Can someone catch me up? I've been out of the game for a bit! What new polishes??

TheMac said:
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<span style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:arial;"> I was slightly surprised at the lack of durability of the hexlogic pads both orange and white. Perhaps the orange pad has come into contact with something sharp on the car but a significant part of the edge more or less disintegrated. Part of the white pad's edge seems to be in the very early stages of breaking away from its centre. Is this normal after using it twice?


 
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TheMac--I beleive Hexlogic pads are manufactured by B&S.    B&S flat pads have a reputation of being durable.   How many of each pad (orange and white) do you have?   Trying to do an entire car with one or two pads seems to be the culprit for many pad failures as the pads get loaded with spent product and removed clear coat and then heat up.   I find I need at least 4 orange B&S pads (and sometimes more) to do an entire car.   I use the green B&S instead of the white and usually require at least 4 of those per car.
 
The MX5 is now finished. For any newbies who are intending to use Glare products with a machine polisher this worked for me.
I purchased a DAS -6 pro dual action polisher 850 watts approximately 5 days ago. 
The following is a summary of the processes and outcome together with my thoughts to date:
1. I use Megs Ultra wash and Poorboys car wash but to degrease the car I applied washing up liquid. This would better have been achieved by the use of an APC, - All purpose cleaner. Either a dedicated vehicle APC or a bottle of Supermarket All purpose cleaner (kitchen floor cleaner):
2. car was clay barred:
3. Megs 205 was applied to the car in an attempt to correct minor defects - light scratches. This was largely successful, the car now looks almost new but if you look closely enough and at the right angle you can still see a few, but not very many, scratches buried in the lacquer. In hindsight,  with a car of nearly 8 years old, I might have been tempted to use the heavier cutting compound Megs 105 but this may not have been as forgiving of my machining technique. Also I was influenced by the fact that there is so little paint on these cars. When being designed Mazda  reduced the amount of paint on these cars by 5 pounds for weight advantage! However, that is not to say that the clear coat is not as thick as every other car- I just do not know.
4. Rather than use Megs 105 I used an orange cutting pad with the 205 to try to increase the aggressiveness of the cut but as has since been pointed out I should have tested a range of pads and polishes which I intended to use first on a small section of the car. I will follow this principle whenever I detail the Audi.
5. Glare micro finish was applied to the car which certainly appeared to increase flake detail. Whether the 205 was warranted prior to that would only have been determined by point 4 above.
6. After 3+ hours Glare pro polish was applied as a sealer three times with white, black and blue finishing pads. This approach follows my understanding of the then, Glare Guru, Dream Machines posts on DW.
7. A last coat of Glare pro polish was applied by hand as a wax, not buffed into the paintwork but left to dry and then buffed off.
The results of the above, which certainly were time consuming, are a car which looks almost new. Both myself and my son, whose car it is (and who actually ended up doing no work on it), are absolutely delighted.
I would like to thank the posters again who supplied some cracking information which I will be using for the detail of the Audi especially the use of the all purpose cleaner and the ipa and possibly the jewelling.  
My only disappointment in the whole process was the possible lack of longevity of the machine pads and the fact that I may need to buy new ones before starting work on the Audi for fear that the existing ones will fall apart half way through the job and I will not be able to use the car until I obtain replacements and finish the detail. 
Hope this helps someone!
Regards
TheMac
 
pwaug said:
TheMac--I beleive Hexlogic pads are manufactured by B&S.    B&S flat pads have a reputation of being durable.   How many of each pad (orange and white) do you have?   Trying to do an entire car with one or two pads seems to be the culprit for many pad failures as the pads get loaded with spent product and removed clear coat and then heat up.   I find I need at least 4 orange B&S pads (and sometimes more) to do an entire car.   I use the green B&S instead of the white and usually require at least 4 of those per car.
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Thanks for the post. I have 1 orange, one white,black and blue finishing pads. All have been cleaned on the fly and on the initial 'cut' with the 205  the pad was also washed and dried  half way through the detail. The damage to the pads may well have been me using too much pressure but probably not so much a build up of product. Interesting to learn that you would need so many just to do one car. This is starting to look expensive!


I intend to detail the Audi next and should be grateful for any input as to the type of polish and nature and colour of pads that I should use. It would seem that microfiber pads cut better than foam but it looks like a pain in the butt to have to clean them so regularly. On the other hand Megs seem to get a good name and have some sort of dedicated compound to use with theirs  which would probably make the job slightly faster. Nevertheless, I received 105 and 205 bundled with my purchase of the machine. Do you or anyone else know if this is likely to be effective on the Audi's clear coat with say an orange pad?
 
The Mac- MF cutting pads work well for me, in part because they're easy to clean.  If using foam, I'd go through a *LOT* of pads and that's despite cleaning them out *many* times per panel.


 


M105 can work OK on Audis, just takes a while.  M205 is also OK as long as you're satisfied with the finish it leaves and you don't have an issue with its oils the way I do.
 
TheMac said:
Thanks for the post. I have 1 orange, one white,black and blue finishing pads. All have been cleaned on the fly and on the initial 'cut' with the 205  the pad was also washed and dried  half way through the detail. The damage to the pads may well have been me using too much pressure but probably not so much a build up of product. Interesting to learn that you would need so many just to do one car.
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I'd bet $100 the damage to your pads is from using one pad for an entire car.   Even with cleaning on the fly after every panel, you will get product and removed clear build up which will cause heat to build in the pad which causes the failure.  Not to mention the pad loses some of it's effectiveness as the pores become filled.  You can keep the cost down by using flat pads and buying in 5 or 6 packs.  If you have access to Autoality.com they carry B&S flat pads for about $30 for a 5 pack-shipping is free if order is over $25 and under 5 lbs.
 
Accumulator said:
The Mac- MF cutting pads work well for me, in part because they're easy to clean.  If using foam, I'd go through a *LOT* of pads and that's despite cleaning them out *many* times per panel.


 


M105 can work OK on Audis, just takes a while.  M205 is also OK as long as you're satisfied with the finish it leaves and you don't have an issue with its oils the way I do.
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Thanks very much for the post. If MF cutting pads are more effective, easier to clean and more durable than foam that would seem the logical way for me   to go. Is there any type of MF pads and cutting compound  I should be thinking of purchasing? Also am I likely to require the equivalent of Megs 205 after correction to get rid of swirls or further paint damage ? Lastly Opti coat seems to be a great sealer but will it enable the car to retain a lustrous shine or would a wax or gloss enhancer be required as well?  


Apologies for the long list of questions but I am working in a vacuum and have no real point of reference.


I do intend to read more prior to my final decisions so please feel unencumbered to air your opinions.


Thanks again
 
TheMac- I'd look into Meguiar's MF Cutting Disks and their M100 compound (or maybe M105).  I'd skip M205 in favor of HD Polish or the one from Optimum, and yeah you'll need a Finishing Polish after using the compound (at least I always do).


 


OptiCoat should be fine if you want to go the coating route, or just use some conventional LSP like FK1000P and reapply every few months.


 


Biggest trick is to just not mar it up again.
 
mystickid- The HD has virtually no potential issues related to oils, and it's Accumulator-proof with regard to work-time.  None of that "keep working it until it's like salad oil and then work it some more..." stuff that people talk about with the Menzerna and there's no "breaking down" the (nondiminshing) abrasives with the HD either.
 
Accumulator said:
mystickid- The HD has virtually no potential issues related to oils, and it's Accumulator-proof with regard to work-time.  None of that "keep working it until it's like salad oil and then work it some more..." stuff that people talk about with the Menzerna and there's no "breaking down" the (nondiminshing) abrasives with the HD either.
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Thank you Sir. Was 85rd known to have oils? 


 


So like can I use HD polish for just one pass and wipe off with it actually having done its defect removal work? I ask because holding the polisher for ages around each spot on the car is a chore for me, ( yes, I lack the manly muscles) and it makes me put off detailing when I have to linger for too long. I want quick and effficient in terms of work time but then again I was never wowed so much like I was when I used 85 rd  on a black pad for finishing.
 
mystickid- Yeah, the PO85rd has oils in it.  The HD Polish should be at least as time-efficient as the Menzerna, but you *can* spend a lot of time on this stuff if you try to do real correction with any Finishing Polish (instead of just doing an initial pass or three with a compound).


 


I too utterly despise doing correction, so I'm all about not marring the paint once I have it corrected ;)
 
Accumulator said:
mystickid- Yeah, the PO85rd has oils in it.  The HD Polish should be at least as time-efficient as the Menzerna, but you *can* spend a lot of time on this stuff if you try to do real correction with any Finishing Polish (instead of just doing an initial pass or three with a compound).


 


I too utterly despise doing correction, so I'm all about not marring the paint once I have it corrected ;)
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Thank you for your advice.
 
<span style="color:#000000;"><span style="font-family:arial;">This is an update. The minor scratches on the rear bumper and wheel rear arches reappeared! In hindsight I suspect that I should have used the Megs 105 rather than the 205. It may also be that the polishing oils in the 205, of which I  was unaware at the time, inhibited the longer term effects of the Glare micro finish. Nevertheless, the rest of the car still looks great and the scratches are not really noticeable unless you are going over the car inch by inch. I now intend to revisit the paintwork in say a years time and  hopefully do the job properly this time with Xpert products and the Megs MF pads  both of which are my latest purchases.
<span style="color:#000000;"><span style="font-family:arial;">My understanding is that the Xpert products are superior in nature, generally much safer as they are water based, transparent so you can see exactly what you are removing at time of machining, contain no fillers or oils and are capable of giving an award winning finish. It almost sounds too good to be true!

I am going to start another thread entitled 'The perfect finish achievable by newbies' detailing the steps taken to detail my own car, an Audi, and the subsequent results - whether good or bad. You can wish me, and the Audi's paintwork, good luck.

Thanks again for all the input above.

TheMac
 
TheMac- Sorry, but not really surprised, to hear that you needed to get more aggressive and that the M205 did some concealing.  I have no experience with the Xpert products, but maybe they'll work better for you.



Biggest thing IMO- get all the real correction done with aggressive stuff and don't switch to the Finishing Polish until everything looks basically perfect in normal lighting.  I can't finish out to my satisfaction with stuff like M105, but anybody else looking at it would say it's OK.  Switching to the milder step(s) too soon is a recipe for disappointment IME.


 


(Yeah, Kevin Brown recently posted a great article on how he did some serious correction with M205, but 1) that's Kevin, I'm not Kevin and neither are most others, and 2) he stated numerous times that this was a specific situation/specific case and that it wasn't a "rewrite the rules"-type of thing where we should all start doing correction that way.


 


And yeah, I bet it's plenty nice enough as-is.  The real world isn't quite as demanding as Autopia ;)
 
Thanks for the input. I really appreciate your opinion. I certainly will not be using the 205 again! One of the great advantages of the Xpert range seems to be that the products are water based, seem  extremely unlikely to damage the paint and contain no fillers or oils. Having already bought them  I am hoping they are as good as the hype!


I would value your opinion if and when I get round to detailing the Audi. I intend to start a related thread to try to assist other novices like myself.


Many thanks


TheMac
 
weedsnager- The original PC (i.e., pre-XP model) was a very good finishing sander, but just not powerful enough for polishing cars using foam pads.  The HF polisher is apparently more powerful than that.


 


Dan- I wouldn't go so far as to say that the "hose and bucket are things of the past" ^_^  I still need a hose/foamgun for the initial stage of the wash even if I am now incorporating a rinseless wash much of the time (we'll see if I continue to do that through the winter, sorta doubt it).
 
Anything from harbor freight that has a plug on it scares me to death. I have a harbor freight 5 miles from my house and every time I'm in there I feel the need to come home and shower.


I have never used my 15 year old 7424 and said "I wish this thing was more powerful"
 
weedsnager- Heh heh, Yeah...I kinda feel the same way about some aspects of Harbor Freight, but some people whose opinions I *highly* respect say their RO is OK.


 


Glad the 7424 is satisfying you, no need to change in that case.  Neither of mine (either new or post-rebuilds by PC) has ever been really satisfactory for correction with anything larger than a 3-4" pad, but that's just *my* experience.
 
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