFraz]

So the rubber composition of tires is exactly the same as the rubber composition of, say, bumper trim?



And all alkaline products perform and react exactly the same way when applied to rubber?



Let's keep product trends out of this discussion for now. We all have our favorites.

 

[boywonder]

Maybe we ought to start "Bleche-White" Anonymous.



In my years prior to Autopia, I was a HEAVY Bleche White user. Whitewalls, blackwalls, it didn't make a difference to me. All I cared about was the results (Clean tires). In some cases, I even used the stuff on the interior of the car to clean the vinyl. (I know, I know, but I didn't know any better at the time).



It was an encounter with an old school Autopia vet on Maxima.org that changed my mind about using this stuff. However, even before that encounter, I would use Espree's wheel cleaner as a tire cleaner but it wasn't as effective as I liked. In addition, what geekysteve said is correct. If you have used the stuff and started coughing or your nose started running, it was the chemicals. There have been several instances where I either coughed or my eyes teared up because of it.



Since then, I have been using EFHI to clean both the wheels and tires.

 

[DaGonz]

Kumho tires.



I was shopping for tires for the Lexus, and when reading reviews of Kumho tires a LOT of the people condemned the quick browning of the tires...

The Mustang in the "stable" has Kumho tires. they have not "browned" at all.

 

[topnotchtouch]

There is a good thread on Tire Treatments over on Showcargarage.com in which Mike Phillips put up a very informative post on this very subject.. Below is a link to the thread, just scroll down to his post.



http://www.showcargarage.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=162&highlight=tire+brown



Here are a few other good links as well.



http://www.303products.com/techinfo/tires1.htm



http://www.properautocare.com/whyaretirbla.html



http://www.autoeducation.com/carcare/tires.htm



http://www.autoint.com/Basics of tire vinyl leather protection.htm



The jist is "blooming" is not a "bad" thing. The tires are designed from the manufacturer to do that to prolong the life of the tire. You definitely don't want to use harsh detergents on your tires, it will just shorten the life of the tire in the long run. I usually just use the same car wash soap I use on the paint, either Gold Class Car Wash or #62 Professional Car Wash with a tire brush and then top with Orginal Formula Enduarance. My tires come out black :xyxthumbs

 

[Steve @ Guru]

Rubber is rubber and alkaline is alkaline .. no matter where you put it .. My point is that in one place its a no no to use an alkaline product on rubber .. but in another its fine because it is the "in" product.

It would be one thing if we were only comparing the respective pH's of a product, but we're not. Bleche White's pH isn't that high - something around a 10.5 or so.



It's what's in the product that raises concern - I've witnessed it turn many tires chalky grey after just an use or two. That's not cool in my book - as others have noted, the product literally eats the waxes and carbon black from the tires. What comes next is premature drying and accelerated deterioration from environmental nasties like UV and ozone.



So rather than assume that we're all out "to get Bleche White" just because you believe it has a high pH is incorrect. If you're having good luck with Bleche White, then excellent - keep using it... Don't let our experiences ruin yours.



Finally, if "rubber is rubber," why is there such a tremendous variance in tire compounds, prices, uses, etc.? And why are there tens of thousands of different rubber formulas and variations? I guess the scientists and companies that make rubber products must be really bored....

 

[Jesstzn]

There is a good thread on Tire Treatments over on Showcargarage.com in which Mike Phillips put up a very informative post on this very subject.. Below is a link to the thread, just scroll down to his post.



http://www.showcargarage.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=162&highlight=tire+brown



Here are a few other good links as well.



http://www.303products.com/techinfo/tires1.htm



http://www.properautocare.com/whyaretirbla.html



http://www.autoeducation.com/carcare/tires.htm



The jist is "blooming" is not a "bad" thing. The tires are designed from the manufacturer to do that.

Mikes post makes perfect sense and if anything says Bleech Wite AND EFHI are too harsh for tires and thier Antiozonant. And I quote him "Because your tires contain a limited amount of antiozonants, harsh detergents and other cleaning agents should be avoided because these types of product tend to clean too well and can remove or strip the original antiozonants from the surface. Instead, use a gentle cleaner, or premium quality car wash soap. " And to me something that is alkaline and a pH of 13 is far from a gentle cleaner.



The point I am trying to make here is someone posts looking for an answer and I give them one then I am crapped all over and the "Harsh" cleaner I use is dumped all over because its not the "in today " harsh cleaner that people use because it is not sold in excluseive detailing sights.



If we all did the tire cleaning properly keeping the rubber compound integrity in mind we would all have nicely dressed different shades of black/brown/grey tires on our cars.



I think if you look at the original posting from GTI2001 he is not asking about the goods/ bads and the uglies of tire cleaners he is asking how to not have brown tires and I quote "Everytime I clean the tires on my car, they come out brownish after they dry" "they seem to come out brown after I let them air dry. I can't stand looking at brown tires!"

 

[Steve @ Guru]

Well, sort of and not really.



You're mistakenly thinking that we're attacking you because you recommended a product that "isn't cool" (or whatever)...that's not the case - we're simply trying to point out that it's well known that Bleche White isn't the best choice for cleaning tires safely. You're confusing our points with personal attacks - that's not the case! Heck, you even started your first thread with "I know I'll be flamed for this..." so I think you were setting the stage (in your mind) that this was going to be a personal debate. You also then generalized the entire argument with a very false claim of "rubber's rubber" and tried to equate Dawn to Bleche White...eeek!



The overall pH has little to do with the product's ability to turn tires grey and leach out the protectants that are present in tires.



It's not the pH alone that determines the 'safety' of a cleaner. As I indicated earlier, Bleche White has a pH that's much lower than EF-HI. In the posts you referenced, Mike makes no mention of EF-HI being harsh on tires - he just comments that "harsh" cleaners should be avoided. Harshness alone is not directly equal to high pH. (Repeat that 10x)



Like I said earlier - if you're using Bleche White and having good results with it, by all means, don't let us stop you from using it. But, don't confuse the facts about what's in it and what it's capable of doing. I'm willing to bet that if you're honest with yourself, and you used Bleche White without any dressing afterwards, you'll notice that your tires turn a pale shade of grey.

 

[GoodnClean]

The Mustang in the "stable" has Kumho tires. they have not "browned" at all.

I dont have them myself, but I was just saying what I heard

 

[wtwt]

might not should put my thoghts into this, but I have a set of michelins that get brown on them

the only way I can get it off is to clean them with cleaner and scrub alot. I put meg. endurance on them but after a little while they turn brown again.

 

[imported_Intermezzo]

The point I am trying to make here is someone posts looking for an answer and I give them one then I am crapped all over and the "Harsh" cleaner I use is dumped all over because its not the "in today " harsh cleaner that people use because it is not sold in excluseive detailing sights.

No flames intended, but can you show me where in this thread this occured? I believe we all have a right to post a differing opinion...no?? You certainly have a right to defend Blech White to the death, but I don't think it's right to suggest you're getting "dumped" simply because we present differing opinions and experiences.