Collinite 915 on top of 845

[imported_FJF]

In FJF's case, he's probably got so many coats of wax on his car that the finish is gummy and everything on God's green earth sticks to it which makes it lose its effectiveness. AND his car's probably not prepped very well, so there's another thing that can cause loss of durability.

While I admire your ability to peer into a crystal ball and arrive at a conclusion contrary to the reality of the situation, such a lose grasp of the facts doesn't exactly convey the impression of cognitive competence.

FJF- As I've probably advised before, try multiple layers of KSG or FK1000P. Multiple being six or so. Even Collinite 476S sometimes fails kinda fast on an outside 24/7 vehicle, though I don't know why the performance is so inconsistent. I've had it last months on one car, but only weeks on another- same prep, same care, parked in exactly the same spot at the same time of year :nixweiss

I'll definitely give KSG a shot. Someone whose opinion I trust suggested that the issue may be driven by silicone contamination. Though I wipe down each panel with IPA and HT Silicone Remover least three times after polishing, that may not be enough. I'd like to find some Dow Corning OS-2 Silicone Cleaner and Surface Prep Solvent, which is said to be a more powerful option.

 

[Apollo_Auto]

While I admire your ability to peer into a crystal ball and arrive at a conclusion contrary to the reality of the situation, such a lose grasp of the facts doesn't exactly convey the impression of cognitive competence.

Well FJF I wish I could say I admire your smart-a$$ attitude, but I don't. How long did it take you to write such a smart-sounding sentence? Anyway, yes I'll admit I got a little off the main concern, being durability, when I referred to "shine" but if you want to split hairs the 2 characteristics (shine and durability) go hand in hand. If the wax you're applying looks its absolute best, then chances are it will also perform its absolute best... again, it all boils down to the prep. Being that you have "multiple layers of 1000P, 845, 476, JW AJ, etc." you obviously can't grasp that concept, but yet you feel the need to belittle a professional detailer that's been doing this for years when he tries to give you friendly advice. Do you ask for a receipt when someone buys you a gift?



I waxed my car last December before the really bad weather came (I live in Hungary so believe me our winters can be just as harsh as NY winters)... Want to know what I waxed it with? Dodo Juice Hard Candy, 1 layer. It was still beading at the end of April before I stripped it off and applied a new layer. Now you've applied all these layers of this and that so why is it that you can't get decent durability out of them? I mean really, I used a boutique wax and you used several waxes that are all renowned for their durability... what gives? Well, I won't tell you again, but I think you know what I'd like to say. Based on your intellectual-sounding responses you probably know a heck of a lot more about this and everything else than I do, so break out your credit card and buy yourself another tub of wax to add to the several that you've already applied... wax manufacturers love sheep like you.



And BTW, I don't need a crystal ball to tell you why you're not getting decent durability from the 1000 waxes you've applied... obviously it's not my competence that's in question here.

 

[imported_FJF]

Well FJF I wish I could say I admire your smart-a$$ attitude, but I don't. How long did it take you to write such a smart-sounding sentence?

Given the quote below, your actions only serve to underline my previous comment.

Being that you have "multiple layers of 1000P, 845, 476, JW AJ, etc." you obviously can't grasp that concept...

As I've already said more than once, the products were not on the paint at the same time. They were listed as examples of LSPs used over the last 3 years. Can you tell me again how I'm the one who fails to grasp a concept, when proof of unyielding cranial density is quoted right above?

but yet you feel the need to belittle a professional detailer that's been doing this for years when he tries to give you friendly advice. Do you ask for a receipt when someone buys you a gift?

I didn't realize that you were doing me a favor by completely ignoring the facts. Clearly, you have absolutely no idea as to the scope of the situation and cannot grasp the constants at hand, as has been shown over and over. Yet, you keep coming back with another dubious notion seemingly geared to boost whatever preconceived idea lies behind the condescending rhetoric. Now you're upset, because your (supposed) advice isn't well-regraded. Sorry.

I waxed my car last December before the really bad weather came (I live in Hungary so believe me our winters can be just as harsh as NY winters)... Want to know what I waxed it with? Dodo Juice Hard Candy, 1 layer. It was still beading at the end of April before I stripped it off and applied a new layer. Now you've applied all these layers of this and that so why is it that you can't get decent durability out of them?

<sigh> This isn't my only car. As I've said before (is there an echo in here), my other cars don't react to LSPs like this one. It's very frustrating. I've tried almost everything imaginable with equally dismal results. I'm going to say this again so there's no misunderstand. Please read this carefully. All of my cars, except for one, respond well to LSPs. However, one car in particular doesn't. Just because you waxed your car and a LSP worked out well, doesn't mean that it will on my Mazda, the car in question. I really don't know why that's so difficult to grasp.

I mean really, I used a boutique wax and you used several waxes that are all renowned for their durability... what gives? Well, I won't tell you again, but I think you know what I'd like to say. Based on your intellectual-sounding responses you probably know a heck of a lot more about this and everything else than I do....

Errr...I most certainly do know more about the paintwork on this car that you. I've worked on it for 3 years; you've never even seen it.



Please recall that I never asked for advice, but I did point out that your claims weren't universally applicable and cited one of my cars as an example. This seemed to have unnerved you and here were are.

...so break out your credit card and buy yourself another tub of wax to add to the several that you've already applied... wax manufacturers love sheep like you.

I like to think that I can afford to spend $11, but I appreciate your concern for my financial health. As we've already determined, you know zero about this situation. Even when told directly about it, you completely ignore the written word. Comically, you complain about being insulted, while uploading comments like the above. With all this in mind, can you briefly explain why anyone with an IQ in the tipple digits shouldn't see your so-called advice as an exercise in absurdity?

 

[Apollo_Auto]

As I've already said more than once, the products were not on the paint at the same time. They were listed as examples of LSPs used over the last 3 years. Can you tell me again how I'm the one who fails to grasp a concept, when proof of unyielding cranial density is quoted right above?

You say that they weren’t all used at the same time, but yet in your first statement you said, "I'm expecting 915 to arrive later this week. It'll be used to top multiple layers of 105, and perhaps get topped by layers of itself and 476. The car lives outside and it hasn't been able to retain any LSP for more than a month. This includes multiple layers of 1000P, 845, 476, JW AJ, etc. FWIW, last application of 845 barely lasted 3 weeks." Now speaking different languages may cause me to misinterpret things from time to time, but to me that statement sounds like you intend on layering several different LSP’s now, which tells me you’ve probably done it before, too. If you’ve used multiple layers of Colly, FK, etc. and that didn’t work, what makes you think this cocktail of waxes will work? As for the “3 year” time frame, no I didn’t read that because it wasn’t directed to me; I try mind my own conversations, unlike you. The next time you feel the need to comment on something that doesn’t pertain to you in order to prove someone wrong, you should probably explain yourself a bit better the first time around to avoid pissing contests.

I didn't realize that you were doing me a favor by completely ignoring the facts. Clearly, you have absolutely no idea as to the scope of the situation and cannot grasp the constants at hand, as has been shown over and over. Yet, you keep coming back with another dubious notion seemingly geared to boost whatever preconceived idea lies behind the condescending rhetoric. Now you're upset, because your (supposed) advice isn't well-regraded. Sorry.

The facts (according to the information you’ve given): You plan on adding layer(s) of Colly 915 and 476 on top of “multiple layers of 105”. Now, I’m just going to assume that you’re referring to Meguiar’s 105 here. That’s a compound, not a wax, not a sealant and most certainly not a foundation for any wax. Multiple layers of it?? Have you polished your car with 105 so many times?? Well there may be a problem… you may have polished away the clear coat if you’ve done it “multiple” times. Fact: You intend on applying a less durable wax, Colly 915, than the ones you’ve used before (476, FK) in hopes to increase durability...?? 915 has a higher carnauba content than the others, which makes it look slightly wetter but because of that, durability is sacrificed. Have you tried Colly 885 yet? It’s the marine, aeronautical wax so it’s sure to give you better durability than the others.

<sigh> This isn't my only car. As I've said before (is there an echo in here), my other cars don't react to LSPs like this one. It's very frustrating. I've tried almost everything imaginable with equally dismal results. I'm going to say this again so there's no misunderstand. Please read this carefully. All of my cars, except for one, respond well to LSPs. However, one car in particular doesn't. Just because you waxed your car and a LSP worked out well, doesn't mean that it will on my Mazda, the car in question. I really don't know why that's so difficult to grasp.

I’ve worked on hundreds of Mazdas and other cars very similar to yours and I’ve never had the issues you’re having. In fact, I have a Mazda 5 (2007, silver) that I’ve been maintaining for more than one year now and it wore Dodo Supernatural all winter without any issues. I can’t imagine that the paint on your car and my customer’s car is any different.

Errr...I most certainly do know more about the paintwork on this car that you. I've worked on it for 3 years; you've never even seen it.

Like I said above, I can’t imagine that yours is so much different than the others I’ve done.

Please recall that I never asked for advice, but I did point out that your claims weren't universally applicable and cited one of my cars as an example. This seemed to have unnerved you and here were are.

Please note that I never asked for your opinion about my advice to someone else. By interjecting and by trying to prove me wrong, you opened yourself to my comments, no?

I like to think that I can afford to spend $11, but I appreciate your concern for my financial health. As we've already determined, you know zero about this situation. Even when told directly about it, you completely ignore the written word. Comically, you complain about being insulted, while uploading comments like the above. With all this in mind, can you briefly explain why anyone with an IQ in the tipple digits shouldn't see your so-called advice as an exercise in absurdity?

Well I’m just tickled pink that you can afford another $11 for a can of wax… go for it. Baahhha. Actually it is you sir who knows zero about this situation because if you haven’t figured it out after 3 years… now that’s absurd. I don’t think I’m the one with the “unyielding cranial density” problem. I’ll wish you luck on this one because your skills, “legwork” and aptitude are clearly of no service to you in this adventure.

 

[imported_FJF]

You say that they weren’t all used at the same time, but yet in your first statement you said, "I'm expecting 915 to arrive later this week. It'll be used to top multiple layers of 105, and perhaps get topped by layers of itself and 476. The car lives outside and it hasn't been able to retain any LSP for more than a month. This includes multiple layers of 1000P, 845, 476, JW AJ, etc. FWIW, last application of 845 barely lasted 3 weeks." Now speaking different languages may cause me to misinterpret things from time to time, but to me that statement sounds like you intend on layering several different LSP’s now, which tells me you’ve probably done it before, too.

If you misunderstood the original post, the subsequent clarifications should have been clear. As it stands, you're still singing the same song. Why? I don't know.

As for the “3 year” time frame, no I didn’t read that because it wasn’t directed to me; I try mind my own conversations, unlike you.

I hate to state the obvious, but this is a discussion forum. There are no private conversations. Would you like to argue about this, too?

The next time you feel the need to comment on something that doesn’t pertain to you in order to prove someone wrong, you should probably explain yourself a bit better the first time around to avoid pissing contests.

You made a ridiculous claim and you were wrong. End of story.

The facts (according to the information you’ve given): You plan on adding layer(s) of Colly 915 and 476 on top of “multiple layers of 105”. Now, I’m just going to assume that you’re referring to Meguiar’s 105 here.

DG105, as if it matters at this point. Seeing how you couldn't figure that out by yourself, would you like to tell everyone again about your vast experience?

That’s a compound, not a wax, not a sealant and most certainly not a foundation for any wax.

Gee, thanks for the tip.

I’ve worked on hundreds of Mazdas and other cars very similar to yours and I’ve never had the issues you’re having. In fact, I have a Mazda 5 (2007, silver) that I’ve been maintaining for more than one year now and it wore Dodo Supernatural all winter without any issues. I can’t imagine that the paint on your car and my customer’s car is any different.

Who cares? My Mazda has LSP issues and that's all that counts. Another Autopian commented on Collinite not being durable on one of his cars, too. Clearly, your all-encompassing claim cannot be applied to every car, and for some reason you seem offended by being shown to be incorrect. Well, that's life. Deal with it.

Please note that I never asked for your opinion about my advice to someone else. By interjecting and by trying to prove me wrong, you opened yourself to my comments, no?

I just wish you'd read what's said instead of inventing your own conversation.

Well I’m just tickled pink that you can afford another $11 for a can of wax… go for it. Baahhha. Actually it is you sir who knows zero about this situation because if you haven’t figured it out after 3 years… now that’s absurd. I don’t think I’m the one with the “unyielding cranial density” problem. I’ll wish you luck on this one because your skills, “legwork” and aptitude are clearly of no service to you in this adventure.

An "I know you are, but what am I." Brilliant.



If you must know, I decided to try 915, because rydawg recommended it for its durability over 476. You'll have to use your imagination to understand why someone would respect the word of a trusted professional who uses the product regularly, in lieu of struggling to comprehend the guessing game displayed by an obtuse braggart making untenable claims.

 

[Accumulator]

Heh heh, hope I'm not gonna get caught in the middle of some :argue here... :nervous:

I'll definitely give KSG a shot. Someone whose opinion I trust suggested that the issue may be driven by silicone contamination. Though I wipe down each panel with IPA and HT Silicone Remover least three times after polishing, that may not be enough. I'd like to find some Dow Corning OS-2 Silicone Cleaner and Surface Prep Solvent, which is said to be a more powerful option.

Yeah, certain types of silicon contamination can really cause trouble. I do think you should do OK with the Klasse twins, but IME you simply *must* layer the KSG for good durability. And yeah, it can be a bit of a PIA to work with.



One thing I will point out is that the quality of the paint/prep *can* factor in. The better the paint's condition, the better the LSP will last. In cases where you have lots of pitting/microfissures the difference can be pretty dramatic; in less serious cases it's usually less so.

Hmm, maybe my English is getting worse than I thought..

Heh heh, no worries, your English is better than my...uhm...anything other than English

... Really, let's say I layer 2 coats of 885, a wax that's going to give me a minimum of 4 months in the first place, but most likely more than 6. Now, I really doubt that you're gonna get another 6+ months out of that 2nd layer, on top of what the first layer gives...

I won't claim it doubles the durability, but it does increase it substantially. Especially in those weird cases where 476S/885 doesn't last as long as it normally does.



On my mechanic's Benz loaner the 476S would only last a few weeks with just one coat, but two worked a lot better.

Not only that, but unless you only plan on waxing your car 1 or 2 times a year, durability in a wax is a false icon. If you're a member of this site and have more than 100 posts, chances are you won't go more than 3 months without waxing your car.

Here's where my Autopian Heresy rears its ugly head I *do* go many months without refreshing the LSPs on my vehicles; I don't do one minute of detailing unless/until it needs to be done. I sometimes go more than a *year* I simply don't redo them until they need redone and sometimes that's an incredibly long time. I still don't understand why some of my LSP/vehicle combos last so long and others don't :nixweiss



I.e., other than redoing the hood (quick-lube guy marred it), I put the last coat of 476S on my Yukon XL almost a year ago. Ditto for the last coat of KSG on my minivan. Both are, amazingly enough, still slick, beading, glossy, etc. even after all the winter driving. They simply don't need redone yet for some reason so I'm not redoing them.

IMO, if you have to use more than 2 layers of a wax for it to be durable, then the wax really isn't doing the job it's supposed to be doing.

I guess the "job it's supposed to be doing" simply differs between you and me, at least in a few cases OTOH, I don't do more than one coat of #16 on my wife's car and I redo it every few months. Layering that stuff seems to be a waste of time so I don't bother. Guess I argue this from different sides depending on the wax.



Actually, Collinite is one of the very few waxes that seems to really layer, and I suspect it's because of the particular ingredient mix (lots of synthetic stuff). Sealants are another story and some/many of those definitely layer just great (and a few don't seem to, at least not in a meaningful way).

 

[imported_FJF]

Heh heh, hope I'm not gonna get caught in the middle of some :argue here... :nervous:

FWIW, I've lost interest. There isn't anything left to be said.

Yeah, certain types of silicon contamination can really cause trouble. I do think you should do OK with the Klasse twins, but IME you simply *must* layer the KSG for good durability. And yeah, it can be a bit of a PIA to work with.

OK, I'm sold. I happen to have some KAIO and KSG. I agree; KSG can be hard to work with. I've never done more than 3 layers, so I'm kind of looking forward to seeing the results. I'll use 105 on one of the other cars.

One thing I will point out is that the quality of the paint/prep *can* factor in. The better the paint's condition, the better the LSP will last. In cases where you have lots of pitting/microfissures the difference can be pretty dramatic; in less serious cases it's usually less so.

I'd polished the car about a month ago (M105/M205), before applying JW PS and AJ. I guess I don't need to say that at this point water is pooling on its hood. The paint isn't perfect. My wife mostly drives the car and she tends to scrape the thing against every obstacle she comes across. This said, it's never been able to hold on to a LSP. From day one, ever since we took delivery, nothing bonded to the paint for more than several weeks. I really hope the Klasse twins change the trend.

 

[Accumulator]

OK, I'm sold. I happen to have some KAIO and KSG. I agree; KSG can be hard to work with. I've never done more than 3 layers, so I'm kind of looking forward to seeing the results... I really hope the Klasse twins change the trend.

I hope it works for you, and either way it'll be interesting to see how it works out. If all those layers of KSG don't do it, then IMO *nothing* will! So good luck with this, please report back how it goes.

 

[Apollo_Auto]

I as well hope it works for you. Dropping my guns here, as neither of us will ever win on a forum. Both of us have opinions and a$$holes and they both stink so let's both be magnanimous about the whole "difference of opinion" that we've had and get on with our lives. If it makes you feel better, I'll say that yes, I am completely wrong about everything I've said. So?

 

[imported_FJF]

I as well hope it works for you. Dropping my guns here, as neither of us will ever win on a forum. Both of us have opinions and a$$holes and they both stink so let's both be magnanimous about the whole "difference of opinion" that we've had and get on with our lives. If it makes you feel better, I'll say that yes, I am completely wrong about everything I've said. So?

Good luck to you.

 

[Apollo_Auto]

Good luck to you.

I extend my hand in friendship and offer a truce and your reply is a "cold fish" handshake... Now I'm 100% about your character and your intelligence level. Wanna discuss your problems in person? Please PM me and we'll discuss a personal meeting... I'd be more than happy to enlighten you.

 

[imported_FJF]

I extend my hand in friendship and offer a truce and your reply is a "cold fish" handshake... Now I'm 100% about your character and your intelligence level. Wanna discuss your problems in person? Please PM me and we'll discuss a personal meeting... I'd be more than happy to enlighten you.

What? I wished you well, the post didn't meet your standard of friendliness , and now you're threatening to beat me up. Well, it's one approach you haven't explored.



I didn't know you were this upset and I'm not sure what to say to make you feel better. You tell me. What would allow you to walk away from this in peace? I don't really care, so the ball is in your court. Better yet, let's leave this thread. If it'll provide some relief, please feel free to shoot me a scathing PM. I won't respond, you'll get a free shot, and everything will be fine. Deal?

 

[atsoca]

ok that was interesting

so how do you guys feel the 915 on top of the 845 will look....

 

[Accumulator]

..so how do you guys feel the 915 on top of the 845 will look....

My guess is that it'll look a little bit deeper and less bright. That's what usually happens when you put a (different) carnauba over a "bright", reflective wax.