Apply another coat of sealant after another?

OCD_Maniac

OCD_Maniac

New member
Hey everyone,

I want to ask this question because this caught my attention the other day. I heard from some guy that you can apply two coats of sealant, one right after another.

Now, for me usually I would apply one coat of sealant to my, wait 24hours for curing time, and then apply another coat of sealant or carnuba whichever I wish.

I told the guy this is what I usually do but he said it didn't matter and that you can apply another coat, specially just in case you missed a spot. Is this true? Does this person know what he is talking about? I am not doubting him but I am not sure and thats why I am here asking this question, thanks for all of the inputs!!!

OCD_Maniac
 
Depends on the sealer. Most sealers should cure at least 12 hours before applying another coat. If you layer it before it cures, no harm done, but it would be like putting on one thicker coat, not 2 layers. It would also ensure complete coverage if you did happen to miss a spot on the 1st coat.
That being said, I don't know if letting it cure first or waiting for it to cure before layering would make a difference in glossness, slickness, or durability.
 
OCD_Maniac said:
Hey everyone,

I want to ask this question because this caught my attention the other day. I heard from some guy that you can apply two coats of sealant, one right after another.

Now, for me usually I would apply one coat of sealant to my, wait 24hours for curing time, and then apply another coat of sealant or carnuba whichever I wish.

I told the guy this is what I usually do but he said it didn't matter and that you can apply another coat, specially just in case you missed a spot. Is this true? Does this person know what he is talking about? I am not doubting him but I am not sure and thats why I am here asking this question, thanks for all of the inputs!!!

OCD_Maniac
Click to expand...
YOUR FRIEND IS WRONG :passout:
 
Sure you CAN apply one coat right after another. You can also wipe your butt before pooping. You can duck after you get hit with a baseball. You can also answer the phone before it rings. The question is, why would you want to? If the product requires 12 to 24 hours to cure depending on climate, then why would you want to put another layer on right away? If the effect is that the two layers blend into one and add zero value in durability or appearance, then why would you do it? It is because people are layer happy and think that more is better of everything. The truth is that instructions are written for a reason and a shortcut isn't necessarily a better process.

And what is this about missing a spot? So, in case you are sloppy the first time you should take twice as long to do the job and put a second coat on? How about this... Suggest to your friend that he spend a little more time doing it right the first time and then he won't have to worry about using a second coat to get what he missed. Besides, who misses spots when they are applying a sealant? I've never detailed a car and then looked at it later saying "whoops... missed a spot. Was that fender always there?" lol

I've read a lot about these so called 'processes' over the past few years. "Wipe the sealant off as soon as you apply it and don't bother waiting for it to dry." "Use tire shine in your engine bay to make the plastic black." "Clay your car while you wash it to save time." These are all just short cuts that defeat the purpose of detailing. Detailing isn't about finding the fastest way to do something. It is about finding the right way to do it.
 
Thanks Jingerbreadman, thought so.

Like I told him, I would usually apply one layer and then wait a 24hour period curing so that the sealant can bond to the paint right? Afterwards, I would apply another sealant layer or proceed to carnuba.

OCD_Maniac
 
Thanks for the caps-lock writing black bart but he is not my friend. So I guess I am right then?

No matter what sealant I use, 4star, Poorboys EXP, Wolfgang Deep Gloss, or even Meg's NXT, I would WAIT 24HRS BEFORE I APPLY ANOTHER COAT.

OCD_Maniac
 
OCD_Maniac said:
Thanks Jingerbreadman, thought so.

Like I told him, I would usually apply one layer and then wait a 24hour period curing so that the sealant can bond to the paint right? Afterwards, I would apply another sealant layer or proceed to carnuba.

OCD_Maniac
Click to expand...


Exactly. If this guy isn't waiting for the sealant to cure then he obviously doesn't know much about sealants. He is treating it just like a wax and that doesn't work. We are talking about the difference between a Sharpie and an Expo marker here. You have to respect the differences if you are going to use them.
 
I will do a second application in the same day to ensure equal coverage. I don't see anything wrong with that. Nothing wrong with being thorough. A lot of times, you're not going to have a customer's vehicle long enough to wait for the "cure time" to apply a second coat of whatever it is you're using.

Didn't know it was such a touchy subject.
 
The touchy part is when people pass off a half-arsed shortcut as the latest and greatest technique. If you don't have access to the vehicle long enough to be able to add a second coat, then I guess they will have to do with one coat. I've gone back to provide a second and third coat for customers. They are fine with it being done right. If 12 hours cure time is what it requires, then that is what it requires. What is the rush to get as many coats on as possible anyway? Would you want someone coming in to build you a house who only had an interest in doing it as fast as possible with no attention to proper process? A lot of the newer neighborhoods are finding that companies who were willing to pour their driveways in the rain were not doing them any favors by doing so. I'd rather have someone tell me I have to wait and get the job done right. Sealants are not like waxes and they need their dry time. It is no different than any other metaphor relating to cure times that you want to draw. I'm not saying anything that people here don't already know anyway, but it is just a sensitive subject for me personally. I spend waaaaaay too much time fielding questions from people who have been told this or that and they have questions about the validity of the processes. There are a lot of people out there passing out really poor information based on little to no experience or research or even understanding, and it just irks me a bit. I'm not trying to be offensive with my passion for this, but I definitely do have buttons that people can press if they want to get to me. This is one of them. lol
 
While I am generally in agreement with the cure time what possible harm could a second coat done sooner cause? In spite of "pushing your buttons" I honestly don't understand the negatives of doing this other than your strong feelings not to.
 
Jngrbrdman said:
The touchy part is when people pass off a half-arsed shortcut as the latest and greatest technique. If you don't have access to the vehicle long enough to be able to add a second coat, then I guess they will have to do with one coat. I've gone back to provide a second and third coat for customers. They are fine with it being done right. If 12 hours cure time is what it requires, then that is what it requires. What is the rush to get as many coats on as possible anyway? Would you want someone coming in to build you a house who only had an interest in doing it as fast as possible with no attention to proper process? A lot of the newer neighborhoods are finding that companies who were willing to pour their driveways in the rain were not doing them any favors by doing so. I'd rather have someone tell me I have to wait and get the job done right. Sealants are not like waxes and they need their dry time. It is no different than any other metaphor relating to cure times that you want to draw. I'm not saying anything that people here don't already know anyway, but it is just a sensitive subject for me personally. I spend waaaaaay too much time fielding questions from people who have been told this or that and they have questions about the validity of the processes. There are a lot of people out there passing out really poor information based on little to no experience or research or even understanding, and it just irks me a bit. I'm not trying to be offensive with my passion for this, but I definitely do have buttons that people can press if they want to get to me. This is one of them. lol
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If you want my honest evaluation of the original question, I didn't see anywhere where it had anything to do with it "getting it done as quickly as possible." Actually, I think it would show diligence to apply a second coat to ensure complete and total coverage - especially if you only have the customer vehicle for one afternoon. Nowhere in doing that do I see someone trying to half-ass it.

In detailing, like almost every other activity in the world, there is more than one way to do things. Just because someone doesn't do it the way I see fit doesn't always mean it's wrong. I know plenty of people on DC who have advocated applying a second coat on the same day for the same reasons I sometimes do it. I am extremely glad that there are some of us on here who never, ever make mistakes, but for the rest of us just because we screw up once or twice or miss a spot every now and again definitely does not mean we are sloppy.
 
I strongly doubt that many people are willing to take the time and waste the product to do a second coat just so they don't miss a spot. What I usually hear is that they want the durability and shine of a second coat. Klasse SG looks better and better with multiple coats. Wolfgang and UPP also look better and better. People that ask me this question are catagorically looking for a way to get the results of three coats in one day because they don't have the patience to wait for it to cure. It isn't because they are ensuring proper coverage. How hard is it to wax a car without missing a spot anyway? How about you walk around and make sure you have total coverage before you buff the product off. It should be pretty clear where you have missed when the product is all hazed. I just don't buy the reason that they do it so they don't miss a spot.

I have talked to more than one person who makes this stuff. I've had long conversations with Dwayne about it while he was working shoulder to shoulder with the chemists at Four Star who make it. Sealants require a cure time for maximum bonding and appearance results. If you put on a second coat before the first one has cured then you will not get the durability or appearance that you are looking for. I can't remember who I talked to about this idea, but it was presented that the second layer would just blend with the first one until bonding occurs and would just yield one layer. I'm not spreading that as fact until I hear it from the horse's mouth, but maybe Troy can confirm that with Rick or someone out at Four Star?
 
Jngrbrdman said:
I strongly doubt that many people are willing to take the time and waste the product to do a second coat just so they don't miss a spot.
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:howdy :redface: Me.
I don't do it just so I don't miss a spot, but I really don't expect to get any great benefit from so called additional layers, either.
My additional applications are the same product applied at a later date. It might be a day, it might be a month.

I do feel it is better to let any LSP cure before applying more product. That includes waxes as well as sealants.
Zaino with ZFX might be the exception, but since I don't use the product, I don't really know.
 
Well, I never said anything about applying a second coat in the same day for durability and/or looks. Neither did the OP in his question. I don't disagree that there is a "cure time" for the sealant to set up.

You state that it's a waste to do a second coat to ensure complete coverage, yet in the same breath talk about people who half-ass the job. I just happen to disagree with your line of thinking on that issue. It takes, what, like 10 minutes to apply LSP? That's not too big a waste in my opinion if it makes you feel better about the job you're doing.

I don't want to sit around and argue with you, but you seem to have a very argumentative attitude lots of times towards people who don't agree with you. I think you are very knowledgeable, so don't get me wrong.

As far as your statement of how hard it is to miss a spot - I think it's very easy to do,especially for someone who does this sort of thing on the side. Maybe they've polished for four or five hours, and then applied an LSP by hand. Fatigue can contribute to missing a spot. Like I said, I am glad you never miss a spot or make a mistake when detailing, but don't tell the rest of us who want to be thorough and picky that we're sloppy because we feel the need to apply a second coat in the event we did miss something. That's the essence of a hobbyist or enthusiast.
 
I didn't say that nobody puts a second coat on just to be thorough. I said that I doubted that many people did that. If someone just spent five or six hours detailing their car and are tired enough that they missed a spot, they probably aren't going to have the energy to put a second coat on. In fact, that is the situation that is perfect for putting a second coat on after the 12 hour cure time.

If anyone feels that what I said was being argumentitive then that is something I can't control. I never said that I don't make mistakes. I do advocate following the directions from the chemist when it comes to certian products and I am against the proliferation of short cuts as best practices. Sealants need cure time before any other layers are put on. The product doesn't care if you are being thorough with a second coat or if you are trying to short cut the cure time. If you miss a spot with a sealant then you should look around the car for them before you buff the product off so that you don't impact the cure time. Everybody misses spots, but that is what second and third coats are for. You really aren't going to be able to tell if one spot has two coats and another has three. Your paint isn't going to notice either I'd wager.

So anyway, I'm not trying to be argumentitive here. If someone has a problem with how I write, then I'm sorry for that. I'm only trying to help, but it seems that there are always individuals who are going to take offense where none is intended. My goal isn't to go around offending people, but anyone who knows me knows that I don't sugar coat my opinions or feelings. If someone stands opposite of one of my opinions then join the club. We are all operating under different schools of thoughts about detailing. As Aristotle said, "It is the mark of an educated mind to entertain a thought without accepting it." If the process is contrary to the recomended use from the manufactuer then you can bet I'll call you on it. If it is just a matter of opinion for how it is used, then I might ask questions or share my thoughts, but I respect the processes of others as long as they aren't going against the way things are supposed to be. Messing with a sealant layer before it is cured is one of those things. If it was wax we were talking about then I wouldn't have said anything since it doesn't matter as much. Sealants are a different thing though. I wish some product gurus would pipe up here and tell me to shut up if I'm wrong about this. I don't like feeling like I have to defend what I presumed was an understood fact about a product.
 
Since the curing time for sealants is anywhere from 12-72 hours, then adding a second coat to make sure coverage is complete can not be a bad thing. Yes it would really be making one thicker coat, not two coats as the sealant has not really set itself up yet, but I believe that two overlapping coats are better than one, especially if you are doing a customer's car and you won't be able to add a second coat after the first is fully cured ...:cheers:
 
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