Anyone been in this situation before?

P

Petrucci_M3

New member
Ok,



Here's the deal I have a prospective detail coming up this weekend but the thing is:



-The owner wants me to use all their products instead of mine to do this detail.

-He wants me to make 3 trips to his home during this detail.

-He estimates the paint correction to be anywhere from 12 to 16 hours of labor.

-Only wants the paint, no interior, etc.



So basically I'm asking is what do I charge this prospective client and what issues as far as not producing the same results using another line of products. I'm a Menzerna buff using SIP/106ff, where I believe he said they are all Poor Boy products, that I'll be using.



Do I charge my normal price to do a 2 step paint correction or do I lower the price to compensate that I'm only bringing my UDM and pads?



I told him I can not guarantee the same results as my previous details since I'm not using Menzerna and such.



What would you guys do?



Thanks.
 
Wow - interesting. In this case I'd be inclined to charge an hourly rate, including travel time for the extra trips.



I'm curious - does he usually do his own work but has a health issue or something?



Good luck...I'll be interested to hear how this one goes.
 
I would give him an hourly rate so (1) you don't waste your time on products you're not familiar with and (2) he's content knowing that his products are being used on his vehicle.
 
It may have something to do with the way he normally does his vehicle. I don't like to see clients with tons of requests. It makes me think that no matter how perfect the job will be, they won't be satisfied.
 
I would walk away. You are the expert and it is up to you to tell him what you are going to use to make his paint perfect. He is bringing you in as the expert, otherwise he would do it himself. Why would somebody who can't do it himself be telling you how to do your job. I wouldn't go to a doctor and tell him what medicine to use on me. I would expect the doctor to hear my concerns, assuage my feelings and take them into consideration, then as the expert prescribe the proper treatment.



Does this make sense?



If he has the experience to estimate how much time it is going to take you, then why isn't he doing himself.



If you deciede to go through with this, tell him you do not guaranette the results with his products as you often have to change combinations to custom fit your process to the paint and its needs. Charge him by the hour (and no less then 50, IMO) and to car will deterime how much time you need.



If he wants to work with in a budge (say 300 dollars at 50/hr) then give him the best you can in 6 hours, with out doing extra's.
 
I vote hourly also, but if it we're me, I wouldn't do his cars if I don't use my own tools/products.
 
If you are posting on the professional forum, I assume you are set up as a business, and are possibly insured. I would tell him for liability reasons, I only felt comfortable using the products and techniques that I had experience with from my own arsenal - I would go on to tell him that I don't like to experiment on customers cars, and that's essentially what he would have you doing using products you aren't familiar with. I would also tell him that I charge by the hour, and will be much more efficient using products I am use to.



If he still insists, I would move on to the next customer. This guy has already raised too many red flags, in my opinion, that lead me to believe he will be more trouble than he is worth. I think you could do a killer job on the car with your own products, and he will still probably badmouth you to other people and say things like, "He did a good job, but not as good as if he had used my products."
 
I had a cutomer do this one time, request me to you their products. And he pulled the bottle out and it was Mothers Hot Wheels edition wax.lol
 
I forgot to mention he would do it himself, but he has a back problem and thats why he was inclined to ask someone else to do this.





DaGonz said:
I don't understand the three trips to his house thing....
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Apparently, he wants me to come to his and wash the car with him, clay bar with him, and mask the tape off. I don't understand why I would do this if he were going to be doing this with me?



He doesn't let anyone but himself wash the car, no dealer, etc. So this may explain that.



The second trip will be the polishing part, and then applying his sealant on and letting it sit for overnight. I would then come back and buff it off and apply his wax lol.



Holden_C04 said:
It may have something to do with the way he normally does his vehicle. I don't like to see clients with tons of requests. It makes me think that no matter how perfect the job will be, they won't be satisfied.
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I explained this too him, he's not expecting miracles but as someone said my reputation is on the line as well. I'm a perfectionist and if I can't deliver the best I can physically do then I feel I have failed my job. He told me its rather "mostly a maintenance thing that's just due" rather than a full restoration.



TH0001 said:
I would walk away. You are the expert and it is up to you to tell him what you are going to use to make his paint perfect. He is bringing you in as the expert, otherwise he would do it himself. Why would somebody who can't do it himself be telling you how to do your job. I wouldn't go to a doctor and tell him what medicine to use on me. I would expect the doctor to hear my concerns, assuage my feelings and take them into consideration, then as the expert prescribe the proper treatment.



Does this make sense?



If he has the experience to estimate how much time it is going to take you, then why isn't he doing himself.



If you deciede to go through with this, tell him you do not guaranette the results with his products as you often have to change combinations to custom fit your process to the paint and its needs. Charge him by the hour (and no less then 50, IMO) and to car will deterime how much time you need.



If he wants to work with in a budge (say 300 dollars at 50/hr) then give him the best you can in 6 hours, with out doing extra's.
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I appreciate your response Todd. That's exactly how I was thinking.



2002 Z06 said:
I vote for hourly rate also
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JonP said:
I vote hourly also, but if it we're me, I wouldn't do his cars if I don't use my own tools/products.
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weekendwarrior said:
If you are posting on the professional forum, I assume you are set up as a business, and are possibly insured. I would tell him for liability reasons, I only felt comfortable using the products and techniques that I had experience with from my own arsenal - I would go on to tell him that I don't like to experiment on customers cars, and that's essentially what he would have you doing using products you aren't familiar with. I would also tell him that I charge by the hour, and will be much more efficient using products I am use to.



If he still insists, I would move on to the next customer. This guy has already raised too many red flags, in my opinion, that lead me to believe he will be more trouble than he is worth. I think you could do a killer job on the car with your own products, and he will still probably badmouth you to other people and say things like, "He did a good job, but not as good as if he had used my products."
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Actually the exact opposite, I do this as a hobby, and didn't know where to post this question at. I appreciate all the responses on this forum and value each opinion on here. All these different variables are making me fell pretty uncomfortable.



I'm actually going to see his car Thursday night at a meet and I'll examine what needs to be done, if its a long shot, I'm going to bail and not waste my time.



Thanks again for the responses guys :)
 
I wouldn't mind using his products if I had used them before. If I hadn't used them then I wouldn't agree to because you don't know what to expect and they may not be best suited to the job. I don't mind if someone has an LSP they want specifically, but I'd advise against his stuff for correcting unless it is unaltered and you are familiar with it. I would take plenty of before and afters and discuss expectations extensively before beginning. Remember to always CYA.
 
Sounds like you've already taken a lot of the advice to heart, but I'll throw my 2 cents in as well. I own and run several businesses currently, and have had many others in the past. Anytime a customer wants to tell you how to do your job and what to use, run away as fast as possible. They likely won't be happy with anything you do, and if you think their demands at first are bad, wait until you get in the middle of the job. Then they know they've got you at the point of no return, and it just gets worse.



If anyone wants to tell me exactly what to do on a job, then they can pay me hourly as an employee, which means they can also pay my insurance, withhold taxes, provide worker's comp insurance in case I get hurt as their employee, etc. If not, then I'm not going to be their employee and work with them standing over my shoulder barking orders. Actually, I won't do it regardless, but you get the point.
 
what about doing a side by side comparison and showing him what results your products will produce, and what his will produce...at the same time you can estimate how long the detail will actually take...



12-16 hours sounds more like a reconditioning rather than a maintenance detail by the way
 
I've got a little bit different answer than most. I've been in business for years and years but not detail biz, so take that into consideration. I suggest that after you get a good look at his vehicle and his products that you propose a compromise. Use some of his products, ones that you don't feel you're taking as much a risk with, along with some of your own you're more confident in. That way he feels he's contributing and you don't go in completely blind. Some customers just got in their mind they want things done a certain way. But make sure you get covered for your trouble a minumum $50 per hour (or even more) as has been stated. And don't subtract anything for using some of his products rather than your own.



Through the years I've had customers with idiosyncrosis and they're not all necessarily going to jerk you around. Some even offer more money because they realize they're making you go the extra mile.
 
jayjacque said:
I've got a little bit different answer than most. I've been in business for years and years but not detail biz, so take that into consideration. I suggest that after you get a good look at his vehicle and his products that you propose a compromise. Use some of his products, ones that you don't feel you're taking as much a risk with, along with some of your own you're more confident in. That way he feels he's contributing and you don't go in completely blind. Some customers just got in their mind they want things done a certain way. But make sure you get covered for your trouble a minumum $50 per hour (or even more) as has been stated. And don't subtract anything for using some of his products rather than your own.



Through the years I've had customers with idiosyncrosis and they're not all necessarily going to jerk you around. Some even offer more money because they realize they're making you go the extra mile.
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This is a bit of an off topic post but, jayjacque...I would be a little iffy about hiring a knife-wielding chucky with the slogan "You WILL like my work". :chuckle:
 
Holden_C04 said:
This is a bit of an off topic post but, jayjacque...I would be a little iffy about hiring a knife-wielding chucky with the slogan "You WILL like my work". :chuckle:
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Possible responses:



I'm not a monster. I'm just a cute little doll.



No, that's not a knife in my hand, it's a wash bucket.



Aw now you hurt my feelings :cry: You're gonna pay!



Hmm, maybe that's why I haven't been getting too many responses from my business cards and flyers.
 
I find this topic interesting as I've often wondered what I'd do if I were somehow unable to detail our vehicles :think:



I dunno...correcting paint is something you don't want botched up and I wouldn't want somebody learning on *my* vehicle; so telling somebody to use unfamiliar abrasive products sounds risky. But if somebody said there were gonna correct my S8 with something I'd never heard of (or had a low opinion of), I'd sure think twice about letting them do it.



So I can see this from both sides...but it's not like Menzerna is some snake oil product. I don't use it, but if somebody who's familiar with it wanted to use it on my vehicles I wouldn't really have a good argument why they oughta use my beloved 3M/1Z stuff instead and I'd be forcing them to ride a whole new learning curve- on *my* paint.



When ebpcivicsi did my Denali XL (long story why), he used compounds and polishes that I don't use (Meg's and Menzerna). OK by me for the above reasons. I did have him do a 845/476S LSP job, and he ended up loving the stuff and adding it to his arsenal. So he and I were able to find a middle ground that worked out for both of us. If the pro and the (opinionated/knowledgeable) customer can't come to an agreement like that, it wouldn't surprise me if one or both ended up unhappy.
 
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