Closing story is puzzling ?

Puzzling:

  • Who spends all the I.T. money to revamp their web site and then "voluntarily" shuts down the whole business?
  • Who "voluntarily" shuts down a business with a few well received proprietary products (read Blackfire) on the books and makes no public provisions to protect, or sell, the brands?
  • Who "voluntarily" shuts down a long lived business and makes no public statement to their customers with at least a little bit of an explanation?
The answer to all of the above is ?. nobody.

However, it is rare for a Company to die a natural death, they are normally murdered.

The perp is usually their bank and the weapon of choice is the removal of financing.
 
:StarWars:I would love to see Blackfire branded at another vendor. Not because I want PAC to go away, but the brand is beloved and has a following. It certainly would be a shame to see the name "murdered". All that hard work and the good reputation down the drain.
 
Im sure we are all curious , I am too. But is it any of our business and do we really need to know? I dont think so .If Jack doesnt want to talk about the reasons so be it ,or maybe he will at a later date:smile:
 
Jeff U said:
Puzzling:

  • Who spends all the I.T. money to revamp their web site and then "voluntarily" shuts down the whole business?
  • Who "voluntarily" shuts down a business with a few well received proprietary products (read Blackfire) on the books and makes no public provisions to protect, or sell, the brands?
  • Who "voluntarily" shuts down a long lived business and makes no public statement to their customers with at least a little bit of an explanation?
The answer to all of the above is ?. nobody.

However, it is rare for a Company to die a natural death, they are normally murdered.

The perp is usually their bank and the weapon of choice is the removal of financing.
Click to expand...

Who makes posts that really don't matter?
 
gmblack3 said:
Who makes posts that really don't matter?
Click to expand...

Why does it not matter if one of your customers is puzzled or confused?

I agree does not really matter why PAC is closing however as a fairly long time customer I can ask or wonder.

A company provides a service that I choose to frequent. At least in my opinion, there is a connection that is more than a one way street. For example:

  • PAC has lots of information about me somewhere in their computer system. I trust them to manage it well
  • They have, or did have, an "Awards Program" where they made a promise to me that the more I frequented their store, the larger discount on future purchases I would earn (which had they continued I was at their highest level)
  • When TID was new, they encouraged all of us to get the word out about TID, essentially asking me to become a very minor promoter of their business (they even track "referrals" - BTW, you and I both have one)
  • They provided and encouraged all our input on this forum.
  • A forum is only as good as it's content and people. And a forum that is successful becomes wonderful advertising for the sponsoring firm's store. Yet most of the input that makes it successful comes free of charge from the customers and costs the company little more than technology expenses for storage, servers, etc...

So in my view, I have been part of their company and it's success or maybe failure.

Now you can, and apparently do, think that it is none of my business on PAC's decision. That is one view of a business, I am a customer and nothing more.

Of course they don't owe me an explanation, but it would be nice to know a bit more about why they are shutting down.
 
Jeff U said:
Why does it not matter if one of your customers is puzzled or confused?

I agree does not really matter why PAC is closing however as a fairly long time customer I can ask or wonder.

A company provides a service that I choose to frequent. At least in my opinion, there is a connection that is more than a one way street. For example:

  • PAC has lots of information about me somewhere in their computer system. I trust them to manage it well
  • They have, or did have, an "Awards Program" where they made a promise to me that the more I frequented their store, the larger discount on future purchases I would earn (which had they continued I was at their highest level)
  • When TID was new, they encouraged all of us to get the word out about TID, essentially asking me to become a very minor promoter of their business (they even track "referrals" - BTW, you and I both have one)
  • They provided and encouraged all our input on this forum.
  • A forum is only as good as it's content and people. And a forum that is successful becomes wonderful advertising for the sponsoring firm's store. Yet most of the input that makes it successful comes free of charge from the customers and costs the company little more than technology expenses for storage, servers, etc...

So in my view, I have been part of their company and it's success or maybe failure.

Now you can, and apparently do, think that it is none of my business on PAC's decision. That is one view of a business, I am a customer and nothing more.

Of course they don't owe me an explanation, but it would be nice to know a bit more about why they are shutting down.
Click to expand...

Those are some very good points you have provided, thank you.
 
Jeff U said:
Why does it not matter if one of your customers is puzzled or confused?

I agree does not really matter why PAC is closing however as a fairly long time customer I can ask or wonder.

A company provides a service that I choose to frequent. At least in my opinion, there is a connection that is more than a one way street. For example:

  • PAC has lots of information about me somewhere in their computer system. I trust them to manage it well
  • They have, or did have, an "Awards Program" where they made a promise to me that the more I frequented their store, the larger discount on future purchases I would earn (which had they continued I was at their highest level)
  • When TID was new, they encouraged all of us to get the word out about TID, essentially asking me to become a very minor promoter of their business (they even track "referrals" - BTW, you and I both have one)
  • They provided and encouraged all our input on this forum.
  • A forum is only as good as it's content and people. And a forum that is successful becomes wonderful advertising for the sponsoring firm's store. Yet most of the input that makes it successful comes free of charge from the customers and costs the company little more than technology expenses for storage, servers, etc...

So in my view, I have been part of their company and it's success or maybe failure.

Now you can, and apparently do, think that it is none of my business on PAC's decision. That is one view of a business, I am a customer and nothing more.

Of course they don't owe me an explanation, but it would be nice to know a bit more about why they are shutting down.
Click to expand...


Yes it would be nice to know, but again "I" still feel thats its really not my place to ask to expect to know.

Businesses shut down every day. Its an unfortunate part of life.

I'm not sure at all what you are implying to about the "referrals" that TID allegedly has used to track who "talks" about TID or PAC. I can 100% assure that I have never had any financial gain from promoting TID or PAC.

I would appreciate if you can clarify what you meant.

Thanks,
Bryan
 
gmblack3 said:
Yes it would be nice to know, but again "I" still feel thats its really not my place to ask to expect to know.

Businesses shut down every day. Its an unfortunate part of life.

I'm not sure at all what you are implying to about the "referrals" that TID allegedly has used to track who "talks" about TID or PAC. I can 100% assure that I have never had any financial gain from promoting TID or PAC.

I would appreciate if you can clarify what you meant.

Thanks,
Bryan
Click to expand...

Look at your user profile. Under the statistics tab there is a reference to "referrals". I have no idea how or if PAC ever used that information but they did track it. I assume that when a new user registered they could identify who referred them to TID.

Realize PAC retains all the power. Want to stop questions, it is easy:

- Answer them
- Ignore them and hope they go away (current choice)
- Shut down the forum now

I agree I have no "right" to get an answer.

However, I see no reason to defend PAC, Jack, or whomever. They are big boys and girls and are fully capable of defending themselves.

Or, in this case remaining silent while leaving their employees to make vague references to things they "cannot say" right now.
 
Jeff U said:
Or, in this case remaining silent while leaving their employees to make vague references to things they "cannot say" right now.
Click to expand...

Well technically I was given my walking papers two weeks ago and have choosen to stick around to try to answer questions out of respect for this community. Since you would like somebody to set the record straight...

Your assumption that PAC is ignoring something is wrong, many of the employees have been let go which leaves precious few people to process orders and ship them. Jack also has to close down the business which is a huge undertaking. Hence the fact that I am serving as a leasion only because I am no longer employed with PAC.

While I guess you could blame PAC for your incorrect assumptions; you still choose to make them.

I do agree that PAC has some responsibility to our loyal customers who have feel some emotional connection to this company but Jack also has a responsibility to Angelo, who has a daughter, to the warehouse crew, whom each have children, to one of our tech guys who is battling life threatening cancer, and so on and so on. To simply suggest that any problem is being ignored is almost downplaying the situation and the severity of that situation.

So I am sorry if some peoples feelings are hurt, but the fact that some people will not be able to make house payments or feed their children seems far more important when reality and perspective are taken into account. Obviously things could be handled better but nobody there has experience with closing a business and I can only assure you that it is being handled to the best of everybodies intentions.

Those who have expressed their understanding and gratitude, thank you!!!!!
 
Sorry for any gramatical errors. I had to type from my phone because I enjoying some away time with my family.
 
th0001 said:
Well technically I was given my walking papers two weeks ago and have choosen to stick around to try to answer questions out of respect for this community. Since you would like somebody to set the record straight...

Your assumption that PAC is ignoring something is wrong, many of the employees have been let go which leaves precious few people to process orders and ship them. Jack also has to close down the business which is a huge undertaking. Hence the fact that I am serving as a leasion only because I am no longer employed with PAC.

While I guess you could blame PAC for your incorrect assumptions; you still choose to make them.

I do agree that PAC has some responsibility to our loyal customers who have feel some emotional connection to this company but Jack also has a responsibility to Angelo, who has a daughter, to the warehouse crew, whom each have children, to one of our tech guys who is battling life threatening cancer, and so on and so on. To simply suggest that any problem is being ignored is almost downplaying the situation and the severity of that situation.

So I am sorry if some peoples feelings are hurt, but the fact that some people will not be able to make house payments or feed their children seems far more important when reality and perspective are taken into account. Obviously things could be handled better but nobody there has experience with closing a business and I can only assure you that it is being handled to the best of everybodies intentions.

Those who have expressed their understanding and gratitude, thank you!!!!!
Click to expand...

I don't know how you could make it any clearer then this ^

PAC or TID owes you nothing, unless you've placed an order

th0001 said:
Sorry for any gramatical errors. I had to type from my phone because I enjoying some away time with my family.
Click to expand...

Waht grahmicale arrows. I sea nuthing rong heer :-B
 
Everyone responds differently to loss. For many this has been a friendly, familiar place to come to visit, exchange ideas and learn. For some this is a sudden loss almost like a death of a dear friend. The friendly familiar place will be no more the camraderie gone!. So allow people to express their feelings of loss in the manner they feel best without criticizing. It is what it is...
 
th0001 said:
Well technically I was given my walking papers two weeks ago and have choosen to stick around to try to answer questions out of respect for this community. Since you would like somebody to set the record straight...

Your assumption that PAC is ignoring something is wrong, many of the employees have been let go which leaves precious few people to process orders and ship them. Jack also has to close down the business which is a huge undertaking. Hence the fact that I am serving as a leasion only because I am no longer employed with PAC.

While I guess you could blame PAC for your incorrect assumptions; you still choose to make them.

I do agree that PAC has some responsibility to our loyal customers who have feel some emotional connection to this company but Jack also has a responsibility to Angelo, who has a daughter, to the warehouse crew, whom each have children, to one of our tech guys who is battling life threatening cancer, and so on and so on. To simply suggest that any problem is being ignored is almost downplaying the situation and the severity of that situation.

So I am sorry if some peoples feelings are hurt, but the fact that some people will not be able to make house payments or feed their children seems far more important when reality and perspective are taken into account. Obviously things could be handled better but nobody there has experience with closing a business and I can only assure you that it is being handled to the best of everybodies intentions.

Those who have expressed their understanding and gratitude,
Click to expand...

Thankyou Todd for being here on your own time and explaining what you can....class act !

I think its time to set aside personal feelings and have some compassion for Jack /staff .

Lets just all make this as easy and supportive as possible for all involved .
 
Jeff U said:
Puzzling:

The perp is usually their bank and the weapon of choice is the removal of financing.
Click to expand...

Its very possible. The company I am part owner of went through a bad spell a few years ago. We had a big loan that finally started to generate business. We paid it off, and asked for another small one to keep things moving in the right direction. Bank said no dice, so we had to lay off almost 30% of the company. Good news is we made 4x that original investment the next year and have been growing ever since.

Looking back it was probably a mistake to pay off that loan early, but we were really excited about getting out of the red. We were blown away that we couldent get 1/8 that amount to keep the biz growing after paying back the whole enchilada.
 
KneeDragr said:
Its very possible. The company I am part owner of went through a bad spell a few years ago. We had a big loan that finally started to generate business. We paid it off, and asked for another small one to keep things moving in the right direction. Bank said no dice, so we had to lay off almost 30% of the company. Good news is we made 4x that original investment the next year and have been growing ever since.

Looking back it was probably a mistake to pay off that loan early, but we were really excited about getting out of the red. We were blown away that we couldent get 1/8 that amount to keep the biz growing after paying back the whole enchilada.
Click to expand...

Since the whole credit fiasco banks only lend money to people who don't need it! (can back up 125% loan to value in hard liquid or easily converted assets) Aren't you glad the government loaned them all our TARP money to bail their butts out and now the Jonny Q Public get the shaft. Show them your displeasure in the voting booth next time around. I know I will.
 
Oh the speculation....quick to blame a bank. I don't know why, but not sure a bank is automatically at fault. This is a competitive market. Times are tough. Maybe it just comes down to market conditions and ROI from the point of the investors.

Who knows? See, now I am speculating.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top