Blems in Factory paint?

T

tguil

New member
Checking with folks on a couple of my "go to" forums.

I have several minor flaws in the factory paint of my white 2012 Ram...dust flecks/"nibs" in the factory paint. (I really checked the paint out before I took possession of the truck, but did not notice the blems until the first detail.) One option is to leave them alone and just drive the truck. After all it is a truck, right? The other option of course is to attempt to correct them.

The body shop manager at my Dodge dealer said his shop could correct them but could not guarantee the job 100%. (I really don't like this option after my conversation with the manager.) Another option is to have friend of mine who operates a high-end detail shop look them over and correct them if he thinks it possible.

I have done this type of correction before using Meguiar's Finesse Sanding Blocks. However the paint I worked on was a "repaint" with lots of clear coat.

Have any of you removed "nibs" like this from factory paint base coat/clear coat? How successful were you? Any suggestions?

Tom :cool:
 
tguil...back in my body shop days we called this fingerfoxing the paint.
(PG version of the term) :)

pick out each dirt nub with your index finger or thumb. the nub will talk back to you, its rather simple & no im not crazy, mb just a little bit!

...she starts out pointy, as you sand down the nub it will change to a circle. a circle on a flat non reflective surface bc the area around it will be lightly sanded. once the circle is gone the dust nub is out & now ready for the surface to be compounded.

that is the easiest way i can explain it to you.
sorry no pics, use your imagination for now. :D

hope that helps!

you can do this with 2,000 or 2,500

:bigups
 
Thanks for the responses. No pics. They wouldn't show up if I take them with my point and shoot camera.

AndrewBigA, you actually made me smile about my problem. Thanks. So you think this will work with factory clear coat/base coat if I am really careful.

Like I said above, I've done this before but only on a repaint...a few times on single stage and only once or twice on a clear coat/base coat finish. Right now I'm a little "ticked" (po'd) about the quality of the paint on this new truck. Oh well, I have to drive on four miles of gravel road to get to the highway. Bet I have a few more "flaws" within a month or two.

Tom :cool:
 
tguil said:
Thanks for the responses. No pics. They wouldn't show up if I take them with my point and shoot camera.

AndrewBigA, you actually made me smile about my problem. Thanks. So you think this will work with factory clear coat/base coat if I am really careful.
Click to expand...

absolutely. do what i explained & once the circle is gone that will tell you the dust nub is gone. if you want to be extra carefull, use 2,500. to soften out the 2,500 soak it in soapy water, then fold it in half & rub the halves together!
kind of like using a half dead 2,500!

think of yourself as luke skywalker & may the force be with you my freind.

:bigups
 
tguil said:
Checking with folks on a couple of my "go to" forums.

I have several minor flaws in the factory paint of my white 2012 Ram...dust flecks/"nibs" in the factory paint. (I really checked the paint out before I took possession of the truck, but did not notice the blems until the first detail.) One option is to leave them alone and just drive the truck. After all it is a truck, right? The other option of course is to attempt to correct them.

The body shop manager at my Dodge dealer said his shop could correct them but could not guarantee the job 100%. (I really don't like this option after my conversation with the manager.) Another option is to have friend of mine who operates a high-end detail shop look them over and correct them if he thinks it possible.

I have done this type of correction before using Meguiar's Finesse Sanding Blocks. However the paint I worked on was a "repaint" with lots of clear coat.

Have any of you removed "nibs" like this from factory paint base coat/clear coat? How successful were you? Any suggestions?

Tom :cool:
Click to expand...

It's always hard to advise somebody on what they should do with their car, because its hard to judge experience level and more importantly, it is hard to judge how much these imperfections will bug you.

The first, and most important question you have to access for yourself is how bad to these dust nibs bug you? In the grand scheme of things are they effecting the joy you have as a newer owner with your truck (that you paid good money for)? If they are not that big of a deal, then I would let it go. If you find they are affecting your ownership experience then it is time to consider repair.

If the nib is under the clear coat (ie the base coat was contaminated) then you are going to sand through the clear as you attempt to remove it. If it is in the clear coat then you will likely be able to fix it, although there is still some risk involved. Again you must personally weigh your risk vs. reward.

I would bring it by your friend who owns the detail shop and let him take a lot at it. He may be able to advise you on what would be needed to correct the problem.

The other option, of course, would be to return the trunk, and say that it fails your standard of build quality. This could be an uphill battle.

Ultimately it comes down to what you feel you can live with.
 
You have a brand new truck and the paint should be corrected to your liking by the dealership. I wold make them stand up to the warrant. If they've admitted to seeing the issue then its their job as a factory rep to correct it.
 
I'll have my "bud" look it over. Yes, I can live with the "nibs" but will probably not buy another Ram. I thought that Chrysler had improved their product in the past couple of years. My 2007 Ram had a better paint job. Go figure.

If the nib appears to be base coat color (white) then I'd actually be removing a speck of clear coat to remove the nib, right? How would this be any different than dealing it a rock chip in the clear. I usually do not clear coat small chip repairs. My vehicles are always well protected with quality wax/sealant.

I most certainly am not going to do any major wet sanding for these nibs, but if wet sanding or even buffing is done in one of these areas will I be going through the clear coat? For example, one of my trucks came off the transport with a very noticeable scratch on the hood and some rough paint in one of the fender panels. I'm quite sure that the panels were either wet sanded or buffed a bunch before delivery (It was a black truck so I noticed the blems right away.) If the same techniques were used on an area with nibs, would the clear be gone in these areas? Most of the nibs are on the hood of the new truck. If for some reason I have to use a compound on the hood, will I be removing the clear where there is a nib? What about the use of clay?

Tom :cool:

p.s. Beemer Boy, I've had "fixes" that turned out worse than the original problem...even at "excellent body shops. Maybe I should "get a life", right? :D

p.p.s. Some of the nibs are not the color of the base coat, would these be safe to remove?
 
tguil said:
I'll have my "bud" look it over. Yes, I can live with the "nibs" but will probably not buy another Ram. I thought that Chrysler had improved their product in the past couple of years. My 2007 Ram had a better paint job. Go figure.

If the nib appears to be base coat color (white) then I'd actually be removing a speck of clear coat to remove the nib, right? How would this be any different than dealing it a rock chip in the clear. I usually do not clear coat small chip repairs. My vehicles are always well protected with quality wax/sealant.

I most certainly am not going to do any major wet sanding for these nibs, but if wet sanding or even buffing is done in one of these areas will I be going through the clear coat? For example, one of my trucks came off the transport with a very noticeable scratch on the hood and some rough paint in one of the fender panels. I'm quite sure that the panels were either wet sanded or buffed a bunch before delivery (It was a black truck so I noticed the blems right away.) If the same techniques were used on an area with nibs, would the clear be gone in these areas? Most of the nibs are on the hood of the new truck. If for some reason I have to use a compound on the hood, will I be removing the clear where there is a nib? What about the use of clay?

Tom :cool:

p.s. Maybe I should "get a life", right? :D
Click to expand...
This is really hard to say with out seeing but having seen this before I dont think buffing is gonna remove the clear unless u go crazy with it. And It would 1-10000000 that clay would work,:wall I'd think trying to hard would just end up marring you paint. If it was me I'd take it your detail buddy. Last time I had to fix this I managed to get 95% of it out safely using 2000/2500/3000 but I was also using a paint depth gauge and have done this a million times. Good Luck with it and let us know how it turns out
 
tguil said:
I'll have my "bud" look it over. Yes, I can live with the "nibs" but will probably not buy another Ram. I thought that Chrysler had improved their product in the past couple of years. My 2007 Ram had a better paint job. Go figure.

If the nib appears to be base coat color (white) then I'd actually be removing a speck of clear coat to remove the nib, right? How would this be any different than dealing it a rock chip in the clear. I usually do not clear coat small chip repairs. My vehicles are always well protected with quality wax/sealant.
Click to expand...

Not necessarily. Dust can be white and is usually VERY SMALL. When the dust settles in the paint (color or clear) the paint can quickly built up around it as it flows a little before it dries. Just because you cannot see it doesn't mean that it is necessary in the base coat of the care.

If it is in the base coat (again its not always possible to tell) then the only way to remove it is going to be to remove the paint (and base/color coat). At this point you will have thinned paint in the area around the nib and a bare spot were the nib was. I would personally rather have a little nib then no paint.

I most certainly am not going to do any major wet sanding for these nibs, but if wet sanding or even buffing is done in one of these areas will I be going through the clear coat? For example, one of my trucks came off the transport with a very noticeable scratch on the hood and some rough paint in one of the fender panels. I'm quite sure that the panels were either wet sanded or buffed a bunch before delivery (It was a black truck so I noticed the blems right away.) If the same techniques were used on an area with nibs, would the clear be gone in these areas? Most of the nibs are on the hood of the new truck. If for some reason I have to use a compound on the hood, will I be removing the clear where there is a nib? What about the use of clay?
Click to expand...

Tom, it is impossible to determine how much clear coat has been removed by the dealer when they 'fixed' your scratches to begin. Proper polishing technique removes trace amounts of clear coat. Aggressive, careless polishing technique removes a considerable amount. So with out knowing how much has been removed, and more importantly, how much remains, its guess work.

One thing to consider with the nib is lightly spot sand the area with a fine grit of paper (2k to 3k), polish it out, and call it a day. Even if the nib is in the base coat, if you file down just a little clear, you can greatly reduce the appearance of it with out drastically altering the finish or compromising its longevity.
 
I'm with Todd on this one. It may very well be very easy to get out and you'll know that right away. If not, then knock the top off the nib with some 3000 grit, polish the paint and be done with it. In the end once the paint is flattened out your going to be the only one that knows it was there.
 
Got-r-done

Got all the nibs leveled...99-100%. I couldn't get Meguiar's Unigrit Sanding Blocks to work as well as I thought they would. It seems that I was working on a lot of surfaces with just a slight curve. I glued small round pieces of 1500 and 2000 Unigrit paper to the ends of new lead pencil erasers. I found that the 1500 grit paper worked the best to knock the nib down. Then I leveled the areas with small rectangular pieces of of Unigrit 2000 paper using a 3/4 inch by 1 inch rubber eraser as a sanding block. The leveled areas buffed out just fine with Ultimate Compound and a four-inch cutting pad on a Porter Cable 7424. No changes in the surrounding surfaces, just the usual Dodge orange peel.

I appreciate the help/suggestions that I got from lots of folks on several forums.

Looking back on it, I should have had the dealer's body shop "make it right". The shop manager talked me out it saying, if they worked on it it could come out worse. Really he probably meant "time is money" and he didn't want to mess with it even though it would have been warranty work. I spent over four hours leveling 34 dust nibs by hand. It would have taken a good tech with the right equipment less than an hour...but then, I'll bet that the guys in the shop aren't anywhere near as "particular" as I am.

Thanks again.

Tom
 
Re: Got-r-done

tguil said:
Looking back on it, I should have had the dealer's body shop "make it right". The shop manager talked me out it saying, if they worked on it it could come out worse.
Click to expand...

I have found that having an average professional do something hardly ever comes out to my standards. This is why Todd and some of the men here on the forum are so refreshing. As is PBMG to me. They seem to adopt your car as though it was their own.

In short, I think you did the right thing by NOT having the dealer do it.
 
Re: Got-r-done

tguil said:
Got all the nibs leveled...99-100%. I couldn't get Meguiar's Unigrit Sanding Blocks to work as well as I thought they would. It seems that I was working on a lot of surfaces with just a slight curve. I glued small round pieces of 1500 and 2000 Unigrit paper to the ends of new lead pencil erasers. I found that the 1500 grit paper worked the best to knock the nib down. Then I leveled the areas with small rectangular pieces of of Unigrit 2000 paper using a 3/4 inch by 1 inch rubber eraser as a sanding block. The leveled areas buffed out just fine with Ultimate Compound and a four-inch cutting pad on a Porter Cable 7424. No changes in the surrounding surfaces, just the usual Dodge orange peel.

I appreciate the help/suggestions that I got from lots of folks on several forums.

Looking back on it, I should have had the dealer's body shop "make it right". The shop manager talked me out it saying, if they worked on it it could come out worse. Really he probably meant "time is money" and he didn't want to mess with it even though it would have been warranty work. I spent over four hours leveling 34 dust nibs by hand. It would have taken a good tech with the right equipment less than an hour...but then, I'll bet that the guys in the shop aren't anywhere near as "particular" as I am.

Thanks again.

Tom
Click to expand...

Tom, excellent news!

I think (even with your 'lack' of experience) you likely did a better job then the trained professionals at the dealer would have done.

We all have different standards of care and expectations. I have found, in my life, I will generally do a better job then professionals at certain tasks. This is because when I take a task on, I become passionate about it. I learn and educate myself on what is needed. I set my standard to 'high' and do it what it takes to get their.

When you deal with professionals, they are approaching it from a different avenue.

In the bodyshop/refinishing industry, their focus is more on a different side of the art: color matching, body repair, spraying paint. Polishing (at least quality polishing) is very much a black art.

Even if they did the best they could, you likely have done a better job. You where lead by passion.

 
It must be something with Chrysler Corp becuase my 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee has more paint blemishes than I've have ever seen on a new car.
 
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