Bought a PC 7346 from Lowe's, want to remove light swirls on a budget, few questions

[bast525]

Hello all, long time lurker, just about ready to get my feet wet with my first PC and try to get the swirl marks out of my paint. The car is an '07 Mazda 3, bright red in color. The paint is in very good shape, lots of light swirl marks and water spots, that's about it. I want to get these out and do what I can to get the paint looking nice and get rid of the swirls, but I'm on a VERY tight budget. I currently cannot afford to buy a kit with 4-5 different kinds of pads and polishes and waxes. If at all possible, I want to get the swirls out in one step, and then wax by hand afterwards.



My first question is, is the white polishing foam pad that comes with the PC any good at all? Will it do any harm to try it? I bought a bottle of Meguiar's Ultimate Compound to use... tried it by hand and didn't really see any difference after an hour on two roughly 2'x2'x panels.



If I absolutely must avoid using the white pad that came with it, is there just one good pad I can use to buff out swirls and leave a nice smooth surface that I can then wax by hand and get good results? I did buy an adhesive velcro stick on that I used to 'adapt' the black backing plate that came with the PC, so I can use any velcro backed pads that will fit the 6".



I understand that I'm not going to get show car results by taking this approach, or the 'deep wet' shine lots of people talk about, and that's fine. It's not really a show car I just want the swirls gone and get it close to, if not better than, how the paint was when new.



Also, if I can't use the pad that came with it, can someone possibly recommend one good pad I can pick up from a local place? If not at autozone or whatever, there is a Pro Finishes shop close by that sells stuff to the local body shops and detail shops, they said they do have a lot of different pads and stuff to choose from, and wanted me to buy a wool pad but that didn't seem to jive with everything I've read here. They do HAVE foam pads I just don't know what type.



Anyways, thanks in advance for any info!



Edit: friend of mine just gave me some Presta Ultra Cutting Creme Light and said it would work 10x better than the Meg's ultimate compound. The stuff feels REALLY grainy. Best I can tell it is supposed to be used with a rotary and a Presta wool pad, but I did find a few blurbs around the web of people saying it worked with a PC and foam pad.

 

[Accumulator]

Hello all, long time lurker, just about ready to get my feet wet with my first PC and try to get the swirl marks out of my paint. The car is an '07 Mazda 3, bright red in color. The paint is in very good shape, lots of light swirl marks and water spots, that's about it. I want to get these out and do what I can to get the paint looking nice and get rid of the swirls, but I'm on a VERY tight budget. I currently cannot afford to buy a kit with 4-5 different kinds of pads and polishes and waxes. If at all possible, I want to get the swirls out in one step, and then wax by hand afterwards...I bought a bottle of Meguiar's Ultimate Compound to use... tried it by hand and didn't really see any difference after an hour on two roughly 2'x2'x panels.

If the Meg's UC didn't do it after all that time you put in, you might not be able to do it in one step.

My first question is, is the white polishing foam pad that comes with the PC any good at all? Will it do any harm to try it?

The pads that used to come with PCs were utterly unsuitable for use on automotive paints and could do damage. I wouldn't risk it.

I absolutely must avoid using the white pad that came with it, is there just one good pad I can use to buff out swirls and leave a nice smooth surface that I can then wax by hand and get good results?

If you need an aggressive pad to correct the marring, you'll probably need to do a follow-up with a milder pad/product combo. There just might not be any way around it; there's only so much cost-cutting you can do before you start to compromise your effectiveness to the point that things don't work out right.



Versatile pads include the Griot's Garage orange polishing pad (very different from other "orange pads") and the LC Tangerine HydroTech. Maybe one of the new Meguiar's MicroFiber pads, but I haven't tried them yet.

I did buy an adhesive velcro stick on that I used to 'adapt' the black backing plate that came with the PC, so I can use any velcro backed pads that will fit the 6".

I'm sorta surprised that you had to ad the velcro to the PC's backing plate; all mine came equipped with Velcro. Note that 6" pads might be too big for effective, or at least time-efficient, work even with that PC's 4.5 amp motor.

I understand that I'm not going to get show car results by taking this approach, or the 'deep wet' shine lots of people talk about, and that's fine. It's not really a show car I just want the swirls gone and get it close to, if not better than, how the paint was when new.

Heh heh..if you get it as good as new, let alone *better than new*, IMO you'll have made it better than a whole lotta show cars

Also, if I can't use the pad that came with it, can someone possibly recommend one good pad I can pick up from a local place? If not at autozone or whatever, there is a Pro Finishes shop close by that sells stuff to the local body shops and detail shops, they said they do have a lot of different pads and stuff to choose from, and wanted me to buy a wool pad but that didn't seem to jive with everything I've read here. They do HAVE foam pads I just don't know what type.

Autobody/paint supply places are *GREAT* for local sourcing of this stuff, but you often have to work around their "recommendations", which are almost *always* wrong



DO NOT use wool pads with your PC, at least not without knowing exactly what you're doing (and certainly don't use wool pads in the 6" range, utterly unsuited for this).



Find out what brand of pads they sell and research that product line. You want either a "light cutting" pad or a "polishing" pad, or both (back to that "you can only cut so many corners" thing). *GENERALLY* a green pad will be somewhat aggressive, and a white pad will be a bit less so, and a blue pad will be milder still. But don't rely on that..do some research so you get it right the first time.

Edit: friend of mine just gave me some Presta Ultra Cutting Creme Light and said it would work 10x better than the Meg's ultimate compound. The stuff feels REALLY grainy. Best I can tell it is supposed to be used with a rotary and a Presta wool pad, but I did find a few blurbs around the web of people saying it worked with a PC and foam pad.

Some of us have done stuff like that via PC, but I don't think you oughta try it. It's possible to cause problems that are a *LOT* worse than what you already have.

 

[bast525]

Ok, how about this, can I get away with one light cutting pad, one polishing pad, and the Meguiars ultimate compound? Will this get the swirl out or just fill them or both? The detail supply shop guy said the Presta I was given is "better" because it has no fillers. But the gritty feel of the stuff is kinda scary.



If I HAD to pick one pad for light swirls, would I be better off with polishing or light cutting? Again, not going for an A++ deep glossy shine, just elimination or marked reduction in swirls and a decent shine.

 

[Accumulator]

bast525- IMO you can only do so much corner-cutting before it's simply a case of not doing things properly. And I might not be the best guy to advise on this subject as I lean towards going the other way (complete and utter overkill). That said...



If you want to try getting by with just one pad you'll have to stop and clean/dry it very frequently.



If you want to use one pad you should use a milder (i.e., polishing) pad as while it might not do much correction it won't leave any pad-related issues either. Some light cutting pads can be OK in that regard, but it's a riskier way to go.



The UC will do correction and any filling should be minimal. For more correction just use it more (one pass? Eh...I'd think more like four or five tries per 1' square section). But don't worry about filling vs. "true correction" as what you're aiming to do isn't even close to a level where such hair-splitting enters into it. Just try to get it looking better and redo it when you need to.



You certainly don't want to use an aggressive compound if you're not doing a follow-up, and I wouldn't use that Presta stuff via PC anyhow. Via rotary, as the first of three or four steps, yeah...but not via PC, period.

 

[bast525]

Well, I've altered the plan a bit thanks to you guys and doing a lot more reading. I ordered a couple Meguiar's soft buff yellow pads, and some swirl x. A LOT of posts recommended swirl x after the UC to clean up any hazing. A post by a Meg's employee over on their forums said the yellow pads will work great with both products, and with the swirl x should leave a nice swirl, haze, and mar free surface ready for waxing. I'll start with the swirl x as I think most or all of the defects will come out with that anyway. I will put the Presta FAR out of reach.



Thanks for the input guys and keep it coming if there are more good tips that you think might help.

 

[Accumulator]

bast525- That should work OK. The Meg's yellow/polishing pads are a good middle-of-the-road approach :xyxthumbs



You can always up the aggressiveness (of the UC) with a harsher pad later if you decide it's really necessary.

 

[bast525]

Yeah I'm glad I've spent the last two days on Autopia and Googling.... It never really occurred to me to "use the least aggressive products required to get the job done".... as common sense as that should be. I was just trying to jump directly to the level I thought I'd need. Really, the scratches and marks are light, only visible in bright/sun light, the finish overall is still very clean. I did want to buy some of the Meguiar's black finishing pads too but I really am on a tight budget.



So... a couple more questions:



How thick is a clearcoat typicall?



How much material will I likely be removing with the swirl x/UC and the yellow pads?



In general, is Mazda known for having hard, soft, or medium clear coat? Considering how hard I worked the UC by hand and how little result, I want to say it seems hard.... but I know you don't really get much done by hand anyways

 

[Accumulator]

bast525- See my response on the other thread; you need smaller pads to avoid merely wasting your time.



I consider Mazda clear to be medium, but I have limited experience with it. I did find the clear to be awfully thin.



Can't tell you how much clear you have, but when I got my MPV down to 3 mils in places I figured I could never do significant correction on those areas again (3 mils is really thin). I got down to those 3 mils without ever using anything very aggressive too, but those areas where where I did have to remove "daily driver damage" from where people rubbed against it or whatever.



On the "getting things done"/time aspect, IMO it's all relative. You *CAN* do significant correction by hand. I remove deep fingernail scratches from behind Auid (*very* hard clear) doorhandles by hand, it just takes longer than most people would ever put into it.

 

[5pointadam]

I would say we see a guy at our shop with this same story about 10 times a year. It typically doesn't turn out well. My advice from what we've encountered is keep it really simple. Just get some light polish and medium pads. Then finish with a really nice medium gloss wax/seal. You're car will be clean and protected. Repeat that 3 times a year and most people will think you have the cleanest car they've ever seen. Don't get into trying to reduce your clear with heavy cutting compounds and a PC. You might cut it down but still leave it hazy. Then you'll be in a worse spot. Don't get me wrong PC's are super user friendly. Just stay away from the heavy cut stuff.

 

[bast525]

Is Ultimate Compound "heavy cut"? Does Swirl X even cut at all? From what I read its non abrasive, so I'm not really sure how it works

 

[Accumulator]

Is Ultimate Compound "heavy cut"?

Well, it's pretty heavy for something that works OK by hand/PC/whatever. Not heavy enough to be worried though.

Does Swirl X even cut at all? From what I read its non abrasive, so I'm not really sure how it works

Yeah, it cuts, just not that much; it's abrasive, just not all *that* abrasive.

 

[imported_Chris223]

I'm sorta surprised that you had to ad the velcro to the PC's backing plate; all mine came equipped with Velcro. Note that 6" pads might be too big for effective, or at least time-efficient, work even with that PC's 4.5 amp motor.

He said he added it to the plate the PC comes with - which is supposed to be the sandpaper backing plate for 6" stick on sandpaper. After all... the PC is technically a sander first and polisher 2nd.



To the OP - you're probably better off buying the backing plates we all have designed to be use with the hook and loop pads that we also all have. They're a little more flexible and you wont stand the chance of the velcro you added coming un-stuck and flying off.

 

[schiddy]

Just so you know 2 pads is not enough to do a whole car in one sitting. They will get dirty, you will have to blow them out or clean them with a towel/brush as you are working. Even then I think they will get dirty to the point where you will have to wash them with water and dawn soap after a few panels. That's fine though, do a few panels and come back to do some more the rest day after the pads are clean and dry.

 

[Accumulator]

He said he added it to the plate the PC comes with - which is supposed to be the sandpaper backing plate for 6" stick on sandpaper. After all... the PC is technically a sander first and polisher 2nd..

Huh, so it comes with a non-velcro plate? My older PC was sold as a "sander" (it dates from back before polishing cars with them was common) but it came with a velcro plate...so I just thought they all did. Thanks for schooling me



Funny I never thought about this...I still remember buying long roles of adhesive-backed paper and I wasn't using a velcro plate with that stuff!